Tried some H11 LED bulbs in the Accord

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JHZR2

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I was having a discussion with a friend about auto lighting, including the Audi claims of 5500K being more like daylight and better to see. It turned out that he had bought some closeout VLED VX3 H11 bulbs for use in some fog lights on his car. I got them on loan to try out in my Accord as headlights. Specs: http://www.vleds.com/shop-products/lmz/vx3/vx3-h11-h16-2800lm-led-headlight-fog-light-1-pair.html Claims: - 2800LM total output (per bulb) 50% increase over halogen - 2X 15W Proprietary LED - NEW Silica glass tube gives a perfect 360 degree output for a focused beam pattern - No fan - Built in driver - OK for use in projectors So it is claimed that these are 2800 lumens each (!), while an H11 halogen is 900 lumens. So I put them into the headlight assemblies. First driver side only... It sure looks like the halogen is brighter, or at least there is more of a hot spot than the LED. Then I installed the second one... parked in the same spot as where I took the second picture above: For the above two and the one above that with the same wall, I had the camera set at 1/60s and f/2.8. The LED shot took ISO down to 250 while the one half and half was 280, FWIW. Some installation pics: My complaint about the bulbs is that while it has a nice gasket and the three-tab interface to lock the bulb in, it is not firmly affixed to the bulb assembly... Because of the mass of the heatsink on the rear, the bulb can easily be wiggled and moved up and down when mounted. I would suspect that given road vibrations, the light will move a bit, FWIW. Are these brighter? Id have to say no. 2800 Lumens each is NOT what is coming forward from projectors of my accord... Could it be the fact that LEDs fire only out each side in two directions 180 degrees opposed? The reason I tried this is because the high-end Accord hybrids have LED headlights (not in the halogen projectors of course). That is why I figured Id try these. Ive been considering jumping in with Acura TL projectors retrofitted to my headlights, and fit with some HIDs. But that would take time and money, so Im not convinced. This was just a quick try to see what LEDs would be like, especially with a claimed 2800 lm output. Here are a few iPhone pictures too... The two sides compared in daylight: Notice how you can see the two halves of the LED, but also a big black center spot on the Halogen... So not sure it makes a big difference. Out in the daylight: Cropped to zoom: And against the wall, with iPhone to help see some differences in the stray beam: The LEDs have a squiggle on the cutoff. Interesting. They don't feel as bright. I don't think they illuminate the right side of the road, or the signs, as well as the halogen bulbs. But that would take a lot more testing and swapping. I still have the bulbs in, as Ive borrowed them for a few days, but Im not sure I really care to spend a lot of time doing much. We will see... Anyway, the OE bulbs are Phillips H11 made in Germany. They will go back in until I decide if I want to commit to Acura TL projectors (which fit) and some real HIDs. The thing that has been holding me back is that the ballast install locations on Accord vehicles are taken up by some of the hybrid kit and wiring, so not as easy as on a regular version... Have fun!
 
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Yeah you will be well served by HIDs in your car. I have them in mine which was OEM. I have just replaced my factory bulbs. I will say that the OEM bulbs were a bit better than Xenrac which replaced them. I'd say the replacement bulbs are about 90% has bright. In some angles they are just has bright. A bit odd but true. I wonder about LED bulbs used in headlights. I've heard that LED lights and flash lights are not supposed to be used on people's eyes. So what about headlights? I have seen more and more of LEDs on the highway in the last 2 yrs. And they are certainly very bright and make visibility hard for on coming drivers. I agree with your plan to get a HID set up in your Accord. Vision will be better certainly. Mine have 3200 lumens each. Plus the headlights will look appropriate on your car too. Win-win.
 
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[quote=bbhero]Yeah you will be well served by HIDs in your car. I have them in mine which was OEM. I have just replaced my factory bulbs. I will say that the OEM bulbs were a bit better than Xenrac which replaced them. I'd say the replacement bulbs are about 90% has bright. In some angles they are just has bright. A bit odd but tr I wonder about LED bulbs used in headlights. I've heard that LED lights and flash lights are not supposed to be used on people's eyes. So what about headlights? I have seen more and more of LEDs on the highway in the last 2 yrs. And they are certainly very bright and make visibility hard for on coming drivers. (((QUOTE ))) The only reason why visibility is hard for oncoming drivers is because very few car people know how to use things called adjustments screws , All headlights do have them, I run HID's in all my vehicles with stock projectors and never once have anyone flash their lights at me
 
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What bothers me is the inconsistent appearance of the cutoff. (AKA Squiggle) I'd like to see the beam pattern on a long flat pitch black road...
 

