voltswagon Jetta TDI?

[Quattro Pete]

Well, I was talking about the 1.9TDI - a lot of my friends had them in their audi 80 and A4. Sure, nice torque especially when chipped, but the sound and the smoke... But that was 10+ years ago.
Originally Posted By: FowVay
Pete, we're not talking about the obnoxious Ford Powerstroke diesel

 

[FowVay]

This is a bit off-topic but it's still about Volkswagen and diesel engines. Back in my early driving days I had both a 1980 Scirocco S and a Rabbit LS diesel (a 1981 Westmoreland, Pa product). Talk about noisy and smokey.. that Rabbit was something else. It was the slowest vehicle I've EVER ridden in and that includes bicycles. Those old A1's were just plain crude.

My Scirocco S was a different story. It wasn't fast but it sure was fun. I think that it was solely responsible for causing me to fall in love with driving. You know you're obsessed when your commute home from the Atlanta airport includes a side trek through Chattanooga, Tn. and you live on the south side of town.

So people can use whatever excuse they need to justify their vehicle purchases. At the end of the day it's all about what makes YOU happy,,, what brings the grin to YOUR face,,, and what makes the journey more important than the destination.

 

[talker]

COOL!

 

[talker]

By the way, who don't like 50 mpg??????

 

[FowVay]

But to get that 50MPG's you have to put up with that stinky, hard to find fuel, change those timing belts every 100,000 thousand miles, and who knows what other craziness you have to do in order to own one of those things. The next thing you know they'll be trying to take over Porsche AG. Then we'll have to deal with that arrogance.

Sheesh, where does it end?

 

[Bill in Utah]

Originally Posted By: talker
By the way, who don't like 50 mpg??????


*IF* you get it.

You can buy MUCH SIMPLER CHEAPER vehicle that will knock off 40MPG PLUS and that is SIMPLE to own.

Plus you can get fuel at every station. And NEVER any issues starting in cold weather.

I'm averaging 44mpg with a car (and that is over 142k miles) that does not have 3 cats.

Take care, Bill

 

[StevieC]

I think Bill has it right... You need to look at the total cost of ownership per mile returned. Fuel/Maintenance/Repairs all included. I think a 40mpg gasoline car might just beat out a 50mpg diesel from VW

 

[unDummy]

Bill makes a good point. The environmentalists don't want us to drive. So, they are doing everything they can to kill the best fuel out there. The complexity of current diesel requirements will be a mega failure point in 5 years or so.

For a lease vehicle or company car, I would jump at the chance for a TDI Golf, Jetta, or Sportwagon. To own it, I would rather pay a little more for simplicity of my gas powered cars.

Now, if they hack the ECM and dial out the egr's, remove the particulate and cat's, and program 'out' some complexity for us do-it-yourselfers, I'd consider it.

 

[StevieC]

Originally Posted By: unDummy
...
Now, if they hack the ECM and dial out the egr's, remove the particulate and cat's, and program 'out' some complexity for us do-it-yourselfers, I'd consider it.


Fat chance... You'd have a better chance at winning the lottery 10 times!

I read an interesting article somewhere, where the guy called the PCM a "Pollution Causing Module" because they don't want us to be efficient.

We can put a man on the moon back in the 60's, but somehow Fuel Economy based on engine size hasn't changed much in the last 30 years and we've got more sensors and control now than we ever have so what was the point? ?!?

 

[rationull]

Originally Posted By: StevieC

We can put a man on the moon back in the 60's, but somehow Fuel Economy based on engine size hasn't changed much in the last 30 years and we've got more sensors and control now than we ever have so what was the point? ?!?

We've got:

- More power from the same displacement
- Less required routine maintenance
- A reduction in "smog forming" emissions

Not saying I agree with it. This is just my perception of the answer to that question.

 

[StevieC]

I'm talking about Fuel Economy... Yes all the above is true, but where is the Fuel Economy?

The Smog forming emissions aren't really to do with the computer so much as it is to do with the EGR/PCV which are for the most part mechanical on most cars. So why the Computer/Fuel Injection?

 

[rationull]

Originally Posted By: StevieC
I'm talking about Fuel Economy... Yes all the above is true, but where is the Fuel Economy?

