VW EV sales tops Tesla in Germany

Cybers styling and utility is a disappointment. I dont think non truck guys should design trucks.

Cybers delivery has been laughable - true it the lowest vehicular priority- and it shows.

Whether cyber is a disaster or not has everything to do with its numbers.
It could be a runaway hit with people using trucks like cars which is a very high % of truck buyers.
I doubt it will replace the trucks that lead the market today even if it had similar range under tow.
 
PimTac said:
Not necessarily true. The automaker can design a chassis that can be used on multiple cars. There is some commonality between models.
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It's not necessarily the chassis which commonality can help. The USA is the only country that I'm aware of that requires a separate crash test, epa certification, and separate California (CARB) certification for every variable of model offered. The epa is increasingly more hostile towards manual transmission vehicles. For instance, BMW was initially planning on offering the new M5 wagon alongside the sedan. BUT BMW would have had to separately crash and epa test it which would have been an additional $2-$3 Million dollars for what a couple hundred sales?
 
UncleDave said:
Cybers styling and utility is a disappointment. I dont think non truck guys should design trucks.

Cybers delivery has been laughable - true it the lowest vehicular priority- and it shows.

Whether cyber is a disaster or not has everything to do with its numbers.
It could be a runaway hit with people using trucks like cars which is a very high % of truck buyers.
I doubt it will replace the trucks that lead the market today even if it had similar range under tow.
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This really is a massive problem. It takes up so much space and burns so much more fuel, but people love their trucks and don't seem to care how much more money it costs them. It can only be worse with EVs as far as I can tell considering how much larger the battery has to be for the same range. I'd think it would be felt when charging, especially if it's a fast charger.
 
DwightFrye said:
I consider the delay of the Cybertruck more of a disappointment than a disaster. As I said, if the management at Tesla thought it was a disaster they would have directed the resources towards sorting out whatever issues there were and brought it to market sooner.

But just like the so called fit and finish issues that a few people always bring up but don't seem to be a real world issue considering the owner satisfaction ratings, the rather comical delay of the Cybertruck is the usual ammunition that people use who hate Tesla or Elon. It doesn't seem like honest criticism but rather like a talking point that is readily available to use in discussions.

The Cybertruck will be in the hands of consumers soon. And they will be shipping them to those who put down deposits as quickly as they can make them. My impeccable logic also tells me that the new "Model 2" or whatever they will call the lower priced model that will be built at the new Mexico plant won't suffer the kind of delays that the Cybertruck did. Why ? Because it is a high priority for Tesla. While the Cybertruck was not.
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It's not those who "hate" the Muskrat. He's publicly said recently that Tesla put 5 projects on hold and Tesla has spent according to Elon "untold sums" of money on the cybertruck. He's Also an arrogant buffoon who claimed that "Tesla is "so far ahead nobody will build an all-electric truck before them." Well Ford,GM and rivian have more or less told Tesla to hold my beer and beat them. If I was on the board of directors at Tesla the Muskrat would have been given the boot years ago. He's a liability at this point.
 
Vercingetorix said:
I’ve driven a Tesla M3P multiple times and know how abysmal the suspension is. Doubt the VW is that bad.
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Thedrive just did a comparison of an older model s and new model 3 both were similarly priced. The writer took them on city highway backroads etc. He was shocked at how stiff and uncomfortable the model 3 was.
 
97prizm said:
It's not necessarily the chassis which commonality can help. The USA is the only country that I'm aware of that requires a separate crash test, epa certification, and separate California (CARB) certification for every variable of model offered. The epa is increasingly more hostile towards manual transmission vehicles. For instance, BMW was initially planning on offering the new M5 wagon alongside the sedan. BUT BMW would have had to separately crash and epa test it which would have been an additional $2-$3 Million dollars for what a couple hundred sales?
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I know it sounds ridiculous but can you imagine the outcry if there was a structural rigidity issue if bracing for the tunnel had to be modified for a different transmission? I would say look at Ford's F150. They have a bolted in structural crash bar in front of the front tires. They don't fit with 35 inch tires turning without rubbing, so they just don't install them on the Raptor. The early 2 door and extended cabs for the 2015 model year didn't have them and the 4 door did. Eventually the other trucks got them too, except for the Raptor for the tire clearance issues. Here's the difference between this one bar. Sure the cab is different, but it seems do deflect a lot of energy. I couldn't seem to find the test of crash bars with and without in the same video other than the 4 door has them and the extended cab in this video does not.

 
97prizm said:
Thedrive just did a comparison of an older model s and new model 3 both were similarly priced. The writer took them on city highway backroads etc. He was shocked at how stiff and uncomfortable the model 3 was.
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I haven't driven an early Model 3, but I've heard the suspension was stiffer. I don't have any complains on our 2023, but it has the 18"s so it has more sidewall. I was talking about this with my wife, but I think even with the lower profile tires on the GTI it rides slightly better, but I have electronically adjustable dampers so I can soften the suspension when I want to. Set to normal they're pretty close in ride quality. I'm sure lower profile tires would change that in the case of a M3P, but I've not been in one. It's stiff, but it handles well and I might not be the best judge of ride quality because I almost always buy performance cars. I definitely wouldn't call it uncomfortable.
 
Torrid said:
I know it sounds ridiculous but can you imagine the outcry if there was a structural rigidity issue if bracing for the tunnel had to be modified for a different transmission? I would say look at Ford's F150. They have a bolted in structural crash bar in front of the front tires. They don't fit with 35 inch tires turning without rubbing, so they just don't install them on the Raptor. The early 2 door and extended cabs for the 2015 model year didn't have them and the 4 door did. Eventually the other trucks got them too, except for the Raptor for the tire clearance issues. Here's the difference between this one bar. Sure the cab is different, but it seems do deflect a lot of energy. I couldn't seem to find the test of crash bars with and without in the same video other than the 4 door has them and the extended cab in this video does not.

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Have they crash tested a charged Lightening?
 
Pelican said:
No it was EV specific. The reasons given were Much higher purchase price, depreciation 50% after 2 yrs, Battery life and replacement cost. All factors that are appearing now after a few years, now this was in the UK, but I'm sure it applies throughout. I was surprised as I thought that IF it would work anywhere it would have worked in the EU as the distances are much shorter.
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find me an EV in my area that has depreciated 50% in 2 years and I will go buy it.
 
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