Why I hate most HF tools

[sciphi]

Originally Posted By: ajchien
Originally Posted By: sciphi
Some HF stuff is great. Other stuff isn't worth the materials used in it.

Caveat emptor.


I do like HF for the prices.

Unfortunately, sometimes you can't tell what is good or bad until you already have it home and are using it for the second time....

I think I've returned more HF stuff than I've returned stuff from any other store.


I've definitely seen something nifty on their site, walked into the store, took a look at it, and decided it was too junky to consider, no matter how low the price. Other stuff I've bought, used, used some more, and determined it's a steal for the price. And then there's the stuff that's in between those extremes.

Caveat emptor.

 

[Techniker]

Originally Posted By: dparm
The Chinese can build high-quality if they want. Look at Apple computers -- made in China. Excellent build quality. Americans just want stuff dirt-cheap and as a result they find ways to cut costs.


Ah, someone doesn't know computers then...

 

[Spazdog]

Originally Posted By: Errtt
I have replaced the motorcycle carry-on tools with HF tools. Should the tool bag get stolen from the bike, it will be less of a hit value wise, and won't be a big impact replacing them. I have been using those tools working on the bikes and so far they have all got the job done.


Shoot...that's an upgrade.

The tools that have come with my bikes have been made out of case hardened Velveeta.

My first street bike (Honda CB125) had a little canister to hold said cheesy tools. At some point, the canister spontaneously opened and dropped them on Interstate 30. I wasn't too broken up about it. Wish they had Harbor Freight tools in the early 80's to replace them. I had to pay too much for Western Auto "Wizard" branded replacements....made doubly sure the canister was closed after that.

 

[Errtt]

Originally Posted By: Spazdog
Originally Posted By: Errtt
I have replaced the motorcycle carry-on tools with HF tools. Should the tool bag get stolen from the bike, it will be less of a hit value wise, and won't be a big impact replacing them. I have been using those tools working on the bikes and so far they have all got the job done.


Shoot...that's an upgrade.

The tools that have come with my bikes have been made out of case hardened Velveeta.

My first street bike (Honda CB125) had a little canister to hold said cheesy tools. At some point, the canister spontaneously opened and dropped them on Interstate 30. I wasn't too broken up about it. Wish they had Harbor Freight tools in the early 80's to replace them. I had to pay too much for Western Auto "Wizard" branded replacements....made doubly sure the canister was closed after that.


None of my bikes came with tools, so I had mostly Craftsman and some Snap-On tools on board. The wife's bike was supposed to come with a few of their junk tools but there was none. And I bought her bike new off the dealer floor.

So what I meant was the tools I placed on board myself from the start. Just this fall/winter I replaced the on board bike tools with mostly HF. I kept some off the stuff as was (i.e. craftsman hex wrenches, Torx etc.). I mainly replaced the Ratchets, wrenches, sockets, extensions, wire cutter/crimper, and I'm sure a few more things that don't come to mind at the moment.

Times like when we stop to eat, I wonder about the tool bags since they are easy access. Also, I have stopped to lend a hand for other bikers and never know if I leave a tool behind in the dark. The one bike I don't worry much is the Electric Glide Classic which has lockable hard saddles. Something like the Sportster has the leather tool bag low on the down-tubes and it pops open easily. The wife's bike has a lockable compartment but it is to small for what I carry/pack on bikes. So the saddle has a couple rolls of tools. They would probably take my CO2 air kits too.

 

[Greggy_D]

Originally Posted By: JustinH
What did you expect out of a harbor freight tool? I think one word describes everything in that store "disposable".



This is simply not true. Some HF tools are VERY well made and will last near forever. Depends on the particular tool.

 

[Steve S]

Most all of the tools are worth what you pay for them.

 

[jcwit]

Originally Posted By: Steve S
Most all of the tools are worth what you pay for them.


Then again there times one gets extra value for dollars spent.

Also there are those who do not require the most expensive tools to get the job done.

Few of us require a Rolls as most drive a Ford or Chevy or toyota.

 

[GeorgiaHybrid]

Originally Posted By: jcwit
Originally Posted By: Steve S
Most all of the tools are worth what you pay for them.


Then again there times one gets extra value for dollars spent.

