If you search for my used oil analysis for Esso xd3. It showed high fuel dilution and higher wear. That used oil analysis was done in the winter time when I would let the car idle for 5+ mins. Now I just start the car wait 30 seconds and drive slowly. Now I have no fuel dilution and much less wear. So I wouldnt let it idle,, no need and my used oil analysis proves it.
Warm Up time?
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Originally Posted By: Saab9-3
If you search for my used oil analysis for Esso xd3. It showed high fuel dilution and higher wear. That used oil analysis was done in the winter time when I would let the car idle for 5+ mins. Now I just start the car wait 30 seconds and drive slowly. Now I have no fuel dilution and much less wear. So I wouldnt let it idle,, no need and my used oil analysis proves it.
Yea, I know theres no need to let it idle that long. But I use synthetic oil with a 5000 mile OCI, so I am not too worried. But yes, that is a very valid concern.
If you search for my used oil analysis for Esso xd3. It showed high fuel dilution and higher wear. That used oil analysis was done in the winter time when I would let the car idle for 5+ mins. Now I just start the car wait 30 seconds and drive slowly. Now I have no fuel dilution and much less wear. So I wouldnt let it idle,, no need and my used oil analysis proves it.
Yea, I know theres no need to let it idle that long. But I use synthetic oil with a 5000 mile OCI, so I am not too worried. But yes, that is a very valid concern.
Start and wait for RPM's to drop to a reasonable level (under 1000 in the Explorer, under 1000 in the F150, and under 850 or so in the Jeep), shift in gear and go. The only exceptions are if I need to scrape the windows (then I scrape while the car is idling, then go). Its worked for all the cars I've owned, and I've got 450,000 miles on these three combined.
I give it a few minutes.
Originally Posted By: Saab9-3
If you search for my used oil analysis for Esso xd3. It showed high fuel dilution and higher wear. That used oil analysis was done in the winter time when I would let the car idle for 5+ mins. Now I just start the car wait 30 seconds and drive slowly. Now I have no fuel dilution and much less wear. So I wouldnt let it idle,, no need and my used oil analysis proves it.
5+ minutes is a long time, and I could see where you could have problems. Half or a little less than that time is about all I idle mine. If I ran the 5 speed E-150 for 30 seconds in bitter cold it wouldn't take off the right way at all. Its been that way since day one. It needs at least 2-3 minutes run time in very cold weather. OTOH the Jeep and Aerostar can be run less, but I go with the slightly under 1000 rpm for them as I mentioned, which really isn't idling them long.
If you search for my used oil analysis for Esso xd3. It showed high fuel dilution and higher wear. That used oil analysis was done in the winter time when I would let the car idle for 5+ mins. Now I just start the car wait 30 seconds and drive slowly. Now I have no fuel dilution and much less wear. So I wouldnt let it idle,, no need and my used oil analysis proves it.
5+ minutes is a long time, and I could see where you could have problems. Half or a little less than that time is about all I idle mine. If I ran the 5 speed E-150 for 30 seconds in bitter cold it wouldn't take off the right way at all. Its been that way since day one. It needs at least 2-3 minutes run time in very cold weather. OTOH the Jeep and Aerostar can be run less, but I go with the slightly under 1000 rpm for them as I mentioned, which really isn't idling them long.
warming-up and cooling down slowly is good.
too long a time spent idling with a cold engine is bad.
Warm-up is much faster under load.
Me thinks engine's decide point at what temperature to drop the rmps to the slow idle is optimum moment to go under load for seamless good warm-up pace.
I think it is no coincidence that fast idle and engine speed when cruising are similar.
too long a time spent idling with a cold engine is bad.
Warm-up is much faster under load.
Me thinks engine's decide point at what temperature to drop the rmps to the slow idle is optimum moment to go under load for seamless good warm-up pace.
I think it is no coincidence that fast idle and engine speed when cruising are similar.
My engine takes about 5 minutes to get down to 1,000 rpm's in -20oC (yes I have timed it). So I just start it, let the oil circulate and wait till water temperatures is reading 100oF on the scangauge and then go... Usually 30 seconds - 2 minutes depending on how cold it is outside. I then drive away moderately without loading the engine too much until it hits it's regular 188-192 oF
When the temps are below freezing, but above zero, I can get away with just a 5-10 minute warm up. If it's below zero, I have to let it warm up for a good 15-20 minutes. Anything less than that and my clutch pedal and manual shifter are just too darn stiff.
I have 2 female drivers with #3 in the loop. I am lucky to get them to wait 30 seconds...which is why I use PP.
Me? I wait 1-2 minutes then go easy. 1 minute is sufficient in any temperature above -10F for an engine to oil up.
Me? I wait 1-2 minutes then go easy. 1 minute is sufficient in any temperature above -10F for an engine to oil up.
I typically have little to no warm up time in the winter. However, I do try use the block heater anytime the temperature is less than -10 C (on a timer, for approx 3 hours). If the vehicle has snow on it, I will start it, clean the snow and then leave. This usually amounts to about a minute or so of idling.
The only time I purposely warm up the vehicle for any length of time is when it is very cold. Anything -30 C or colder, and I will allow the vehicle to warm for about 5 minutes (never more than that though). I do this to help let the oil circulate before I put a load on the engine, and to help other components warm a bit. At these temperatures the power steering gets stiff and the transmission can be slow to engage on some cars (our Civic's transmission is very slow when cold). This week we had four mornings where the temp was approx -40 C, and that is just TOO cold to start and drive instantly.
Under both situations (no idle in warmer temps, and idling in colder temps), I always drive gently until the temperature comes up. I won't drive the vehicle hard until I see the oil pressure drop to normal (so I know the oil has warmed up to normal temps).
