Valvoline Maxlife 10w30, 4539 miles, 1995 Lumina

[JerryS]

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Make/Model: 1995 Chevrolet Lumina

Engine: GM (V6) 191 M SFI 3.1L

Miles on car: 85,000

Miles on oil: 4,539

Time on oil: 1/3/06 to 8/30/06

Oil: 4 quarts 10w30 Valvoline Maxlife (dino) and 1 quart 5w30 Havoline (dino)

Make-up oil: none

Filter: Purolator Premium Plus (L10111)

Driving habits: 50/50 city/highway

Lab: Blackstone Laboratories



This run: Universal averages:

ALUMINUM 5 1

CHROMIUM 0 3

IRON 10 17

COPPER 6 11

LEAD 3 6

TIN 0 1

MOLYBDENUM 264 65

NICKEL 0 0

MANGANESE 0 1

SILVER 0 0

TITANIUM 0 0

POTASSIUM 13 11

BORON 18 33

SILICON 32 15

SODIUM 11 16

CALCIUM 2220 1896

MAGNESIUM 14 177

PHOSPHORUS 668 714

ZINC 804 877

BARIUM 0 0







SUS vis @ 210 °F: 59.9

Flashpoint in °F: 495

Fuel %: < 0.5

Antifreeze: ?

Water: TR

Insolubles: 0.4

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Blackstone’s comments:
“Wear metals look good in the first sample from this engine. You noted a slight tick at start-up, and that would normally indicate some minor piston slap or a tappet problem, though since wear looks okay, we don't think it's anything to worry about. Universal averages show normal wear levels from the GM 3.1L after ~ 4,000 miles use on the oil. We did find some excess silicon and some possible anti-freeze. Both may be normal if you have recently had the engine worked on. If not, check the air filter and watch your coolant level. Everything else looks okay.”

And mine:
Overall, I’m pretty happy with this report. The wear doesn’t look too bad to me; I’m glad that my engine isn’t falling apart or something. I used quite a few gas additives during this run (Techron, Regane, Lucas UCL, etc.) if that makes any difference; my understanding is that this can affect wear on the bearings and whatnot. [No real reason for using them, I was just tinkering.] Average gas mileage hangs around 24 mpg. Car has very likely had 5w30 or 10w30 dino most of its life.

One of the primary things I was looking for with this UOA was coolant, and it looks like they found some (although it doesn’t appear to be a whole lot). I’ve read through the intake manifold gasket replacement stuff on this site, and it doesn’t sound like fun to me. I think I probably have the skills to do it, but would honestly rather just take the easy way out via a tube or two of good old Bar’s Stop Leak. I’m not expecting it to do any miracles, but if I can slow the leak to a crawl, a minute amount of antifreeze in my oil doesn’t seem to be doing too much harm. Maybe sample again in 2 or 3 oil changes to see how my little car is doing. That seems reasonable to me for now unless someone points out a pertinent piece of information that I’m yet unaware of (quite probable). I don’t know how fast this kind of problem progresses. The car has/has had the plain green coolant, not Dex-Cool, and the cooling system is in pretty good shape, FWIW.

I haven’t done any major work recently, so I figure that my air filter just needs to be replaced. It’s one of those regular paper ones (Fram I think), so no big deal. I’ll take a look at it soon. The lifter tick I’m still not sure about. My best bet at this point seems to be some kind of additive (e.g. Auto-Rx), but it really doesn’t bother me that much. It’s not that loud to begin with, and it only lasts for maybe 20 seconds at startup and then goes away. I think I’m going to leave it alone.

This was my first UOA ever, and I had a lot of fun going through all the steps and reading the report/trying to figure out what it meant. The people at Blackstone were very quick; they sent me their analysis within about a day of the sample arriving. If I do a second one of these in the future, I will probably use them again. (Maybe even get a “Dyson analysis” too!) Comments are welcome.

