Back before I heard of this forum I ran almost half a can in my wife's 95 Volvo 850. It was neglected and coked the oil on the dipstick and who knows where else. It had a ticking like a lifter. I ran 10 hours on interstate over the weekend with the SeaFoam and the ticking went away and never came back. I worry now that it might be too aggresive and thin out the oil. I use it for fuel only now. I plan to use LC or AutoRX next time I need something like this done.
Using Sea Foam the first time with LC/FP
- Thread starter sifan
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After the Sea Foam treatment I cleaned the TB, and did a full oil change plus replacing the FF filter and the TP in the bypass filter. The TP looked like a roll of carbon. The Frantz bypass filter must have done a good job filtering out the carbon that Sea Foam cleaned out. Now I can feel the surge in throttle response as I slightly step on the gas. Before I had to hold the ignition for few second to crank up the engine every morning. It felt like the engine was waiting for fuel pump to deliver the fuel. Now the engine just starts right up. Thumbs up for Sea Foam.
I did add 5 oz of LC into the fresh oil since I got a whole gallon left, so, why not. I added 16 oz of Sea Foam to the tank instead of FP in the previous refueling. I got respectable 42.44 mpg over 400 miles in one tank which included many full open throttles, short trips, and rough running engine druing check engine light being up twice. Now I am with the second tank without FP added. So far with 100 miles of driving on quarter tank of gas, I see the gas mileage is holding up without FP. I will experiment with several more tanks of gas without FP to see if my engine really needs it.
I talked to a guy working at a Toyota parts department on the replacement of fuel filter. He said '03 Echo receives a newly designed fuel filter that stays maintenance free for a long time. I was also surprised to find out that Toyota starts using platinum spark plugs in '03 Echo which should last a little longer. I took his advise not to replace the fuel filter and spark plugs.
I did add 5 oz of LC into the fresh oil since I got a whole gallon left, so, why not. I added 16 oz of Sea Foam to the tank instead of FP in the previous refueling. I got respectable 42.44 mpg over 400 miles in one tank which included many full open throttles, short trips, and rough running engine druing check engine light being up twice. Now I am with the second tank without FP added. So far with 100 miles of driving on quarter tank of gas, I see the gas mileage is holding up without FP. I will experiment with several more tanks of gas without FP to see if my engine really needs it.
I talked to a guy working at a Toyota parts department on the replacement of fuel filter. He said '03 Echo receives a newly designed fuel filter that stays maintenance free for a long time. I was also surprised to find out that Toyota starts using platinum spark plugs in '03 Echo which should last a little longer. I took his advise not to replace the fuel filter and spark plugs.
JHZR2
Staff member
OK, first off, did you consider attributing a mileage drop to the introduction of oxygenated winter fuel? This can cause a multi-MPG drop.
Second, I assume that for a 1-2 year old car to have 21k miles, my guess is you do a lot of highway driving? If so, nothing should be that dirty, unless you use really cheap fuel.
I noticed a lot of engines pinging when I was down in TX last time in November. I rarely hear cars pinging or knocking in NJ, are you sure of your fuel's quality? I have to bet that the TX example is due to lower qualkity fuel or mandatory adds than in NJ.
Seafoam is pretty different chemically from gasoline. It will smoke if you put too much through it. Any time that youre doing a TB type cleaning, particularly when youre taking vacuum hoses off, sending stuff through them, etc., you run the risk of getting a CEL. It seems from my experience to be more common on smaller engines, I guess because each cylinder sparks more times to keep the same RPM? I wouldnt worry about it, just pull your EFI fuse.
The general concensus is that FP works pretty well. I have found that it has little effect on clean running, well maintained engines, and so it may not make your MPG go up. If you put too much in, I would venture to guess that it could make the engine run funny. That would be pretty hard to do, but I bet that car's fuel tank is only about 10 gallons, and so FP could dilute in pretty well in a relatively low quantity.
