What's your "sweet spot" if you are good at DIY?

[brages]

So everybody has his own idea of where the "sweet spot" for used car value is (or, maybe nowadays, if it even exists vs. buying new). It's affected by a lot of factors, including how old of a heap you're willing to drive, your ability to work on it yourself, how many miles you accumulate, how you value money vs. time etc. Usually, it's a 5-year-old car or something.

I was thinking about this. The first couple of cars I owned (beginning in the mid-90s) were late-80's cars that I bought with 70-80k miles and kept to 140-150k. Looking back, I could probably have kept both a lot longer. I've owned a lot of cars in the many years since then and I've trended more towards buying older cars with more miles.

I am coming to the conclusion that if I want to maximize value (reliable miles at a minimum total ownership cost), the sweet spot for me is:

10-20 years old
150k-175k miles
Popular model
No rust
Decent interior
Proven powertrain (engines and transmissions with reputations for reliability)
$3000-5000

I'm not sure brand really matters (you get what you pay for). I prefer to buy from individuals, not dealers, and normal people, not car flippers. I don't care for SUVs and prefer manual transmissions. I don't need maintenance receipts when I'm buying. I look for a lower-priced example, not the "best-in-breed", but avoid cars that give off a vibe of neglect or sketchy repairs. I've never owned a salvage title car, not really against the idea though.

For the vehicles that I've owned recently that fit these parameters, I've been able to rack up a lot of reliable miles just by keeping up with maintenance and repairs. Stuff breaks, but not at a frustratingly frequent rate and no getting stranded from breakdowns (yet!). I think cars bought with the criteria above can go 250-300k miles. I've also gone a little cheaper or compromised on some of the list above, and it hasn't gone so well.

Things in my favor:
Internet forums and Youtube to diagnose and show "how to"
Tools and garage space to do most work
I enjoy working on cars, usually
Enough vehicles to live with short "down time" when a car is being worked on
Live close to a couple of large self-service junkyards (I only started using these a few years ago and, wow, I should have done that sooner)
Non-severe driving conditions (mix of city and highway, lots of annual miles)


How about you? What's your sweet spot?

 

[brages]

I recently picked up a 2013 Fusion. But I'm finding it may be just a bit too new! The local junkyards have plenty of the previous generation Fusion, but only one in this generation. But since it was a very popular model, I'm sure that they will accumulate more in the coming years...

 

[The Critic]

Start with something in the 5-7 years old/75-100K range, keep until 200K. Parts availability, at least quality stuff, tends to become a real issue once you pass the 15 yr mark.
Avoid any low-volume makes/models - those models tend to have parts availability issues before the volume sellers
Avoid any platforms where engine removal is required for moderate to major repairs (aka most transverse V6's except Honda)
Find a brand with a good dealer parts distribution supply chain (e.g. most Japanese import brands)
Find a brand where access to the dealer scan tool is readily available to the aftermarket (rules out Nissan, Hyundai/Kia, VAG, MB)

 

[SwampSurvivor]

I did just that recently. Got out of my newer Subaru and bought a Grand Marquis. My Criteria was ...


10-20 years old
150k-175k miles
No rust
Proven powertrain (engines and transmissions with reputations for reliability)
$3000-5000

Unfortunatley I'm finding my engine is down compression on one cylinder so it keeps setting a check engine light.

The biggest thing is no rust. That's what stops me from doing some things on my truck. I neither have the patience or equipment to deal with completely rusted up bolts.

I'm just going to go ahead and do the right thing and pretend I didn't see the light, It'll go away

 

[JeffKeryk]

Honda Toyota family of vehicles, with a little Nissan Altima thrown in to keep things interesting.

 

[The Critic]

with a little Nissan Altima thrown in to keep things interesting.

Is that the wild side of you, Jeff? I mean, it's okay - my parents have one too. Not sure what I was thinking when I recommended it to them.

 

[brages]

I've owned Chevrolet, Ford, Mazda, Nissan, Honda, VW, Volvo -- but no Toyota or Chrysler products. I was strongly considering a Prius recently, though.

On reflection, I've only owned the main brand from a company... Fords, not Mercuries or Lincolns; Hondas not Acuras. This has not been intentional. I guess the Volvo is Ford-era...

 

[SwampSurvivor]

I've owned Chevrolet, Ford, Mazda, Nissan, Honda, VW, Volvo -- but no Toyota or Chrysler products. I was strongly considering a Prius recently, though.

On reflection, I've only owned the main brand from a company... Fords, not Mercuries or Lincolns; Hondas not Acuras. This has not been intentional. I guess the Volvo is Ford-era...

I always thought of Mercuries as knockoff Fords. Throughout my lifetime, for the most part, the premium brands have been a carbon copy of the plain brands. Apart from the front clip, tail lights and door cladding - there's really nothing different in my Grand Marquis than a higher spec Crown Victoria. I never really conidered Grand Marquis in all my years of prospective panther buying until this one. All of the Crown Vics have expired due to livery use. Most of the Grand Marquis GS have succombed to that fate. However, the LS Grand Marquis still seem to be old people owned a majority of their lives.

But the Topaz and 1/2 gen Sable just looked awful compared to their Ford counterparts.