Also there are those who do not require the most expensive tools to get the job done.

Few of us require a Rolls as most drive a Ford or Chevy or toyota.


But you have to admit, most of their tools are Yugo's......

 

[Ironduke4]

I have that exact same ball joint remover this one is made in taiwan i have used it many times and it works great.
I just hand tighten it on the joint and then hit it with the impact wrench and it pops the ball joint or tie rod end stud right out.
I think you just got a bad one HF stuff is hit or miss some times just take it back and get another one.

 

[Chris142]

I was wandering around HF tonight and it looks like they have a new socket supplier. All the sockets are from Taiwan now and they looked well made.

 

[onion]

Depends on the tool and what you're doing with it.

For stuff that I use daily, I generally want something of at least Craftsman quality (it's nothing to brag about... but it's ok as a minimum requirement). That would include snap-on, mac, matco, cornwell, sk, wright, proto, armstrong, gray pneumatic... probably a few others like Allen, IR, channel-lock, etc.

But there are tools that I need to have at work, but I might only use a few times a year. In those cases, I have no problem with a China tool if it's reasonably cheap and does the job. I have a set of BIG angle wrenches- from 1 3/8" to 2". Cost me $65 about ten years ago. I only use them once in a while, but they've always done the job. A similar set in a better brand could easily cost hundreds of dollars.

But cheap does not necessarily mean poor quality. I have some 1/2" drive deep impact sockets- don't know where they were made; they just say "chome vanadium" on the side. I bought them at walmart when I was 18 and needed a few tools for my new high-paying job ($8/hour- by far the most $$ I'd ever made). Well, after 16 years of HARD and regular use, they're still in my toolbox... I've never managed to break one. Even with my 1000 ft-lb IR impact (the likes of which didn't EXIST when these sockets were made). Whereas I've broken more craftsman and mac sockets (both chrome and impact) than I could possibly recall.

I have a fairly nice multimeter (clamp-on meter... nice for checking starter & alternator current). But I hardly ever get it out anymore- I prefer to use my $3 Harbor Freight multimeter. For voltage and resistance checks (which is 95% of what I do), it works just as well as any Fluke meter. And if I run over it (which I did once with a previous meter)... I just don't care. If I have to check frequency, current above 10A, or if I just don't trust a particular reading- then I get out my 'good' multimeter.

And I bought this little butane torch from harbor freight. Cost me $7. Works great for soldering and heat-shrink tubing. A similar torch from snap-on or the like would easily be $30. This one has worked great for a couple years. I dropped it the other day and broke the clicker... but I don't care. I just light it with a lighter. Next time I'm at HF I'll drop another $7 and get a new one.

 

[jcwit]

Originally Posted By: GeorgiaHybrid
Originally Posted By: jcwit
Originally Posted By: Steve S
Most all of the tools are worth what you pay for them.


Then again there times one gets extra value for dollars spent.

Also there are those who do not require the most expensive tools to get the job done.

Few of us require a Rolls as most drive a Ford or Chevy or toyota.


But you have to admit, most of their tools are Yugo's......


Wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yugo's went into history because of poor quality, even with the low price.

Harbor Freight has done nothing but grow.

Show me another American tool merchandiser that has grown like Harbor Freight in the last 10 years.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: jcwit
Originally Posted By: GeorgiaHybrid
Originally Posted By: jcwit
Originally Posted By: Steve S
Most all of the tools are worth what you pay for them.


Then again there times one gets extra value for dollars spent.

Also there are those who do not require the most expensive tools to get the job done.

Few of us require a Rolls as most drive a Ford or Chevy or toyota.


But you have to admit, most of their tools are Yugo's......


Wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yugo's went into history because of poor quality, even with the low price.

Harbor Freight has done nothing but grow.

Show me another American tool merchandiser that has grown like Harbor Freight in the last 10 years.


So this tool, broken right out of the box is not an indication of sketchy off-shore QC variability?

Nope, definitely Snap-On quality right there.

The Ford, GM and Toyota companies of the tool world (using your example) would be Craftsman, SK, KD...etc. Good quality, good QC, and reasonably priced. No, not everybody needs Rolls/Snap-On.

