VW workers in Tennessee vote to join UAW in historic win for Detroit union

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If unions would operate in good faith I would be all for them. However I have seen otherwise especially in the construction industry.

As a young man I took a summer job building a power plant. Everything was union. It seemed as if one particular union was pitting itself against another on the jobsite. No cooperation there. The construction engineers would not dirty their hand for a minute with a shovel to scrape away a piece of dirt. They insisted on having a union laborer standing around all day to do 15 minutes of light work. Water pump maintenance people who would not want to lift a pump out of a pit, wanted a laborer to ride around with them all day to do that. It was inefficient to say the least. Or an electrician who is on a ladder asks me to please hand them their tool bag and for that I get screamed at by a laborer boss telling me not to do it because it is the job of an electrician to do. No wonder we can't afford to build nuclear power plants

A family member worked union as a plumber doing a hospital. He was diligent in his job. He installed four commercial toilets a day. All others were slackers doing just two. He was directed to slow down because the job would be done too early and put jobs at risk. This is why we are unable to build cost effectively. No one really looking at the big picture here.

I think back to Bethlehem Steel and how a very very greedy union sunk the place. They had benefits out the gazoo. Eventually unable to compete with others it went down. 43,000 jobs lost forever. They were an economic engine for Baltimore. Now without those jobs and the many businesses they supported Baltimore is a waste without much opportunity for the working Joe. I blame part of the Baltimore woes on that union.

I am not completely anti union. But I am often very skeptical because of the rubbish I have seen and experienced.

Is it really possible to have a stand up good union? I would hope so but have many doubts.
 
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It’s easy to think all unions are bad when you work in an office in air conditioning and make 6 figures in an ivory tower. You’re not outside in 100 degree heat in a ditch working with your hands or on a ladder hanging pipe in 20 degree howling wind in a concrete parking garage as the lowest bidder on a job where you’re just a human commodity. You’re not dealing with asbestos and threatened to get the job done without proper PPE or remediation and told to “just get the job done or get fired”. You’re not fired at the drop of a hat when you get hurt on the job from dangerous working conditions. You’re not fired when you turn 50 simply because you can’t work as fast as a 20 year old. Maybe people just don’t want to be treated like cattle and want better protections? If companies don’t want unions maybe offer better conditions to compete? If the UAW didn’t exist in the US do people really think all the car manufacturers would be doing their best to keep as good of a workplace? Aren’t options and competition in a free market a good thing for everyone?

All I’m saying is there’s no 100% right or wrong answer to anything as complex as a labor union, but I’ve also read Grapes of Wrath…. If there wasn’t a single Union in America I don’t think our working conditions would improve…competition is a good thing. Working in a steel mill is different than working a desk job…
Well, said but let me add this. Hey, we are a free people, majority rules, so good for those who were able to improve their wage and working conditions. We dont have to defend corporations or unions, we just have to defend the right to be free and vote accordingly.

I learned a long time ago, well not that long ago, for fact, any workplace were there is a threat of a union forming, workers are treated MUCH better. However over time, even those companies tend to forget, a union reminds them and the workers right to chose.

As far as CEOs pay though, I feel the same, hey, in this world get what you can, I hold no grudges however it is evident that Elon Musks pay compensation is FUEL to the fire for workers to vote there fair share too.

I dont judge unions bad or good, corporations bad or good. Being a free people, you get what you can is all I care about. Easy to sit in a chair and discount all the good unions have done and cherry pick some bad apples, hey, that is the way the world works, believe it or not, not all the politicians YOU (not you personally) vote for are honest either. In case anyone doesn't know and you or you friends put them in office.
 
Looks like Volkswagen will be leaving the US soon.
Nope, VW is all unionized around the world. In fact in Germany the main VW union actually has a seat on the Board of Directors.
I suspect this may cascade through the entire non union auto industry in the USA. It will be fun to watch and see what happens.
I think maybe we will be entering a new union era.
 
I am sorry, I am not pro or against unions, but this is hyperbole. None of this nonsense has been the case since basic employment laws came into existence back in the 30's.