 

[Leo99]

Being good at DIY and wanting to do DIY on a certain frequency is the important thing. It was a labor of love to keep my wife's RAV4 running until 400k miles but I don't miss it. Before that, DIY was necessitated by financial resources and the lack thereof. You get 20 years old and seals start to get brittle and leak and chasing that around isn't fun. Having an extra car so you're not stressing to fix the one you have so you can go to work goes a long way.

 

[wpod]

My sweet spot is n ot working on my vehicles . It is not fun after doing it for a living.

 

[SwampSurvivor]

Being good at DIY and wanting to do DIY on a certain frequency is the important thing. It was a labor of love to keep my wife's RAV4 running until 400k miles but I don't miss it. Before that, DIY was necessitated by financial resources and the lack thereof. You get 20 years old and seals start to get brittle and leak and chasing that around isn't fun. Having an extra car so you're not stressing to fix the one you have so you can go to work goes a long way.

It's nice to have a reliable , newer vehicle in the fleet. That's for sure Fiance is work from home permanent. So we have that as our "good" car. No point in both of us having newer cars.

 

[brages]

Unfortunatley I'm finding my engine is down compression on one cylinder so it keeps setting a check engine light.

I've been blessed, in that all the old cars I've owned over the years, I've never had one with problems below the head. I did put new rings in the first car I ever owned, at 120k miles or so. That was a pointless exercise, I think.

Recently, I had a Ranger 2.3 pickup that developed a misfire from recessed valve seats. But that was easily and cheaply fixed with a junkyard head. And that truck was outside the "sweet spot" -- I bought it with too many miles, and too rusty (looked pretty good on top, but rusty underneath).

Otherwise, most of the vehicles I've owned have run pretty well. Some have burned or leaked oil.

Also, I've had some high milers, but never had a car that was dead when I sold it... so far...

 

[fisher83]

I think it depends a whole lot on what the vehicle is. Ideally you'd want to own the car after most depreciation has occurred but before it's old and worn out enough to have a lot of problems. The age and mileage at which that sweet spot is can vary wildly amongst different models and manufacturers.

 

[Silver]

I'm still not comfortable buying anything over about 120k miles. I'm not seeing the added longevity people insinuate with vehicles. As a matter of fact, if anything I'm seeing the opposite. Too big a risk of poor maintenance. Seems the 'sweet spot' for durable, easy to work on vehicles was the 90's thru say 2005 or so. I mean look at that period for full size GM's. They' just put and put on and on. Modular Fords the same way. Our newest vehicle is a 2016 and is the first vehicle I've ever had that has shown transmission issues. I've kept older vehicles into the 250k range and never had a trans issue, but this 2016 now with just a hair over 100k. Coincidence? I don't think so.

In the market the way it is now, I'm having a hard time finding anything that fits my criteria for a fair price. I mean fair to me, not "the market". I value vehicles; market price is irrelevant to me as long as I don't absolutely have to have a vehicle.

As mentioned, having an extra car is vital if you're going to have older vehicles in the mix.

 

[Leo99]

It's nice to have a reliable , newer vehicle in the fleet. That's for sure Fiance is work from home permanent. So we have that as our "good" car. No point in both of us having newer cars.

I'm permanent work from home now. My Camry's water pump is seeping again. I'm none too keen to replace it again. Only driving 5000 miles a year I can do with a different type of vehicle. Just don't know what to get. Could use an SUV as I'm either lugging around golf clubs or bowling balls or both. I do like the new gizmos and gadgets on cars, though. Maybe a lease isn't too bad of an idea for me.

 

[brages]

Our newest vehicle is a 2016 and is the first vehicle I've ever had that has shown transmission issues. I've kept older vehicles into the 250k range and never had a trans issue, but this 2016 now with just a hair over 100k. Coincidence? I don't think so.

I had a 2002 Mazda MPV whose transmission went out. It was due to a defect in the Jatco 5-speed that caused one of the pistons to crack. But thanks to a few amazing posters on the MPV forum, I was able to fix the transmission, replacing the worn frictions and the cracked pistons. Didn't even have to remove it from the car.

I made a little mistake the first time I fixed it, though. It began acting up a few months later and I had a real hard time figuring it out. Eventually got it fixed right, though. What a saga; I learned a lot about auto transmissions - they were always like black boxes to me before that.

 

[totegoat]

I buy new and keep them a long time. Example: 2015 HL has 14K on it, 2008 RAM has 53K.

 

[vavavroom]

My sweet spot is n ot working on my vehicles . It is not fun after doing it for a living.

No kidding. I have always worked on my vehicles, including all maintenance and repairs like shock replacement, control arms, engine mounts, timing and drive belts, brakes, radiator replacement and so on. I would not want to do this for a living, It's not the good kind of physical exercise, it's the kind that causes long-term wear and tear and health issues. These days I only tackle repairs I feel very comfortable with and if I know I have all the necessary tools.

 

[Astro14]

A car I like.

Otherwise, DIY, or not, you’re paying for something you don’t like.

 

[Barkleymut]

2 of the last 3 cars that I bought were almost exactly $8000. That used to buy a low mileage older car.

From there I can usually keep up the maintenance on a well built car and not have to do much. I enjoy changing oil, trans fluid, coolant, working on minor stuff (injectors, alternator, sensors). I hate working on brakes, but I am too cheap to pay someone else to do it.

Paying over 20k for a car just doesn't financial sense to me. Find a good 10 year old car with low miles and a proven record of reliability and pull the trigger.