Tires Mounted Backwards (Inside Out)

[92saturnsl2]

A couple months ago I had a tire blowout due to a large object in the road that also bent the rim on my '07 Pacifica. Finally got a new rim in, decided to replace both tires on that axle (rear) as the fronts still had plenty of tread left. My in laws have a close family friend that owns a small independent tire shop that they've recommended to me in the past, so I decided to try them out, have them put on the new rim and mount/balance the two new tires (bought them on Discount Tire Direct). Everything seemed to go as planned, they did the work, got the TPMS swapped and working on new rim, was pleased with the price and service. When I got home, I look the tires over just for grins and my eyes caught the word INSIDE facing the OUTSIDE of the vehicle. These tires are non-directional asymmetric tread, so while there is no certain direction of rotation (you can swap tires side to side) the tires are marked INSIDE and OUTSIDE and should be mounted as such because the inside and outside of the tread are different. The inside tread is a fairly narrow tread block while the outside tread block is much wider. The tread "ribs" in the center are also different from side to side. Bummer, I call the shop, explain the situation and she says "I don't know anything about them, you'll have to talk to the mechanic." Mechanic gets on the phone and says it makes no difference which side is out. I do my best to explain YES, it does make a difference, even pointing out that the fronts (which they didn't touch) are mounted the correct way with the word OUTSIDE facing out. He tells me that inside/outside designation is only for aesthetics, and outside indicates the manufacturers suggested "sidewall graphics" that should point out (the inside/outside sidewall is slightly different in font and text layout). He says this is only important in the case of raised white letters on truck tires, and car tires that have whitewalls, and makes no difference otherwise. I'm making zero headway in convincing him he's wrong, so I bring the car down so that I can point out the tread differences and provide a visual comparison to the owner/administrator (family friend) and mechanic, thinking this will clear up any confusion. She has me talk to the mechanic, he comes out to look at the car and he swears he cannot discern any tread difference and asserts his 25+ years of experience as some kind of evidence that he's right and I'm wrong. Bluntly, I tell him I want them switched to match the front, and he says he will have to charge me since I didn't tell them which side I wanted out beforehand. My only option at this point would be to escalate things to an uncomfortable level, perhaps threaten legal action, honestly what do you do? I'm baffled at their ignorance... My becoming increasingly irate would only be perceived by all parties (my in-laws, owner, mechanic) as me just being a stubborn anal [censored], so I decide to take the high road and give up. No way am I paying them $30 to correct their own mistake, so I take the car to a different tire shop nearby for help. They tell me that they see this ALL THE TIME on cars that come in, even pointed out how dangerous it can be, especially in the case of directional tires. They complete the work, I go up to pay and ask them what I owe, he tells me "no charge, this one is on us, hope we can earn your business in the future." It certainly worked, they will definitely get my business in the future. SUPER glad I checked the tires over, because this is something that could easily be missed and driven for a long time in a potentially unsafe condition. Anyone else ever experience a tire mounted incorrectly? Front tire with outside facing out Rear tire (Inside out) Rear tread Front tread

 

[benjy]

tires are marked for a reason. my local shops helper mixed 2 up + without any groaning correctly remounted for free after i noticed it as it should be.

 

[walterjay]

That is just crazy to be treated that way. I would take the time and effort to give them an honest Google and Yelp review.

 

[bullwinkle]

Good thing you figured out how stupid they were before they screwed up something harder to fix!

 

[14Accent]

That's insane. They really argued, and tried to CHARGE you to fix their mistake? They're labeled for a reason... who cares why. I've actually had this happen at my shop. The tire guy is in a hurry, it's a new model tire, he doesn't pay attention etc. Things happen. 99% of the time, the customer would never notice. Safety concern? I highly doubt it. No tire maker could sell a tire that works as designed in one direction, but was critically flawed in the other. It just wouldn't happen. If this DID happen, and a customer DID catch it, we would apologize profusely, fix the mistake, and probably comp an oil change for the inconvenience. Apologies that you had to deal with poor customer service, but it sounds like you've found yourself a new shop!

 

[Nick1994]

Discount Tire did that to my VW a few years ago on one tire. I took it back and they apologized and got it swapped really quick.

 

[geeman789]

Tires are asymmetrical for a reason. More rubber with less void on the outside so more rubber contacts the road when car rolls in a turn, and leans on the outer portion of tire. Less rubber with more void on the inside (see that really wide groove ... ) to give better water evacuation and more biting edges for snow grip. However, the average driver in an average car will never notice any difference in performance ... But, the tire tech should have noticed !

 

[krzyss]

Wow. And I thought that making mistake and mounting tire inside outside was the problem. Monroe in Worcester fixed the same mistake without questioning. I would make a few printouts from tire rack and give it to mechanic and ask for the owner/ manager. Some people simply do not know any better. KrzyÅ›

 

[dishdude]

At least you found a new and reputable shop for the future.