But tools are a lot less complex than automobiles. There is a lot less to go wrong with the manufacturing process. Yet here we have an item that is CLEARLY junk that made it through QC. What if it had let go while in use and the one part of the arm embedded itself in the OP's eye socket? Where's the benefit of being cheap and buying junk in that scenario?

I paid MAYBE $40.00 for a decent KD pitman arm puller at a local Auto Parts store. I don't even entertain the idea of buying junk like this. I like keeping my body parts and I like using tools that I know were manufactured using a process that involved at least a reasonable level of quality control so the likelihood of it grenading and causing me bodily harm is greatly reduced.

I cannot fathom the idea of supporting the philosophy that these bargain-basement priced knock-offs pedaled as tools are in any way "good". But I guess it goes hand-in-hand with the "everything cheaper" mentality in America. Nobody wants to actually pay money for good, or even reasonable quality. They'll just hop on down to China Freight and buy a $5.00 rip-off, and if it breaks, hey, they are only out $5.00. And if their car falls on them because their garbage tin-can jack-stands won't actually hold anywhere near their rated weight, then I guess that's OK too. Because they were only $5.00.

 

[JHZR2]

Exactly.

I was there to look for a dial gauge because I'll use it maybe three times and so for the price, it might be worth it.

I was looking for a pickle fork, thinking it would be $3.99 and for the few times I'll ever use it, that's good. Well it was 9.99, and I needed two sizes. For $27, I could get a US-made lisle set that has three size forks.

HF is not always a good deal even as Chinese junk. I was fairly surprised at the prices of some of the junk there... For $130 I could get a 900w generator set, but they wanted $10 for a pickle fork or ball joint puller. Ratchets there seem to be getting $$$$.

 

[jcwit]

But you have to admit, most of their tools are Yugo's...... [/quote]

Wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yugo's went into history because of poor quality, even with the low price.

Harbor Freight has done nothing but grow.

Show me another American tool merchandiser that has grown like Harbor Freight in the last 10 years. [/quote]

So this tool, broken right out of the box is not an indication of sketchy off-shore QC variability?

Nope, definitely Snap-On quality right there.

The Ford, GM and Toyota companies of the tool world (using your example) would be Craftsman, SK, KD...etc. Good quality, good QC, and reasonably priced. No, not everybody needs Rolls/Snap-On.

But tools are a lot less complex than automobiles. There is a lot less to go wrong with the manufacturing process. Yet here we have an item that is CLEARLY junk that made it through QC. What if it had let go while in use and the one part of the arm embedded itself in the OP's eye socket? Where's the benefit of being cheap and buying junk in that scenario?

I

I cannot fathom the idea of supporting the philosophy that these bargain-basement priced knock-offs pedaled as tools are in any way "good". But I guess it goes hand-in-hand with the "everything cheaper" mentality in America. Nobody wants to actually pay money for good, or even reasonable quality. They'll just hop on down to China Freight and buy a $5.00 rip-off, and if it breaks, hey, they are only out $5.00. And if their car falls on them because their garbage tin-can jack-stands won't actually hold anywhere near their rated weight, then I guess that's OK too. Because they were only $5.00. [/quote]

I'll stick by my example. The worst car I ever owned was a 1972 Camaro, purchased new no less, only kept it 4 months, did it keep me from buying other GM's or Chevy profucts. No, in a word. I also purchased (ordered) a new 1972 Corvette, owned a couple of Chevy Vegas "both served me well, both going over 100,000 mile mark" and another new Camaro in 1978. So in the end GM served me well.

So the person had a tool break, well name me the tool company manufacturer or distributor who has never had a tool fail with no matter the price of the tool, high or low end.

Buy what you wish, if you need to brag about how expensive your equipment is, so be it, it will make you feel better in your insecurity, if one is happy with saving some money thats fine also as long as the equipment does the job required.

 

[jcwit]

(quote) And if their car falls on them because their garbage tin-can jack-stands won't actually hold anywhere near their rated weight, then I guess that's OK too. Because they were only $5.00.(quote)

If that was the case the lawyers would have put them out of business long ago. Would have been faster than what they did with the Ford Pinto,

 

[jcwit]

(quote)I cannot fathom the idea of supporting the philosophy that these bargain-basement priced knock-offs (quote)

Does this also mean anyone making sockets or ratchets, or adj. wrenches, or whatever is a "knock-off" in your oponion?

