Trouble in paradise?

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The Business Journal of Milwaukee reports that:

Harley-Davidson profit drops 72 percent. Higher restructuring costs and losses from discontinued operations contributed to a 72 percent drop in net income for Harley-Davidson Inc. in the first quarter of 2010.

- The Business Journal of Milwaukee

I hope they are able to "weather" this downturn and won't need a government bailout - Could it be time for some new, updated products?

Comments?
 
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Being a luxury item they're always going to swing with the economy moreso than other transportation companies.

Bailout, no. Do they need some new products? They've been doing pretty good, the Vrod was new just a few years ago. I liked this, new here in 09. But no amount of new products will spur the sales of a luxury item in a down economy.

Harley-Davidson+2009+Sportster+XR1200.jpg
 
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Originally Posted By: bepperb
Being a luxury item they're always going to swing with the economy moreso than other transportation companies.

Bailout, no. Do they need some new products? They've been doing pretty good, the Vrod was new just a few years ago. I liked this, new here in 09. But no amount of new products will spur the sales of a luxury item in a down economy.



Cool bike, no doubt, but still over-weight and under-powered. Many of us are still waiting for a "true" HD sportbike now that Buell is no more.
 
HD really does not have to worry about a "sport" bike. Their market is where it is without a "sport" bike.

With the down economy that will be getting worst it will be interesting to see how they handle it. A lot of areas are getting hammered (boats, air craft for example) and it will be getting worst for them.

People don't NEED expensive motorcycles. The local HD dealership here went bankrupt last year as did 2 other dealerships that sell Kawasaki/Honda/Yamaha/Suzuki's.

Back in the 70s/early 80s I sold Suzuki/Kawasaki and IMO that was the time for those bikes. But in the early 80's we went weeks without selling a thing.

Same thing is happening now.

Bill
 
Bill, where in Utah do you live?

We dirtbike up there by Hanksville (Skanksville) and Moab every year. We also go to the Miller Motorsports Superbike races every May. Love Utah riding.
 
Provo down in Utah County. 40 miles south of SLC.

We do Moab a few times a year. The kids like to hike around.

Miller did build a nice place. Wish it had a world class drag strip. Maybe someday.

We do have some nice places to ride 6 months a year!
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And in the south 10 months.

Take care, Bill
 
We are
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Originally Posted By: Zedhed
Hwy 12 in SW Utah is awesome riding, I live for that road...
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Prior to this recent economic set back, Harley had been doing quite well.

While many boomers were basking in what they thought was their financial success, they felt it was time to reward themselves for their hard work and try to relive some of their youth by buying a motorcycle. As we all know, the motorcycle that seemed to attract the born again or wannabe bikers was Harley Davidson. Accordingly, sales were quite robust for Harley during that period.

As with many vehicle manufacturers, Harley Davidson had created it's own financial department that would "assist" would be Harley customers with finance to buy their motorcycle of choice. Not a bad idea if the customer holds up their end of the deal.

The main difference between financing a motorcycle and a car is that with automobile financing, the customer will not default as readily for something that's necessary to them such as their car or pickup. The chink in Harley's plan is that motorcycles aren't essential. They're a luxury. When push comes to shove and something has to go, it will be the luxuries first.

When the big economic crisis hit in late 2007, things began to unravel. By 2008, the full impact of the economic problems began to effect people on a personal level. Much of the perceived wealth that many thought they had, fizzled away overnight. Many of Harley Davidson's financial departments loans went sour as customers defaulted on their commitments. Many of these loans were for the full price of the bike. No money down. Just sign here. Anything to get another bike out the door. Risky business indeed.

It would appear that HD may not have performed a worst case scenario risk assessment when they set up their financial department. If they had, it should have been abundantly clear that a serious financial crisis would have very harsh effects on HD's financial well being. Combine that with loose lending practices, the consequences would be substantial in a worst case situation.

As if that wasn't bad enough, as more and more loans defaulted and more and more Harleys were repossessed, the market became flooded with thousands upon thousands of very lightly used almost new Harleys. With a surplus of very good deals to be had on so many late model used bikes, production would now be compromised due to the fallout from the financial department's failures. When there are literally thousands of almost new late model bikes being sold for upwards of ten thousand dollars less than a new bike, sales will and did suffer. According, loss of sales directly impacts production. As we can see from this latest news release, the problem would appear to still exist.