The Smog forming emissions aren't really to do with the computer so much as it is to do with the EGR/PCV which are for the most part mechanical on most cars. So why the Computer/Fuel Injection?


The problem is engines *have* gotten more efficient, in terms of power output per unit fuel consumed. All the advancements have been used to increase power, though, at least to some extent.

EFI has definitely contributed to these efficiency (power output) gains, as well as reduced maintenance requirements (adjusting points anyone? Don't even have a distributor cap to change anymore on most cars!) Not to mention being able exert better control than carbs such that cars can run efficiently, smoothly, and without excess emissions in a large variety of temperatures, altitudes, and weather conditions despite being nearly "adjustment free". Can't really say that about carbs.

EDIT: To stay closer to topic, I think the same thing is true of modern diesels. They've made sacrifices in order to become smoother and more adaptable to varying conditions -- e.g. newer TDIs can start up just fine in the cold.

My GF's dad has a 2005 TDI w/ 5 speed manual -- this is the "pump-nozzle" engine, not the same as the new ones. It's been fairly reliable for him, no major problems in 90k miles or so. Phenomenal car to drive, lots of torque. Feels very much faster than it is.

 

[rshunter]

Originally Posted By: pbm
Maybe Voltswagon is Volkswagons new electric vehicle.

The VW diesel is a very good economical car BUT I think you are better off with a Corolla, Yaris, Civic etc....if mpg (and total ownership costs) are your goal.***

***in other words the VW may get a few more mpg's but you pay for it with the expensive maintanence and the higher cost for diesel fuel.

Both of those labels must be cheap Chinese rip-offs of the Volkswagen brand.

As an owner of a VW diesel, I can say that total operational costs aren't as egregious as many make them out to be. This is true of essentially any VW. If you can handle the most basic of maintenance yourself, it's even less. Oil changes are no big deal, the same goes for swapping the fuel filter. The cabin and air filters are a no-brainer. I've also never been stuck with the dealer being my only source of maintenance items.

It's true that the oil isn't available at every old parts store, but how often do you really need to buy it? I seek out the deals and typically buy it a case (3 5-liter jugs) at a time. The 40K-mile DSG service (and the special fluid required) isn't a big deal either. It's not a simple "drop the pan" job, but it's far from rocket science. There are plenty of kids with little mechanical experience who've done the job successfully.

The belt change is a bit more complicated, but it only comes along every 100K. If you're not comfortable with a DIY job, there are plenty of shops that can handle it. The tools aren't a Volkswagen exclusive, either. There are a number of suppliers for virtually every VAG tool you could ever need. You just need to look...

If one wishes to get raped by a dealer, you can take your pick among any of the available brands. They're all quite happy to oblige.

 

[rshunter]

Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Also, I'd be careful with any Bio-Fuel as I'd HATE to have to deal with VW while in warranty and play the blame game.

Volkswagen officially approved the use of B5 way back in 2005.

 

[rshunter]

Originally Posted By: wvrailroader
What is NOT different, however, is the ignorance of the VW techs, the (over)price of the parts, and the cost of maintenance on VW vehicles. I just thought I would share my experience and why I will never buy another import, much less a VW. Ford has always served me well and I will stick with what I know. I look back at the VW as a mistake to be learned from.

Funny, my dad says the same thing. The only difference is that the brands and continents of origin are reversed. He also adds numerous other domestic brands to the list. You name one, he's had it (in more ways than one, I might add).

Tales of a Ford with one bolt holding the starter on. The undersized radiator leading to constant overheating problems. But I think the best one is about guys walking in from lunch saying, "Hey, Hunter! Isn't that your Ford parked outside? I think the thing is on fire..."

Lesson? There is no such thing as a "universal reality".

 

[rshunter]

Originally Posted By: FowVay
My Scirocco S was a different story. It wasn't fast but it sure was fun. I think that it was solely responsible for causing me to fall in love with driving. You know you're obsessed when your commute home from the Atlanta airport includes a side trek through Chattanooga, Tn. and you live on the south side of town.

Sounds like my typical commute...

P.S.: One has to be honest though, diesel is about as hard to find as a pot-hole.