As a side note, most of my co-workers warm their vehicles for 20-30 mins in the winter. They want a warm car before they even start to drive.
The only time I purposely warm up the vehicle for any length of time is when it is very cold. Anything -30 C or colder, and I will allow the vehicle to warm for about 5 minutes (never more than that though). I do this to help let the oil circulate before I put a load on the engine, and to help other components warm a bit. At these temperatures the power steering gets stiff and the transmission can be slow to engage on some cars (our Civic's transmission is very slow when cold). This week we had four mornings where the temp was approx -40 C, and that is just TOO cold to start and drive instantly.
Under both situations (no idle in warmer temps, and idling in colder temps), I always drive gently until the temperature comes up. I won't drive the vehicle hard until I see the oil pressure drop to normal (so I know the oil has warmed up to normal temps).
As a side note, most of my co-workers warm their vehicles for 20-30 mins in the winter. They want a warm car before they even start to drive.
Originally Posted By: PT1
I have 2 female drivers with #3 in the loop. I am lucky to get them to wait 30 seconds...which is why I use PP.
Me? I wait 1-2 minutes then go easy. 1 minute is sufficient in any temperature above -10F for an engine to oil up.
Women generally are --->
Enough said!
I have 2 female drivers with #3 in the loop. I am lucky to get them to wait 30 seconds...which is why I use PP.
Me? I wait 1-2 minutes then go easy. 1 minute is sufficient in any temperature above -10F for an engine to oil up.
Women generally are --->
Kestas
Staff member
I can't (or don't want to) afford the gas for warmup in the winter. I just start the car and two minutes later I'm on the freeway. I could care less what this does to the engine. With all the salt in the winter, the engine is still going to outlast the rest of the car, as they always do in Detroit.
Not if you get the car rust-proofed for the winter. I have driven my old van that seen 20 harsh Canadian winters with lots of Road Salt and the body went to the scrap-yard looking new. I would probably still be driving it except it had 400,000KM on it, was burning lots of oil and I had an electrical fire that rendered it useless.
It was KROWN Rust Controlled every year for $100.00. I still can't believe that most Americans don't have these shops or don't have their cars sprayed and yet you live in the rust belts...
It was KROWN Rust Controlled every year for $100.00. I still can't believe that most Americans don't have these shops or don't have their cars sprayed and yet you live in the rust belts...
Kestas
Staff member
My 91 Grand Marquis was rustproofed from Day 1 using a Krown equivalent. The rustproofing is refreshed every 3 years. I've always done the work myself with a sprayer and getting excellent results. The coated surfaces are rust-free.
The problem is that the body starts rusting on the outside, from the corners of the visible surface and sometimes even in the middle of the panel. This year I tackled the rust spots by detrimming the car, sandblasting the rust away, phosphate coating, and properly painting the spots. One month later in the salt season, the rust is reemerging. What more can I do? It's a losing battle.
I agree with your last sentence. What I can't believe is all the posts I read on the internet of people who are willing to spend a lot of time fixing the rust on their cars, yet give no thought to preventing it in the first place.
The problem is that the body starts rusting on the outside, from the corners of the visible surface and sometimes even in the middle of the panel. This year I tackled the rust spots by detrimming the car, sandblasting the rust away, phosphate coating, and properly painting the spots. One month later in the salt season, the rust is reemerging. What more can I do? It's a losing battle.
I agree with your last sentence. What I can't believe is all the posts I read on the internet of people who are willing to spend a lot of time fixing the rust on their cars, yet give no thought to preventing it in the first place.
I have spoken to a lot of people south of the Border and they aren't aware of this process etc...
I'm not sure why you are having rust keep emerging, I have never had any with my vehicles using Krown on a yearly basis...
Maybe that's the key? once a year?
I'm not sure why you are having rust keep emerging, I have never had any with my vehicles using Krown on a yearly basis...
Maybe that's the key? once a year?
Kestas, i have used something called metal prep that i got at an auto body supply shop, a liquid poured over steel wool, and rubbed into the bear metal. Dont get any of it on the paint, it will wreck it.
When i have used that method before touching up the paint, i never had the rust come back.
When i have used that method before touching up the paint, i never had the rust come back.
I've always been a firm believer of long warm up times in cold weather on vehicles I plan to keep long term. My car, I let the idle drop down by itself then I'll tap the gas slightly a couple of times then I'll put it in gear for atleast a minute then drive easy.
But my truck I usually don't wait quite as long, maybe two minutes then go. The manual has no problems but the atf power steering is tight for about 5 or 10 minutes of driving(and I just flushed it recently).
But my truck I usually don't wait quite as long, maybe two minutes then go. The manual has no problems but the atf power steering is tight for about 5 or 10 minutes of driving(and I just flushed it recently).
Sandblasting properly should remove any and all rust? Are you sure you got it all? Are you sure it's not coming from the back side as mine is? Also if you don't put a good sealer and paint on it, moisture can actually seep through the microscopic pores of some paints and recause rust.
If it's really cold I'll let it run a couple of minutes to get the fluids moving, and then take it easy until things get up to normal operating temps. Letting it sit there for 10 minutes idling just wastes gas and doesn't do anything good for the car. They are designed to operate in cold weather, no owner's manual I have ever seen recommends letting the engine warm up completely before driving.
I have a formula.
One second at idle for every degree below freezing f. That is at +22f, ten seconds at idle and so on. Above freezing, start and go.
One second at idle for every degree below freezing f. That is at +22f, ten seconds at idle and so on. Above freezing, start and go.
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