I see some real tough times ahead for Harley Davidson. Not just the immediate crisis but in five to ten years from now. Their customer base is drying up. It's primarily boomers and bad boy wannabe bikers that are Harley's bread and butter. When the boomers are done, there won't be enough "bad boys" to keep them afloat.

Many of the next generation of motorcyclist are unlikely to have any nostalgia nor desire for that type of bike. Harley's reluctance to change with the times will, sooner or later, be their undoing. If Harley had been more innovative over the years as was BMW, they'd have a greater opportunity to draw in a wider market.

As it is, the future would not appear too bright for the company. Who knows? Maybe this will act as a wake up call for HD? Seeing how Buell was flushed down the toilet in order to perpetuate the status quo, I doubt that it will be.
 
Harley Davidson's have been price inflated since the early 90's. There was a fundamental problem in the Harley market backfrom the mid to late 90's being that you could sell a new Harley for more $$$$$ than you have to pay for one at the dealer. That is a messed up market and the bubble has to pop.
 
Originally Posted By: bepperb
Being a luxury item they're always going to swing with the economy moreso than other transportation companies.

Bailout, no. Do they need some new products? They've been doing pretty good, the Vrod was new just a few years ago. I liked this, new here in 09. But no amount of new products will spur the sales of a luxury item in a down economy.

Harley-Davidson+2009+Sportster+XR1200.jpg

I am not sure of when Harley produced A Cafe Racer bike Late 70's to mid 80;s but it looked great . This bike looks nice.
 
"I am not sure of when Harley produced A Cafe Racer bike Late 70's to mid 80;s but it looked great."

Harley%20XLCR%201000%20Caf%C3%A9%20Racer.jpg

I have to agree. The XLCR-1000 and the XR750 are two excellent examples of what Harley could be if they wanted to be.
 
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Originally Posted By: boraticus
"I am not sure of when Harley produced A Cafe Racer bike Late 70's to mid 80;s but it looked great."


I have to agree. The XLCR-1000 and the XR750 are two excellent examples of what Harley could be if they wanted to be.


Yeah, the XLCR "looked" great, but it was still an AMF (Adios My Friend?) Shovelhead and that is why it didn't appeal to the Asian or European bike riders. Notoriously, bad craftsmanship, handling, and reliability.

The new XR1000 looks to be much better on both points and more desirable.
 
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Not to mention the XLCR had about the same HP as a 550 CC Japanese bike so it was not nearly as fast as the larger metric bikes as well with its low power shovelhead.

It would be cool to find one and shoehorn a modern evolution motor in.
 
Originally Posted By: Robenstein
Not to mention the XLCR had about the same HP as a 550 CC Japanese bike so it was not nearly as fast as the larger metric bikes as well with its low power shovelhead.

It would be cool to find one and shoehorn a modern evolution motor in.


The XLCRs are highly prized and collectable because they didn't sell well and now are very rare. They are very cool looking and I have to agree, one with an EVO or TC engine would be awesome.

I wonder if anyone is making repro's of the XLCR?
 
All motorcycle manufacturers are hurting right now. Motorcycles in general are pretty much viewed as a luxury item (not a necessity) and sales will continue to be slow until our economy turns around. On the flip side, some good deals can be had right now for those who have the money....
 
If HD goes under the air-cooled v-twin culture will continue. We still won't want race bikes. We still won't wear ATGATT. We will still have loud pipes. We will still hold rallies and runs and bike nights. You will still hate us. We still won't care.
 
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Originally Posted By: grampi
All motorcycle manufacturers are hurting right now. Motorcycles in general are pretty much viewed as a luxury item (not a necessity) and sales will continue to be slow until our economy turns around. On the flip side, some good deals can be had right now for those who have the money....


With the price of gas creeping up again, the smaller bikes are selling like hotcakes around here. Anything from 50cc up to 600cc especially. Local Kawasaki dealers are having Ninja 250 and 500 bikes fly out the door.
 
Originally Posted By: Zedhed
Originally Posted By: boraticus
"I am not sure of when Harley produced A Cafe Racer bike Late 70's to mid 80;s but it looked great."


I have to agree. The XLCR-1000 and the XR750 are two excellent examples of what Harley could be if they wanted to be.


Yeah, the XLCR "looked" great, but it was still an AMF (Adios My Friend?) Shovelhead and that is why it didn't appeal to the Asian or European bike riders. Notoriously, bad craftsmanship, handling, and reliability.

The new XR1000 looks to be much better on both points and more desirable.



Actually it was an IRONHEAD. Not that far from a Shovel, however.
 
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