If workers want to negotiate as a block that is there right. None of it is about safety, and very little spills into other sectors. Its for them, and them alone, and as I said, is there right if they wish.
I was in unions years ago so not sure what they are like today … However, working for long established, well organized, and successful companies can mean the divide becomes more narrow. They need to retain a quality workforce, communicate long term goals - therefore award longer term employees - and they set HSE as a core value …
 
Outsourcing to foreign countries?
PS: I'm not anti-union and believe they are often needed but in my experience the vast majority of 'union bosses' are just politicians who are in it more for themselves than for their fellow union members.
This. Safeway union reps were absolutely useless. It's the only company that I worked for that my coworkers hot better pay and benefits because they went on strike years earlier.
 
They were,/are, recent UAW wins with GM, Ford lit the fire. We now live in a world were fast food workers are now making over 40k a year.
Everyone wants their share, i think the key win will be Tesla if they can get it.

All the non union workers got a nice bump in pay including just recently BMW in SC because of the UAW wins in Detroit. Without the union threat these workers wouldn’t be treated as well. I think the non union companies lost a connection and inclusion with their workers and … don’t ask me how I know environment at some places have changed over the last several years.

I can see this spreading all over the USA. 🇺🇸 it very well may be the time. But as we know some years down the road it may go too far yet right now, workers want a piece of their CEOs pay not just crumbs.
At least it's not like working for Henry Ford. He offered a higher salary with a caveat. If you took the higher pay then he could drop by and Inspect your home. He also expected you to be married if you were between a certain age. I've also read he'd drop by for dinner unannounced on multiple occasions. Thankfully supervisors can't do this any more.
 
This doesn't mean much and won't set off a wave in the south like the UAW thinks it will.

VW actually wanted a union, so they can run it the same way they run all their other facilities. They use what's called a works-council, where half the board is made of labor workers. In the US, the courts ruled the works-council illegal without a union.

For this reason, they used far less anti-union bullying and intimidation than others such as Nissan.
 
If it gets too expensive to manufacture in 'the South'...the companies will move further south....as in Central or South America.
Make no mistake about it....the push to 'globalism' will make some people better off but it won't be working class Americans.
Has even happened in aerospace - so folks think it won’t continue in automotive?
 
If unions would operate in good faith I would be all for them. However I have seen otherwise especially in the construction industry.

As a young man I took a summer job building a power plant. Everything was union. It seemed as if one particular union was pitting itself against another on the jobsite. No cooperation there. The construction engineers would not dirty their hand for a minute with a shovel to scrape away a piece of dirt. They insisted on having a union laborer standing around all day to do 15 minutes of light work. Water pump maintenance people who would not want to lift a pump out of a pit, wanted a laborer to ride around with them all day to do that. It was inefficient to say the least. Or an electrician who is on a ladder asks me to please hand them their tool bag and for that I get screamed at by a laborer boss telling me not to do it because it is the job of an electrician to do. No wonder we can't afford to build nuclear power plants

A family member worked union as a plumber doing a hospital. He was diligent in his job. He installed four commercial toilets a day. All others were slackers doing just two. He was directed to slow down because the job would be done too early and put jobs at risk. This is why we are unable to build cost effectively. No one really looking at the big picture here.

I think back to Bethlehem Steel and how a very very greedy union sunk the place. They had benefits out the gazoo. Eventually unable to compete with others it went down. 43,000 jobs lost forever. They were an economic engine for Baltimore. Now without those jobs and the many businesses they supported Baltimore is a waste without much opportunity for the working Joe. I blame part of the Baltimore woes on that union.

I am not completely anti union. But I am often very skeptical because of the rubbish I have seen and experienced.

Is it really possible to have a stand up good union? I would hope so but have many doubts.
Speaking of power plant construction, the line used for people building Darlington in the 80's and early 90's was "hide and seek for a grand a week".
 
Expect to see more of it. The demographers have been predicting this for some time. Baby boomer retirement has lead to worker shortage. Can't offshore to China anymore, Mexico is full, etc.

