Less new hires?
What exactly is a "Living wage"?
- Thread starter vindex1963
- Start date
It is easier to smoke joints and drink beer after work and complain about how life is unfair rather than taking some evening classes to improve your value in the work force.
A living wage is defined as the minimum income necessary for a worker to meet their basic needs. This is not the same as a subsistence wage, which refers to a biological minimum. Needs are defined to include food, housing, and other essential needs such as clothing.
per wiki
- Joined
- Jun 22, 2022
- Messages
- 1,545
One in six American children go to bed hungry every night. That would be one metric to measure what living wage is (ability to feed one's family).
Ability to have food, clothing/hygiene, housing, healthcare and education would be the minimum I would consider as living wage.
Ability to have food, clothing/hygiene, housing, healthcare and education would be the minimum I would consider as living wage.
There is nothing fair in this world. The sooner you accept that reality (I know, it is not fair), the easier you can start facing the reality honestly and make the best decision you can.
Is working hard the best approach to the problem? Probably not. You can be the hardest working tech in the oil change department and will stay that way till you are too old to do the job, and the cost of living increase will still outrun you in the wrong city you live in.
At least in the US, we have the freedom to move elsewhere, away from high cost area. We also have the freedom to quit and find another position without a gun pointing to our head if we go on strike (like the people did in Guatamala by the United Fruit Co).
Regarding to "living wage", there is no standard. If your parents sign up for a bad student loan for your bad major choice, you are screwed until you pay it off. If you got knocked up or knock someone up before you have financial security, you are screwed until the kids are old enough to take care of themselves so you can focus on advancing your career. Young people today know that, which is why they are not doing min wage jobs in high cost area or starting families. They are smarter than boomers back then at the same age because they know how expensive things are, and nothing is guaranteed. You cannot control living wage if interest rate is 0 and your neighbors are borrowing at 3% to drive up home price while making 200% more than you. You can pass all the laws in the world to protect yourself but human nature will always find a way around it.
Just say no to spending, no to having kids, move away from high cost area not paying enough for the jobs you do (let the employers and their customers deal with their problems). Nobody is entitled to cheap cost of living or cheap labor in high cost of living area.
This is human nature at work.
Is working hard the best approach to the problem? Probably not. You can be the hardest working tech in the oil change department and will stay that way till you are too old to do the job, and the cost of living increase will still outrun you in the wrong city you live in.
At least in the US, we have the freedom to move elsewhere, away from high cost area. We also have the freedom to quit and find another position without a gun pointing to our head if we go on strike (like the people did in Guatamala by the United Fruit Co).
Regarding to "living wage", there is no standard. If your parents sign up for a bad student loan for your bad major choice, you are screwed until you pay it off. If you got knocked up or knock someone up before you have financial security, you are screwed until the kids are old enough to take care of themselves so you can focus on advancing your career. Young people today know that, which is why they are not doing min wage jobs in high cost area or starting families. They are smarter than boomers back then at the same age because they know how expensive things are, and nothing is guaranteed. You cannot control living wage if interest rate is 0 and your neighbors are borrowing at 3% to drive up home price while making 200% more than you. You can pass all the laws in the world to protect yourself but human nature will always find a way around it.
Just say no to spending, no to having kids, move away from high cost area not paying enough for the jobs you do (let the employers and their customers deal with their problems). Nobody is entitled to cheap cost of living or cheap labor in high cost of living area.
This is human nature at work.
If you consider subsidies, K12 education is generally free, health care is free at that income level, food can be subsidized by EBT, clothings can be cheap if you know what you are doing, housing can be subsidized too.
The bigger problem is actually the slightly above poverty group, they don't qualify but they aren't making enough to do better on their own. It is a well known problem in most part of the world with any sort of safety net.
These days the biggest problem facing low income group is commute time. Low income folks frequently commute 3-4 hrs a day.
Jobs pay for the value of the labor provided. Almost anyone can take tickets and the value of that is in the pay.