 

[m2200b]

Another plus with Blackstone. If they had seen coolant and damage they would have called you on the phone and emailed.
Do you actually need to add coolant? I don't see a lot in the metals and iron may be your fuel adds. Your Silicon # points to intake air leak, poor filter or something.

 

[ryansride2017]

I was using about a pint of antifreeze per 5k Mile oil change (month and a half duration) so I tried the Barrs Leak material out of curiosity. At the very least it slowed the leak as I haven't had to add any in the last 15K miles.

 

[Cutehumor]

do the bar's leak stuff for sure. you don't want any antifreeze in the oil. I would consider even going to 3k oci just to get the antifreeze out on a regular basis if it was my ride.

 

[TooSlick]

Jerry,

An easy and inexpensive thing you can do is thoroughly flush the cooling system and switch to a Propylene Glycol (PG) based coolant. These don't react with the engine oil in the event of a leak to form acidic sludge, as do the EG based products. You can find the Sierra brand at Walmart and Amsoil also makes an extended use, universal PG coolant. The Amsoil stuff is expensive (about $25.00/gallon) but good for 7 yrs/250k miles in cars and LD diesel pickups.

I'd try a PG coolant first and keep an eye on the levels of bearing wear through periodic UOA's....

TS

 

[Al]

I'd go with the GM Tabs. Although I believe they may just be the equivalent of Bars Leak. It will get worse-guaranteed-if you take no action.

 

[JerryS]

That's pretty interesting. I’ve seen Prestone’s version in stores (it has a picture of a dog on the front), but I've always assumed it doesn’t “do as well” in cars. I looked up the Sierra stuff (same people who make Peak evidently), and surprisingly enough, it meets ASTM D3306 and ASTM D4985, which is the same set of requirements for corrosion protection that the standard “all makes/models” Prestone is claiming to meet (no more, no less... per here and here ). The tradeoff though is apparently that the heat transfer ability, boiling point, and freezing points are slightly compromised with the PG kind. All other things being equal, Sierra’s freezing point (50% concentration) is -26°F and the regular Prestone (50% concentration) is -34°F... not so bad. However, the boiling point for Sierra (50% concentration) is 221°F while the regular Prestone (50% concentration) is 276°F. A 50 degree difference is a pretty big deal in my mind (and my climate). Not sure if I would want to use that, even if it saved my neighbor’s cat one day. If I can’t stop the leak and switching over will reduce the amount of acidic sludge piling up in my engine, I would have to weigh that against the sub-par performance in other areas I suppose. I’ll see if I can stop the leak first.

So I went to check on my air filter today, and I see that it doesn’t look that dirty, pretty clean in fact, except for a large mass of sunflower seed shells (GD squirrels). Then, lo and behold, I notice that my air filter has a wee bit of a kink in it . It appears that my filter woes are not due so much to the fault of the air filter, but rather the man who installed it. Apparently, when I put it in the last time, I didn’t do it right, and it has been sitting held down in the wrong position all the while, and so not sealing properly. (You have to sort of bend the intake around to get the filter in for this car. When I let go, it must have pulled up the one corner, which you can’t really see while installing it.) I bent it back in shape as well as I could, rotated it, and snugged it up tight (correctly this time). If I can catch a sale sometime soon, I might just go buy a new one.

After some reading, there appears to be a fairly strong consensus that a gently used air filter actually works (I mean filters dirt) better than a brand new one, which makes sense if you think about it (I guess). Suffice to say that my high silicon level was likely not due to my air filter being dirty; it was because all the air that was coming in was not getting filtered. Doh! Anyway, there you go. I hope my silicon level improves now.

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It will get worse-guaranteed-if you take no action.

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Do you have an idea of how long it takes for this to get bad? I know, dumb question, tons of variables, blah blah blah. What I mean is: is this the sort of thing that “typically” goes from tiny leak to gushing river overnight, or does it slowly increase in size over time?

