Warming up your car in winter time

[Clevy]

Originally Posted By: Garak
Originally Posted By: Chris142
I say start it, put on your seat belt and drive.


I dare you to try that in -40.

I prefer not to idle excessively, but there are times when it's going to take a little longer than climbing in and taking off.

Garak
We can talk about -40 until we are blue in the face,or type it until our fingers bleed but until a person actually experiences it its just a number.
I've driven in cold so bad it to a mile or 2 before the tires were rounded again and the "thump thump" of what feels like flat tires went away.
Or opening your door and throwing a cup of water out and it's frozen before it hits the ground. Or driving down the highway and the coolant temp goes down,not up.
Or spraying your windows with washer fluid rated for -45 and it freezes before it can be wiped off.
Just a number to most,a way of life for us.

 

[hypervish]

I used to warm up the car for 5-10 minutes, 7 minutes on average. I've recently started to only wait 1 minute till I start driving slowly, and I try and keep rpm's below 3k.

 

[Garak]

You're right, Clevy. I've seen all that, too. Heck, the thump-thump of tires used to be daily in the winter before radials were common. As for the cold, yep, hop in the car in -40 and take off, and see how nice and frosted the windshield is in a few seconds.

 

[[email protected]]

Originally Posted By: another Todd
I thought the Prius had an electric heater.


Yeah they have electric cabin heaters that will take the harsh cold out of the passenger compartment until you get hot hot heat, but they arent very noticeable. The best way to describe the cabin heaters is they will keep the windows from getting foggy until you start getting hot heat.

I should make a video of my scantool hooked up with live data on a cold start. Once I hit the start button and the heated coolant gets pumped into the engine, the ECT reading jumps about 80 degrees or so. This is all before the engine even starts! Not too shabby.

 

[Tzu]

I like reading comments from people who live in a desert or where the low is a chilly 50 degrees. During winters near Buffalo NY, I start my vehicles up and could care less about wear or fuel dilution. Now I don't sit there and let it idle for 20 minutes each time, but on very cold days (lows 0-5 degrees), I will let our beater Camry run atleast 10 minutes to clear the windshield some and just make it more comfortable for the ride into work. Normal lows of 15-20 degrees gets 5 minutes warm up. Long enough to make coffee and some toast for breakfast. Between the winter gas blend and driving through 2-3" of snow/slush all the way to work is not the best way of getting great MPG's to begin with. What little fuel I use to warm up is well worth it. 277,000 miles so far and it dosen't seem to bother it.

 

[bigjl]

I just start and go.

But I keep revs lower and take it easy on gear changes, clutch etc till everything is nicely warmed up.


I was always told it is best to drive off as on tickover a car takes a very long time to heat up. This is exaggerated on direct injected turbo diesel cars.

 

[whip]

Originally Posted By: grampi
Unless someone can prove to me that warming up your engine causes damage I won't believe it. I have almost 40 years of vehicle owning experience with many high mileage vehicles to prove otherwise...

I believe every auto maker recommends against long idling, and suggest the best way to warm the car is to drive it gently. Are they wrong?
That being said, when it's really cold, like below 10, I warm my car up for a few minutes. Other wise, it idles while I clear the windows, and then I go.

 

[rslifkin]

Idle warmups wash a bit of excess fuel down the cylinder walls causing some extra wear.

In the Jeep, I start it and once the oil pressure gauge stops climbing, it's ready to go, unless the windows are fogged and I need some heat to clear them. If it's really cold, I'll throw it in gear and give it another 15 - 20 seconds to circulate the trans fluid, etc. I just drive it very gently until it's good and warm. It doesn't warm up well at idle anyway, 5 mins will just barely get the temp gauge to the 100 mark at idle in 30* weather, although manually knocking it up to a high idle of 1400 or so helps that a good bit.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: bigjl
This is exaggerated on direct injected turbo diesel cars.


Absolutely true. I've known of people up here who were used to the truck diesels and warming them up in winter (some here even automatically increase the idle under certain conditions to warm them up better, or even have a fast idle switch in some medium duties) and then got a new VW diesel and wonder why it's not warmed up from just idling.

 

[TFB1]

Originally Posted By: Hermann
Originally Posted By: daman
Originally Posted By: grampi
Unless someone can prove to me that warming up your engine causes damage I won't believe it. I have almost 40 years of vehicle owning experience with many high mileage vehicles to prove otherwise...