With those miles, that age of the car, a recorded drop in MPG (do you log it every time?) and a CEL, I would actually heavily consider just taking it to the dealer. Dont say about additives, cleaners, etc. Just say that youve noticed a drop in your MPG, the engine has been pinging recently, and now you have a CEL, so something must be wrong with the car.
JMH
Second, I assume that for a 1-2 year old car to have 21k miles, my guess is you do a lot of highway driving? If so, nothing should be that dirty, unless you use really cheap fuel.
I noticed a lot of engines pinging when I was down in TX last time in November. I rarely hear cars pinging or knocking in NJ, are you sure of your fuel's quality? I have to bet that the TX example is due to lower qualkity fuel or mandatory adds than in NJ.
Seafoam is pretty different chemically from gasoline. It will smoke if you put too much through it. Any time that youre doing a TB type cleaning, particularly when youre taking vacuum hoses off, sending stuff through them, etc., you run the risk of getting a CEL. It seems from my experience to be more common on smaller engines, I guess because each cylinder sparks more times to keep the same RPM? I wouldnt worry about it, just pull your EFI fuse.
The general concensus is that FP works pretty well. I have found that it has little effect on clean running, well maintained engines, and so it may not make your MPG go up. If you put too much in, I would venture to guess that it could make the engine run funny. That would be pretty hard to do, but I bet that car's fuel tank is only about 10 gallons, and so FP could dilute in pretty well in a relatively low quantity.
With those miles, that age of the car, a recorded drop in MPG (do you log it every time?) and a CEL, I would actually heavily consider just taking it to the dealer. Dont say about additives, cleaners, etc. Just say that youve noticed a drop in your MPG, the engine has been pinging recently, and now you have a CEL, so something must be wrong with the car.
JMH
Quit using everthing and see if mileage goes back up.
I'm a believer in preventive maintenance regardless of brand used. I don't see the need to Seafoam(through vacuumline) a low mileage engine that has regularly treatment(whether FI cleaners or UCLs). If a product does make a major difference, then it will be good to search for other problems within the vehicle. Clean/gap those spark plus. Change the air filter regularly. Check timing. Test the thermostat. Check the tire pressure. Search for vacuum leaks, grounding/electrical problems...........
A bottle of Seafoam(or most quality FI cleaners) in a full tank of gas is plenty every 3-5k miles. FP/LC is your choice. With Mobil1+bypass, I don't see why LC is needed. With FP, I don't see any need for other type of FI cleaners including Seafoam. But, peoples' experiences will differ. Thanks for being unbiased.
In my experience, Seafoam will work better if you let the engine stall out and sit overnight. You will get a "darker cloud" for a few seconds. White cloud to me means everything is clean already. Two people should be used when Seafoaming an engine. One to administer the dose and the other to run/throttleblip the vehicle.
Disconnect the vacuum hose(leak) for seafoam, the misfiring, the A/F ratios bouncing, could cause various codes.
I'm a believer in preventive maintenance regardless of brand used. I don't see the need to Seafoam(through vacuumline) a low mileage engine that has regularly treatment(whether FI cleaners or UCLs). If a product does make a major difference, then it will be good to search for other problems within the vehicle. Clean/gap those spark plus. Change the air filter regularly. Check timing. Test the thermostat. Check the tire pressure. Search for vacuum leaks, grounding/electrical problems...........
A bottle of Seafoam(or most quality FI cleaners) in a full tank of gas is plenty every 3-5k miles. FP/LC is your choice. With Mobil1+bypass, I don't see why LC is needed. With FP, I don't see any need for other type of FI cleaners including Seafoam. But, peoples' experiences will differ. Thanks for being unbiased.
In my experience, Seafoam will work better if you let the engine stall out and sit overnight. You will get a "darker cloud" for a few seconds. White cloud to me means everything is clean already. Two people should be used when Seafoaming an engine. One to administer the dose and the other to run/throttleblip the vehicle.