 

[m2200b]

GMV6 leaks aren't rocket science. As it get worse you'll get trace coolant and higher iron. You should do a UOA as it shows the effect of a small leak,and watch the coolant levels religiously to catch to change to a big leak. Use a sharpie and mark your own line on the coolant resevoir.

 

[Drew99GT]

JerryS, the only intake leaker I've known of that essentially just blew and filled the crankcase with the entirety of the cooling system was my bros 4.3L GMC Jimmy. Coolent was to the top of the dipstick! Really, if you want any kind of long term longevity from the engine, get it fixed right. These engines are really great engines other than the intake leaks; they're good for hundreds of thousands of miles if you want it.

 

[JerryS]

Wow, that really sucks about your brother’s truck! What I'm worried about is another car nickel-and-diming me to death over a string of repairs; it always starts small with something like this. I’m more than willing to drop a few hundred bucks and some sweat on it to keep it running, but if it's going to get ridiculous, I'll just trade it in/upgrade to something else (with better gas mileage for one). The thing is, I "trust" this car because I've taken care of it/it has run terrifically up to this point, and I don't want to gamble on something new right now (there are always "moving" costs too). Plus, there’s the sentimental attachment: I anthropomorphize everything; we talk quite often just so I can see how she’s doing/let her know that she’s doing a good job...

The resale value on this car is a big goose egg, so every additional dollar she demands of me is putting us closer to “our” divorce (in the name of frugality). I read in another thread that there is some sort of “good will” program w/GM for an intake manifold gasket replacement that will only cost me $300. If that’s the case, then I might go for it instead of trying to pretend I’m a mechanic.

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Really, if you want any kind of long term longevity from the engine, get it fixed right.

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According to my main criteria, fixing it “right” means not making beds in a burning building.

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These engines are really great engines other than the intake leaks; they're good for hundreds of thousands of miles if you want it.

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That’s the kind of sermon this sinner needs to hear; preach it Drew! Just this one little problem, and then it will all be over. Just this ooooone thing...

I’ll go for the quick fix first, and if that holds for a reasonable length of time, then the type of repair I chose was “right” (for me). I know what you mean though (and you probably know what I mean too). The problem is that I have no real reference for how to define “reasonable” or “long term”. Will I really need or want this same car 5 years from now? Even 1 year from now, even though we’re still happy today? I’m not a “cut em loose early” type of guy, but I’m not going sit and play games either. (Are we still talking about cars? Yeah... sure.)

Anywho, my current plan of action is to dump powder in the radiator and then resample in a few oil changes, hoping it all works out in the mean time. Still (very) open to suggestions and comments though. TBC...

 

[TooSlick]

Jerry,

You're comparing the boiling points (BP's) with and without pressurized radiator caps....A 15 psi cap increases the BP of PG coolants by 40F to 45F. I've used the Amsoil product at a 50% concentration down here in Alabama since they came out with the stuff with no problem at all.

The specific heat of PG coolants is slightly lower than for EG. However they exhibit superior nucleate boiling behavior on hot surfaces (smaller bubbles), which reduces the potential for pitting/cavitation. This is why you can run the Amsoil product for 750k miles on OTR trucks without adding supplimental coolant additives (SCA's).

TS

 

[JerryS]

Good catch! The Prestone boiling/freezing point is WITH "a 15 lb pressure cap in good condition" (in amazingly tiny print if you click on the "technology" button to the right of the yellow jug in the Prestone link). The Sierra still has the same freezing point, but has a 256°F boiling point when you factor in a 15 lb cap. That's different. There are two charts in the Sierra website, and I think I must have read “-26°F” in the bottom one, switched windows (still running IE6), switched back, read the top one for boiling point by mistake, and kept on rolling without double-checking. I wasn't intentionally trying to mislead anyone. Hee-haw, I guess dat dur aint na good…

That’s neat about the pitting/cavitation thing. I like the way “superior nucleate boiling behavior” just kind of rolls off your tongue. Do you think a 20° difference in the boiling point would be of concern for the average consumer?