Toyota WS ATF

[PT1]

Got the wife a new Lexus ES350 and it has the sealed trans with the WS fluid. What is this stuff? Is it any better than T-IV?

The maunal only calls for changing at 60k if you tow? Tow with an ES350? Jeez

 

[JHZR2]

Please use the search.

Put in the term "Toyota WS" -"T-IV"
exactly as I have it there, with quotes.

Change the search duration to 5 years.

JMH

 

[PT1]

I did 3 times and nothing came back. Didn't know about the 5 year thing.

 

[deven]

Hope she has better luck with the car than my dad has with his 2007 ES350. Sure does get some good gas mileage though.

 

[The Critic]

It isn't sealed, it just doesn't have a dipstick. There's a fill plug, drain plug and overflow tube. Fluid needs to be checked at a certain temperature range; you can either use a factory scantool or a jumper wire. There's no need to service the unit until 60k, which at that point I'd drain and refill several times with WS ($7/qt from the dealership). You cannot flush this unit as it's self-contained, meaning it does not use a radiator heat exchanger.

I have the service manual for the U660E from the Camry, which is identical. Let me know if you want it.

 

[PT1]

Originally Posted By: deven
Hope she has better luck with the car than my dad has with his 2007 ES350. Sure does get some good gas mileage though.


The 2007's has a serious trans flaw that has been corrected on the 08. I believe it was an undersized pump or valve in the trans. The 6 speed is very different though compared to the 4 speeds I am used to. It automatically downshifts as you decelerate to keep you in the optimum gear. First gear lasts about a nano second. I am wondering if they should have just stuck to 4 speeds and added an OD button for the freeway. It's another sealed "lifetime" fill in the trans. Yeah sure. I'll be flushing at 30k intervals. Just as soon as I locate the fill plug.

 

[The Critic]

Originally Posted By: PT1
The 2007's has a serious trans flaw that has been corrected on the 08. I believe it was an undersized pump or valve in the trans. The 6 speed is very different though compared to the 4 speeds I am used to. It automatically downshifts as you decelerate to keep you in the optimum gear. First gear lasts about a nano second. I am wondering if they should have just stuck to 4 speeds and added an OD button for the freeway.

There were two changes to the U660E that were made during the course of the 2007MY. One involved an updated valve body, which did not always correct the flare. The second fix was a different software, which seems to have resolved the 3-4 flare completely. Only once in a while do you hear about a flare problem with the 08 and 09 models.

I agree completely with you about the shifting--the unit shifts wicked fast. Even under light throttle, it will downshift. I posted a review in the vehicles section.

 

[PT1]

What is the flare problem? What does it do?

 

[The Critic]

Originally Posted By: PT1
What is the flare problem? What does it do?

When the vehicle is cold, the 3-4 shift would be delayed. The transmission would attempt to shift into 4th, but the RPM would spike (300 to 1000) before 4th gear engages.

 

[PT1]

So basically its slipping?

 

[The Critic]

Originally Posted By: PT1
So basically its slipping?

I guess you could say that, but the correct term is a flare.

 

[PT1]

Well I have my fingers crossed..

 

[PT1]

The dealer told us that this trans learns your driving style which seems pretty amazing to me.

 

[swedespeed]

Wow, sounds like a repeat of the AW55-50. Aisin has historically made most all of Toyota's other transmissions - I wonder if the U660E is an AW design or totally Toyota-engineered?

 

[dkryan]

One would think that if Toyota claims their ATF is "world standard," they'd install a transmission that was also world standard.

Is this the only tranny that can't be flushed (ala T-Tec) or are all "sealed" (no dipstick) trannies "non-flushable?"

 

[The Critic]

Originally Posted By: dkryan
One would think that if Toyota claims their ATF is "world standard," they'd install a transmission that was also world standard.

Is this the only tranny that can't be flushed (ala T-Tec) or are all "sealed" (no dipstick) trannies "non-flushable?"

Many transmissions that lack a dipstick can be flushed using a T-Tech machine as they have external cooler lines. The GM 4T45E, Ford 5R55W, etc come to mind. However, the Toyota U660E and many of the newer Aisin units are "self-contained," so they cannot be flushed. In the future, it's possible that someone might make the fittings to allow flushing through the integrated heat exchanger, as some companies have done with the VW 01M units.

 

[dkryan]

My apologies if it appears I'm hijacking this thread. It's not my intent.

However, I'd like to know some of the auto manufacturers that predominantly use Aisin transmissions.

 

[dkryan]

PT1: good luck with the new ride.

At $35-40K for that automobile, I'd at least like to be able to flush the tranny, when I wanted, with the ATF that I wanted.

 

[unDummy]

Flush wouldn't be needed if you simply adapt a drain/refill regimen. Pan has a drainplug and an overflow plug in place of the dipstick. Accurate temp measurement is needed for accurate overflow check of the ATF level.

Full flush is pretty easy with the U660e, as is in most transmissions. But, it is not a backyard mechanic or poor skilled tech(hint quicklube and even dealers) affair.

WS seems to be a pretty good fluid. I've done several full 30k-50k WS flushes with barely a noticeable change in shift feel. With T-IV, after 10k, most will notice a change in shift quality with a flush.

 

[PT1]

The owners manual calls for fluid change at 60k for severe service. I'll have the dealer flush it at 50k. No big deal. After having 3 AWD vehicles in the drive the absence of rear diffs & tcases to change will make this car a breeze. No under pan to remove for the oil service and this engine has a nice 6.4qt sump and a timing chain versus the 90k belt. Lots of room under the hood and the tbody is right there and won't take more than 1 hour to remove-clean-reinstall. Plus you can touch all the spark plugs easily....I am thrilled!