JHZR2

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Originally Posted By: DuckRyder
What bothers me is the inconsistent appearance of the cutoff. (AKA Squiggle) I'd like to see the beam pattern on a long flat pitch black road...
That's why I kept them in... To try to get that opportunity. I was not happy with the oem lighting...
 

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Originally Posted By: dmiko
I replaced h11 bulbs in my 2014 Accord with H9. One of the reasons was I saw a review on candlepower forums where LED was very poor in place of the regular bulbs. The geometry is just not the same. H9 bulbs are a great upgrade aside from the rated life. See http://www.bobistheoilguy.com/forums/ubb...any#Post3965575
Except that they are 10w higher consumption... If I was going to change, I think I'd rather go for less dissipated heat in the headlight assembly...
 
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Originally Posted By: JHZR2
- NEW Silica glass tube gives a perfect 360 degree output for a focused beam pattern
That sounds like [censored] (and the shot showing the light on the headlight housing where you can see the light from the two LEDs proves this). Given how the LED beam pattern is more uniformly lit than the halogen beam pattern which have a hot spot in the centre of the beam pattern I'd bet a lot of those claimed extra lumens are being spread all over the place (which probably includes oncoming driver's eyes) instead of down the road where you need them.
 

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Originally Posted By: Surestick
Originally Posted By: JHZR2
- NEW Silica glass tube gives a perfect 360 degree output for a focused beam pattern
That sounds like [censored] (and the shot showing the light on the headlight housing where you can see the light from the two LEDs proves this). Given how the LED beam pattern is more uniformly lit than the halogen beam pattern which have a hot spot in the centre of the beam pattern I'd bet a lot of those claimed extra lumens are being spread all over the place (which probably includes oncoming driver's eyes) instead of down the road where you need them.
I have no doubt that it is marketing mumbo-jumbo. The question becomes, does it throw lumens down range that are helpful too? Note FWIW I can also see the black tip end of the H11 bulb in its socket on the other side, so what is seen doesnt necessarily mean much... Other than that Ill bet that an H9 retrofit would be obnoxious and notionally unsafe too... Given what Ive seen. Having done some driving with these, Ive found nobody has flashed me (and this is a very dark road with no barrier where people will leave high beams on or flash very readily), and there is some additional visual benefit. But the biggest thing IMO is that the impact of other factors, namely the touch screen in the car, the instruments, and direct aimed lights (flashing lights on signs, some street lights, stoplights) have far more of an effect on my visual efficacy, as compared to other vehicles' glare or even high beams! Thats why Saab has the button to turn off all interior lights, which is highly effective! We can scrutinize headlights all day long, but ambient light is a major risk in my analysis to date. While I agree in principle that "glare" from stray lumens is an issue, I also think that there may be a fallacy of the glare boogeyman. Especially when those in the know will readily recommend other equally illegal modifications like H9 bulbs in H11 spots (so you get forward firing lumens out the projector, as well as a LOT more light, which includes intrinsic glare and stray light from that too, even if it is halogen). Whether these LED bulbs create much/any and if it is worse than anything else including the OE H11 bulbs is not clear to me. But on very dark roads they are performing very well, much to my surprise especially given my initial dissatisfaction. I hope to have some images to show. I have until Friday to run the bulbs before I have to pull them out, put my H11 bulbs back in, and give the LEDs back to their owner. But Ill test as best as time and energy allows...
 
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Interesting pics, thanks. It appears the beam using an incorrect bulb in a projector does not suffer as badly as the beam pattern when an LED or HID bulb is used in front of a halogen reflector. I am one of those who gets highly irritated by oncoming drivers whose headlights cause too much arrogant glare or those who always drive with their fog lights on as fashion accessories. I've noticed the new Toyotas Corollas with factory LEDs to be quite obnoxious to my eyes as well. Phillips is trying hard to make something that will meet FMVSS-108 They do have an Ultinon line which is LED and not legal in the US and is not being marketed for this market. But it is sold here: http://www.amazon.com/Philips-X-tremeVision-LED-Fog-Lamp/dp/B00KTZB0EQ I'd trust them more than other LED brands to work properly and for an acceptable duration in a projector. I'm sidelining myself in this arena, and staying with halogen bulbs getting 14.5volts.
 