So the workers have leverage. Started at the lowest end first - restaurant, gas station - simply because those people can walk to your competitor next door and start today for a buck more, so they did. Then UAW and UPS and and the trades.
Seems the solution in Canada is to just import more people willing to work those positions. We imported 1.5 million of them last year apparently. We have no housing though, so real estate prices are INSANE, and only getting worse. And of course we also have the exploding homeless and opioid addiction problem.
Screenshot 2024-04-20 111029.webp
 
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A win for the unions. A loss for the consumers. But I guess the unions figure if fast food workers deserve $20 an hour in California they need to make some inflated wages and benefits commensurate with what they do for a living too.
 
This doesn't mean much and won't set off a wave in the south like the UAW thinks it will.

VW actually wanted a union, so they can run it the same way they run all their other facilities. They use what's called a works-council, where half the board is made of labor workers. In the US, the courts ruled the works-council illegal without a union.

For this reason, they used far less anti-union bullying and intimidation than others such as Nissan.
Well, your making predictions that may or may not happen, we will see.
Every politician in the state of TN - VW area was asking/campaigning workers to say no as it was going to hurt the economy and future. After all they are now less competitive for other companies to come in.
VW states they are good with the union as you said but lets remember, they built a manufacturing plant in TN at the time because it was a right to work state and no union, no different than that of the other non union right to work states and why automakers started operations there.
 
I happen to know a very successful CEO who was raised as one of three boys in a 2 BR frame house … these boys had very, very, tough parents - and were raised to work hard, hit the books, and beat the competition …
All three are very successful … Are they bad guys ?
100% agree, in our free world, we are free to make whatever wage the market will bear. Heck, the current CEO of Walmart was unloading Walmart trucks part time when he was 16 years old, no one, including his parents gave him anything. Many CEOs started out with that work ethic.
 
If it gets too expensive to manufacture in 'the South'...the companies will move further south....as in Central or South America.
Make no mistake about it....the push to 'globalism' will make some people better off but it won't be working class Americans.
This is the great part about a free market and being a free person, if this happens, so it will be. Better than a dictator telling you what you will earn. It's not a push to globalism being an American and demanding better pay. This has happened since the early 1900's and we are still here and a world leader. If we are not that leader, then market forces will force us to lower wages, hasn't happened yet but if it does, so be it.
 
Are unions good or evil? Depends on which side of the deal you are on?
In Silicon Valley, there are unions for the trades; there are also a lot of tradesmen who are non-union.

Do athletes deserve that kinda cash? I guess those soccer players do, because, "Give blood; plat soccer".
I have never been in a union, but I did tree work for years making squat and being called every name in the book by the boss. Very hard, dangerous work. Dirty.
Then I got a desk job, went to work clean, fooled around with a computer in an air conditioned office and went home clean. Made a lot.

JMO, but people seem to be upset when others prosper but feel they deserve more. I may not agree with lotsa salaries (athletes, etc.) but believe in their right to get what they can.
 
I work for a company that has unions on the manufacturing side of the business….. but no unions on the service side.

I’m a non union service employee and the company gave us the same benefits just so we didn’t start a union.
I have a pension, voluntary pension, 401K and 10 weeks total PTO.

It can be done….
 
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The Union didn't do much for the folks employed at the Westmoreland, Pennsylvania, Volkswagen plant. Do you guys remember that freak show? They shut it down in 1988 due to poor sales, bad quality, and VW had actually considered pulling out of the North American market.
 
They were,/are, recent UAW wins with GM, Ford lit the fire. We now live in a world were fast food workers are now making over 40k a year.
Everyone wants their share, i think the key win will be Tesla if they can get it.

All the non union workers got a nice bump in pay including just recently BMW in SC because of the UAW wins in Detroit. Without the union threat these workers wouldn’t be treated as well. I think the non union companies lost a connection and inclusion with their workers and … don’t ask me how I know environment at some places have changed over the last several years.

I can see this spreading all over the USA. 🇺🇸 it very well may be the time. But as we know some years down the road it may go too far yet right now, workers want a piece of their CEOs pay not just crumbs.

How big was the bump in pay at BMW ?

I do believe Tesla will have a union within 3 years.
 
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