Not everyone can write code, and the product produced is likely more valuable than 2 hour sessions in a movie theater.
People are paid at the intersection of what their time and talents are worth to both the employer and employee.
Either has the right to say no to the transaction.
Not everyone can write code, and the product produced is likely more valuable than 2 hour sessions in a movie theater.
People are paid at the intersection of what their time and talents are worth to both the employer and employee.
Either has the right to say no to the transaction.
You are missing a key attribute is pay correlates to supply of labor beyond the value provided. That is why my 14 year old was offered $15/hr to do a somewhat boring job this summer. She passed. The owner I know does not liking hiring 14 year olds and in past was paying around $11-$12/hr for 16-18 year olds for work on farm.
I would say that it is the amount of money you need IOT pay for the things you can't/won't do for yourself.
You see it all the time, people with their cars parked on their lawns where they could be growing some of their own food...but people are lazy.
It's a matter of economy of scale.
You can grow some zucchini for the squirrels to eat at probably $5/lb with the labor and material (fertilizer, seed, tools, whatever) using your front lawn, or you can buy them at the store for $3/lb. Which one would you do?
There's a reason most farms are automated despite lots of waste, they are still cheaper to throw away 40% of them afterward than growing just enough of food for your own consumption.
You must have been one of the ones running around looking for toilet paper during the pandemic.
I live next to a Target, so I can be there 5 mins before opening and get a pack before driving my kids to school.
I assume you are the one growing your own trees to make toilet paper?
A lot of older people (earlier Boomers and those who are even older) still seem clueless about the cost of housing and university today, partly because they paid for that stuff when that was all a lot cheaper. Their houses were paid off decades ago. They think youngsters can work a minimum-wage job, still pay for everything, and save.
Spot on! This is sooooo true!
I tell people if you cannot make it in Slicon Valley you cannot make it anywhere.
Opportunity abounds!
Education all over the place!
I joined AA ad 33 and got my 1st degree at 40. I went from homeless to, let's just say better.
Where else in the world is this possible? I flat out love it here.
And am eternally grateful.
You really are cutting out half of my sentence to make it the opposite of what I said.
I said "At least we have the freedom to move somewhere else". You quote "At least we have the freedom", then go on and said "If you cannot make it in Silicon Valley you cannot make it anywhere. Opportunity abounds!"
I am not disagreeing with your point of view, but I disagree with the way you quote me.
I love listening to crabs in a bucket say what other people deserve. You are all bringing each other down. Saying someone doesn't deserve $20 is pointless. The dollar amount is arbitrary. $20 is a different amount of power than it was 20 years ago. A cheeseburger is $20.
My nephew pays money to work at McDonald's. He operates at about a $150 loss to work there after expenses but he's doing it because he can't get anything else at his age while in school. That is not a living wage.
A bunch of absolute perverts sitting around thinking about what other people deserve, and saying others deserve to live in poverty. So pathetic.
If at any point you feel inclined to do basic math. Multiply 20 by 20-30 and compare it to the cost of rent and groceries in your area. Then realize they get zero health insurance or benefits so they go into debt if they get sick.
My nephew pays money to work at McDonald's. He operates at about a $150 loss to work there after expenses but he's doing it because he can't get anything else at his age while in school. That is not a living wage.
A bunch of absolute perverts sitting around thinking about what other people deserve, and saying others deserve to live in poverty. So pathetic.
If at any point you feel inclined to do basic math. Multiply 20 by 20-30 and compare it to the cost of rent and groceries in your area. Then realize they get zero health insurance or benefits so they go into debt if they get sick.
Last edited:
deleted.
Something is wrong here. Why is he paying to work at MsDonalds?
Plus, he is in school. What kind of wage does he require to live?
Apologies; I menat no disrespect @PandaBear
I just loved you reminding me of my journey and just how lucky I am to be in Silicon Valley.
I am not sure any place else, even in America, could have offered me the solution that was laid at my feet here.
Similar threads