Disconnect the vacuum hose(leak) for seafoam, the misfiring, the A/F ratios bouncing, could cause various codes.
I agree that a well maintained engine doesn't need any additives at all. My best gas mileage had been achieved without any oil/gas additives. I just replaced the PCV and cleaned the MAF last weekend. I am getting 180+ miles on 3/8 of tank currently without FP. I know I should not put LC into the crankcase during my last oil change, but, it seemed kind of waste by letting the whole jar of LC catching dust in the basement. I won't do it again in the next oil change.
I bought LC/FP on recommendation, and thought they could keep my engine free of carbon deposits. Now I learn the best way to maintain the engine is not to rely on these so called miracle additives, but to rigorously keep the sensors clean, replace the worn parts, and renew the oils and fluids. To me these additives are more like cold medicines, which only alleviate cold symptoms temporarily and do not cure the diseases. I do not need FP to keep the pinging down, instead I clean the MAF sensor. I do not need LC to reduce oil oxidization for longer OCI, instead I change the TP in the bypass filter more often and add fresh oil each time. From now on I will use cleaners like Sea Foam on needed basis to decarbonate my engine. I notice my engine runs much smoother after an oil change despite the OCI was only 6.5k on M1 5W30.
No, I don't do much highway driving. It is just my daily commute to work being 70 miles round trip. I actually avoid highways and prefer local two-lane roads to save gas. My Echo gets better gas mileage with speed within 30~50 mph range.
No, I do not use cheap gas. I used to strictly buy Mobil gas. After my favorite Mobil gas station changed to Sunoco I switched to Chevron only because its gas is rated tier 1. I always stick to the same gas station and the same pump for accurate MPG readings. I have been keeping a spreadsheet that tracks all gas mileages, parts/tools purchased, and periodic maintenances.
No, there is no need to bring the Echo to a dealer because it is rated EPA 41 mpg on highway. I am achieving it and much higher with local and highway driving combined. The dealer would think I were crazy by bringing it in. I am just obsessive in up keeping my Echo especially the gas mileage. By the way, what does CEL stand for???
I bought LC/FP on recommendation, and thought they could keep my engine free of carbon deposits. Now I learn the best way to maintain the engine is not to rely on these so called miracle additives, but to rigorously keep the sensors clean, replace the worn parts, and renew the oils and fluids. To me these additives are more like cold medicines, which only alleviate cold symptoms temporarily and do not cure the diseases. I do not need FP to keep the pinging down, instead I clean the MAF sensor. I do not need LC to reduce oil oxidization for longer OCI, instead I change the TP in the bypass filter more often and add fresh oil each time. From now on I will use cleaners like Sea Foam on needed basis to decarbonate my engine. I notice my engine runs much smoother after an oil change despite the OCI was only 6.5k on M1 5W30.
No, I don't do much highway driving. It is just my daily commute to work being 70 miles round trip. I actually avoid highways and prefer local two-lane roads to save gas. My Echo gets better gas mileage with speed within 30~50 mph range.
No, I do not use cheap gas. I used to strictly buy Mobil gas. After my favorite Mobil gas station changed to Sunoco I switched to Chevron only because its gas is rated tier 1. I always stick to the same gas station and the same pump for accurate MPG readings. I have been keeping a spreadsheet that tracks all gas mileages, parts/tools purchased, and periodic maintenances.
No, there is no need to bring the Echo to a dealer because it is rated EPA 41 mpg on highway. I am achieving it and much higher with local and highway driving combined. The dealer would think I were crazy by bringing it in. I am just obsessive in up keeping my Echo especially the gas mileage. By the way, what does CEL stand for???
Holy Cow! Same pump!
Did you pump at the same temp., time, right-handed or left-handed, use the same card or bill??
I use the same pump number and the same credit card. The temp. is in God's hand, not mine. I check my tire pressure regularly.
Sounds a little obsessive compulsive
Just a tad.......
Just a tad.......
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