No one can because it does not.

worse case you'll get some oil contamination/fuel dilution and you should shorten up your OCI.


And waste gas and pollute the air, but that is Grampi's choice. It's still a semi-free country/continent.


And my choice as well... My vehicles always run a few minutes before I take off, sometimes even in the summer when the cabin is cooling down...

As far as bad for engine when idling, tell that to all the police depts that let their vehicles idle for hours on end at construction sites, accidents, etc...

 

[SteveSRT8]

All of the "old school" cylinder wall washdown is fast becoming baloney with DI and other technology.

The fact is that idling, even for extended periods, does virtually nothing bad in a modern car, whether cold or hot.

 

[ARB1977]

About 20-30 seconds. It gets cold here but nothing like northern states.

 

[KitaCam]

Just a thought...

Wouldn't the engine heat up FASTER when running down the road as opposed to just idling? .... and isn't that what is desired here?

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: Hermann
Originally Posted By: daman
Originally Posted By: grampi
Unless someone can prove to me that warming up your engine causes damage I won't believe it. I have almost 40 years of vehicle owning experience with many high mileage vehicles to prove otherwise...

No one can because it does not.

worse case you'll get some oil contamination/fuel dilution and you should shorten up your OCI.


And waste gas and pollute the air, but that is Grampi's choice. It's still a semi-free country/continent.


Waste gas? It's well worth the little gas I use (and over the course of the entire winter it's less than 1/2 tank) to get into a warm vehicle with clear windows...and the amount of pollution produced is less than your lawnmower produces in one mowing...

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: whip
Originally Posted By: grampi
Unless someone can prove to me that warming up your engine causes damage I won't believe it. I have almost 40 years of vehicle owning experience with many high mileage vehicles to prove otherwise...

I believe every auto maker recommends against long idling, and suggest the best way to warm the car is to drive it gently. Are they wrong?
That being said, when it's really cold, like below 10, I warm my car up for a few minutes. Other wise, it idles while I clear the windows, and then I go.


Like I said, until someone PROVES to me that warming up the car in the winter shortens the life of the vehicle, I won't believe it. I've owned dozens of vehicles in my lifetime. All have been warmed up in the winter, and only one of these vehicles was rendered beyond repair due to engine failure. If winter warming was damaging my engines, I wouldn't have had so many high mileage vehicles...

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: KitaCam
Just a thought...

Wouldn't the engine heat up FASTER when running down the road as opposed to just idling? .... and isn't that what is desired here?


Yes it does, but then you have to scrape the windows, deal with the inside of the windows fogging, and ride in a cold vehicle...

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: rslifkin
Idle warmups wash a bit of excess fuel down the cylinder walls causing some extra wear.


Prove it.

 

[Patman]

Originally Posted By: KitaCam
Just a thought...

Wouldn't the engine heat up FASTER when running down the road as opposed to just idling?


Most definitely! With most cars you would probably need to idle the engine for at least 30-40 minutes before the oil got up to full temperature, as opposed to 15-20 minutes of driving.

 

[Clevy]

Originally Posted By: Patman
Originally Posted By: KitaCam
Just a thought...

Wouldn't the engine heat up FASTER when running down the road as opposed to just idling?


Most definitely! With most cars you would probably need to idle the engine for at least 30-40 minutes before the oil got up to full temperature, as opposed to 15-20 minutes of driving.


Depends on the ambient temp. At -40 most of the vehicles I've owned stayed warmer not moving then traveling at highway speeds. City driving will keep everything a bit warmer though than a highway run.
Though those extreme temps don't last more than a month or so here but -30 is a possibility up til April or so.
I just changed the oil in my hemi. The oil was seriously fuel diluted. I discovered that the during that cold snap we had the oil never got hot enough to evaporate any fuel that accumulated in the oil. Now that I've got a cardboard air dam made up I can feel the oil cooler get hot but before I could put my hand on it and it was barely warm to the touch.

 

[Clevy]

Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: rslifkin
Idle warmups wash a bit of excess fuel down the cylinder walls causing some extra wear.


Prove it.


I don't think that's as much of an issue as it was when engines were carbureted. Fuel injection is very precise in metering fuel and I doubt that's an issue unless there is some for of mechanical issue such as a leaking injector or something.
I'm with you grampi