Better take a quick around your home at all the "knock-off's" you already have from kitchen appliances to the tv & computor, to more than likely the socks you're wrearing.

Harbor Freight gives a good quality tool at a fair price and is appreciated by those that do not make a living with tools, or seem to need braging rights.

BTW, are the Made in the U.S.A. products they sell also considered "knock-offs"?

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: jcwit
Quote:
And if their car falls on them because their garbage tin-can jack-stands won't actually hold anywhere near their rated weight, then I guess that's OK too. Because they were only $5.00.


If that was the case the lawyers would have put them out of business long ago. Would have been faster than what they did with the Ford Pinto,


They are a reseller. They (they laywers) would have to go after the manufacturer. If the company is Chinese, good luck!

This tool didn't break in service (thankfully!). But what if it did?

You cannot deny that the quality of this item was sub-par.

 

[OVERKILL]

Originally Posted By: jcwit
Quote:
Quote:
Quote:

But you have to admit, most of their tools are Yugo's......


Wrong!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Yugo's went into history because of poor quality, even with the low price.

Harbor Freight has done nothing but grow.

Show me another American tool merchandiser that has grown like Harbor Freight in the last 10 years.


So this tool, broken right out of the box is not an indication of sketchy off-shore QC variability?

Nope, definitely Snap-On quality right there.

The Ford, GM and Toyota companies of the tool world (using your example) would be Craftsman, SK, KD...etc. Good quality, good QC, and reasonably priced. No, not everybody needs Rolls/Snap-On.

But tools are a lot less complex than automobiles. There is a lot less to go wrong with the manufacturing process. Yet here we have an item that is CLEARLY junk that made it through QC. What if it had let go while in use and the one part of the arm embedded itself in the OP's eye socket? Where's the benefit of being cheap and buying junk in that scenario?

I

I cannot fathom the idea of supporting the philosophy that these bargain-basement priced knock-offs pedaled as tools are in any way "good". But I guess it goes hand-in-hand with the "everything cheaper" mentality in America. Nobody wants to actually pay money for good, or even reasonable quality. They'll just hop on down to China Freight and buy a $5.00 rip-off, and if it breaks, hey, they are only out $5.00. And if their car falls on them because their garbage tin-can jack-stands won't actually hold anywhere near their rated weight, then I guess that's OK too. Because they were only $5.00.


I'll stick by my example. The worst car I ever owned was a 1972 Camaro, purchased new no less, only kept it 4 months, did it keep me from buying other GM's or Chevy profucts. No, in a word. I also purchased (ordered) a new 1972 Corvette, owned a couple of Chevy Vegas "both served me well, both going over 100,000 mile mark" and another new Camaro in 1978. So in the end GM served me well.

So the person had a tool break, well name me the tool company manufacturer or distributor who has never had a tool fail with no matter the price of the tool, high or low end.

Buy what you wish, if you need to brag about how expensive your equipment is, so be it, it will make you feel better in your insecurity, if one is happy with saving some money thats fine also as long as the equipment does the job required.


I'm not bragging. And if you are going to make personal knocks, please learn to properly use the quote function. It makes your posts very difficult to decipher.

There is a significant difference between saving some money and buying the Craftsman ratchet over the Snap-On one and buying some off-shore piece of junk that breaks after a week of hard use.

I'm not knocking somebody for trying to save money, but you can save money and still buy good quality, name-brand tools manufactured in the USA by your fellow Americans. FWIW, 90% of my Snap-On stuff was manufactured in Canada by Canadians who are probably long dead.

I think there is a marked difference between trying to save money by buying something that is good, and will do the job, but not going overboard, and something that is marginal quality at best, but is dirt-cheap.

 

[jcwit]

(quote) please learn to properly use the quote function. It makes your posts very difficult to decipher. (quote)

Can't use it if going over four deep. Or so it says.

If you notice much of the craftsman tools are now being made in china.

(quote)They are a reseller. They (they laywers) would have to go after the manufacturer. If the company is Chinese, good luck!(quote)

Wrong, lawsuits can and are brought against the sellers, distributors every day, and won for that matter. However this may not be true in Canada.