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Originally Posted By: wrcsixeight
But it is sold here: http://www.amazon.com/Philips-X-tremeVision-LED-Fog-Lamp/dp/B00KTZB0EQ I'd trust them more than other LED brands to work properly and for an acceptable duration in a projector. I'm sidelining myself in this arena, and staying with halogen bulbs getting 14.5volts.
It looks like they have the same geometry as the bulb I tried. A passive design with a shaft that holds the LEDs (and serves as a heatsink), with the LEDs at the same "depth" as where the filament is in a halogen bulb (and about the same dimensions too. I think that is the fundamental issue WRT HIDs, that the arc isnt located in the same spot as the filament, so the projection is different. If those Philips bulbs only put out 1200 Lumens, theyre just an average H11 bulb then. And H11 halogen, IMO is not really cutting it. So it will be interesting if anything comes out that is LED but higher lumen rating, say, for H9 or other similar applications...
 
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My Jag has halogen projector headlights, similar to your car. I installed 4300K HID bulbs/ballasts. They work wonderfully. The sharp cutoff remains intact. It does not bother oncoming traffic one bit. And the illumination is better than the original halogens. Unfortunately, here on BITOG, I'll get flamed for such an installation. Especially from those who are unfamiliar with the laws and the requirements, and especially the reality of the situation. So, here is my response, in my defense: In my Jag, the internal reflector is a 50% reflector, shaped like a half dome. The reflected light, then has a sheet metal "cutoff" that physically blocks the upward light. So the 3000 lumen HID bulb is well managed and only a fraction of it's total lumen output is projected. At no point is the output above the legal limit. Nor does the light stray from it's intended pattern. It's completely in compliance with the law. Most halogen projector headlight assemblies are good candidates for HID retrofits.
 
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JHZR2

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So I took some other shots last night. Nothing scientific, all iphone for convenience. We were going someplace so I had my wife take some moving shots, but after that, I had to take a drive down the US 301, so that was an opportunity for some very low light pollution situations to arise. The US 301 between Wilmington, DE and Annapolis, MD, is highly traveled by trucks avoiding the I-95 tolls, but it is very rural, little to no light pollution, and very dark along some stretches. I have to say that in that situation, I am very pleased with these LEDs. It is what has made me believe that there is a fallacy in scrutinizing glare when so many other factors actually play in to your vision effectiveness. Glare from oncoming headlights isnt even in my top five. So, around the neighborhood and some moving pictures my wife took are just below. Town: On the highway, moving: General observation is that it lights off to the side well, and illuminates the lower half of the standard height interstate road signs well, while quickly falling off as I get closer. That indicates to me that it isnt pushing too much light too high up. It works well though, and gets the side of the road (visual for deer) well as we went along. That wasnt picked up well by the iphone. So then I did a drive down US 301, in MD. This is between Wilmington, DE and Annapolis, MD. I could actually stop on the highway (pull over to the shoulder then pull out into photo position), because there was nobody going southbound for a while. There always were some northbound trucks, but it is what it is and real life. That is how I was also able to carefully determine the effectof their glare, of the internal cabin light sources, etc. on my eyes and what caued the biggest issues (the internal light sources, not the oncoming headlights!). I was VERY impressed with the lights. The light is whiter, not too blue though (the bulbs are apparently 5500K. They actually match pretty well with the OE LED DRL strips: The highway has a lot of truck traffic, and they are fast to flash you if you dont get your high beams down fast enough or have a light out. Along one stretch I was behing an old buick with TX plates with misaligned headlights. When I was in front of that car, I had to shift my rearview down because of the glare. He was getting flashed, regularly. I was not when I got away from the guy, FWIW. Running high beams got me flashed as usual... The illumination of the side of the road was superior to the halogens, though the LEDs sharply cutoff to not overly reflect from road signs. The white light was fine, though a bit lower color temperature would be fine/better. Though my first impressions were that there is no way that these LEDs are 2800 lm (sales rating), compared to the 1400 of OE H11 bulbs, I will say that they are somewhat brighter, but they also put more light in spots where the halogens were terribly lacking... This is a marked improvement from driving with the H11 halogen bulbs, and I drive this road in pitch black rather often. Much better visibility off to the right (deer) as well as further along forward. The foreground illumination was not noticeably different than my recollections with the H11 (I would have loved to do an A/B comparison, but it was midnight and 16 degrees out). But everything was indeed better. And, they wont run 10+W more energy draw, baking your headlight housings and headlight harnesses, or have an uncovered front end on the bulb like an H9, which will also spew 700+ lm more than is legal out the direct front end of the projector. I dont know... At first I didnt like these... Now Im wondering if I should grab some on closeout ($80) before theyre gone. Apparently they are discontinued and the new versions arent passively cooled...
 

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Originally Posted By: Cujet
My Jag has halogen projector headlights, similar to your car. I installed 4300K HID bulbs/ballasts. They work wonderfully. The sharp cutoff remains intact. It does not bother oncoming traffic one bit. And the illumination is better than the original halogens. Unfortunately, here on BITOG, I'll get flamed for such an installation. Especially from those who are unfamiliar with the laws and the requirements, and especially the reality of the situation. So, here is my response, in my defense: In my Jag, the internal reflector is a 50% reflector, shaped like a half dome. The reflected light, then has a sheet metal "cutoff" that physically blocks the upward light. So the 3000 lumen HID bulb is well managed and only a fraction of it's total lumen output is projected. At no point is the output above the legal limit. Nor does the light stray from it's intended pattern. It's completely in compliance with the law. Most halogen projector headlight assemblies are good candidates for HID retrofits.
Well, what spurred the conversation and borrowing these was the desire to retrofit HIDs (Acura projectors for his fit perfectly), but the fact that the hybrid kit underhood makes ballast fitment tough(er) (than on the non hybrid car). The fact that these H11 LEDs have no ballast is what spurred the loan. Why not try it? Ultimately/optimally an HID approach will be done. However it is much more involved than the LED retrofit which was two minutes tops. Do it right means breaking open the lights too... I agree with you that the fallacy of the glare boogeyman is a bit overstated (IMO/Testing) compared to other light sources.
 
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Originally Posted By: JHZR2
Ultimately/optimally an HID approach will be done. However it is much more involved than the LED retrofit which was two minutes tops. Do it right means breaking open the lights too... I agree with you that the fallacy of the glare boogeyman is a bit overstated (IMO/Testing) compared to other light sources.
If you really like to retrofit your Accord to HID you should spend sometime on the HIDplanet.com. There are many owners who did very good works retrofitting halogen projectors/reflector to HID with proper parts. According to many of those posters 1 of the best HID projector bowls, if not the best, is the S2000 projector bowl. The other HID projector bowl rated highly is Lexus LS460. Many of them tried HID retrofit without changing the projector bowl(kept the halogen projector) and the result was not very satisfy. It is rare that the halogen projector bowl works well with HID bulb.
 
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That does look very good to me too JHZR2.. I need to take pics with my HIDs and post them to compare to your pics here. What I think I'm seeing with your pics here is that your headlights here are not far off mine at all. I mean within 10% as good or closer. I like the lateral vision you got with your lights. Mine do that pretty well too. Has you noted its very helpful for deer avoidance smile No lie... I saw 17 deer hit and taken out on ret 199 near me in 2 wks times back in November. Lateral sight does help a good amount. I like the light I think I'm seeing from your 301 shots... I've driven that stretch of 301 a number of times. My sister used to live in Clayton that's just west of Dover Delaware. Like you said its quiet out there at night for sure. I am thinking your assessment is correct that these lights seemed to perform very well. Now this is a guess on my part but I am thinking that the long distance vision with these headlights is pretty good too. If I am thinking that is right then in combination with good lateral sight with these headlights then you would be good to pick them up. Plus.... They will look very good with your Accord too. That's a very nice car anyhow. These headlights would be a good accent has well.
 
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Yes sir that is spot on analysis here. But that is no surprise smile I agree 100% that proper HID retrofit needs the projector bowl to be changed too. This leads to the HIDs performance being exactly what it should be.
 
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