 

[Thax]

Unfortunately mistakes happen in the auto repair business. The problem I have with this situation is not that there was a mistake made but the way it was handled. This happens from time to time, ive seen plenty of guys do it . I have honestly done it once . The fix is easy , just own up to it and fix it. Spend the 15 minutes to remount the tires and re balance them . An apology for the mistake and a freebie for a next service would have made this a non problem. Shame that some shops/dealerships are just so lacking in etiquette these days.

 

[Linctex]

I'd let you in-laws know I'll never be taking my car back to their "friend"

 

[y_p_w]

I've had several non-direction asymmetric tires as well as directional tires. I guess there are some asymmetric directional tires that come in left/right specific versions. However, I've had several asymmetric non-directional tires (Pirelli PZero Nero, Michelin Pilot Sport A/S 3(+)) and have never seen them mounted any way but "outside" showing when mounted. I have seen the inside of those Pirellis when I rotated them myself. Those were different in that it had "PIRELLI" in block outline letters on the inside, but more stylized graphics on the outside. I do remember when my mom's tires blew out (right side only) on her Camry when she ran into a curb. I was ready to drive her on a long trip when I noticed that they were redistributed with the factory tires on the front and two newer tires on the rear. Neither tire was remounted. She bought the replacements at Costco and they failed to tell her that the directional tire was going the wrong way. I brought them into Costco and asked what they could do about it. They said they could remount it for their standard mounting fee (I think $10 at the time). Still - the previous installer should have known and told my mom about it.

 

[92saturnsl2]

I would imagine the difference in performance between reversed and correct mounted directional tire would be pretty significant. Most directional tires have tread oriented in a "V" shape of sorts; if you reverse it, you get a COMPLETELY different tread characteristic that I would imagine performs nothing like what the manufacturer intended. Instead of forcing water to evacuate the tire, you would be channeling it to the center of the tire where it has nowhere to go. Pretty dangerous situation at high speed in rain, I would think. Non-directional asymmetric tires, not so much. I doubt there would be a big difference unless pushing the tire to its limits. Still, to put $400 worth of tires on backwards and then to refuse to fix it is beyond comprehension. I guess when it's not the installer's money it's no big deal to be careless.

 

[tony1679]

"BuT i HavE 25 YeaRz eGspEriEnSe!!!" Yeah, you have 25 years experience of [censored] up people's cars. No thanks. It's amazing how a mechanic is NEVER wrong about a car (especially regarding oil... that's how Lucas and 20W-50 still exist). Just like a cashier is NEVER wrong providing the correct change, or a referee NEVER makes a bad call...

 

[MNgopher]

Well, the good news is that it sounds like you found a decent tire shop - just not the one you expected. I've had directional tires mismounted before. When it was pointed out, it never took anything more than pointing it out to get it corrected, along with an apology for the mistake. I get that shops are busy and you don't always get the best of the best at times. We all have bad days too. What separates things is what folks do when it doesn't go right...

 

[y_p_w]

Originally Posted by 92saturnsl2

I would imagine the difference in performance between reversed and correct mounted directional tire would be pretty significant. Most directional tires have tread oriented in a "V" shape of sorts; if you reverse it, you get a COMPLETELY different tread characteristic that I would imagine performs nothing like what the manufacturer intended. Instead of forcing water to evacuate the tire, you would be channeling it to the center of the tire where it has nowhere to go. Pretty dangerous situation at high speed in rain, I would think.

Depends. Many directional tires still have lengthwise channels that will still work when installed backwards. I've seen a few that dead-end, but that's fairly minor compared to the big channels. Something like a Bridgestone Potenza RE960AS. However, a Bridgestone Potenza RE050 is called directional, but it's not likely to affect water evacuation if reversed. It might affect the handling though. It's got tiny little dead ends in the tread design no worse than I've seen in non-directional tires or in asymmetric tires. These are the tires I have mounted on my car right now. Two of the ribs dead end and in different directions. It could be a design more about handling than channeling water. But yeah - if a tire is directional, who is the installer to say it doesn't matter? What happened to simple professionalism?

 

[PandaBear]

This is why I don't trust "family friends". If they screw up and insist they are right, and have to charge you extra to fix it, you tell your family what happen and walk off. Shaming them along the way. This is the kind of mom and pop that should go out of business.

 

[Gasbuggy]

Family friend wouldn't matter to me, someone would be getting screamed at while my tires get fixed for free.

 

[KevD47]

If nothing else, the graphics front and back on your car don't match, so what was the point in trying to match brand/model if they were going to put them on that way? They should have noticed. As far as performance, if I read correctly they aren't a directional tire, ("rotation" with an arrow noted on the side wall), so when you rotate and cross-cross per the manual they'll be turning the opposite rotation at some point.

 

[billt460]

Originally Posted by 92saturnsl2

When I got home, I look the tires over just for grins and my eyes caught the word INSIDE facing the OUTSIDE of the vehicle. These tires are non-directional asymmetric tread, so while there is no certain direction of rotation (you can swap tires side to side) the tires are marked INSIDE and OUTSIDE and should be mounted as such because the inside and outside of the tread are different............., so I take the car to a different tire shop nearby for help. They tell me that they see this ALL THE TIME on cars that come in, even pointed out how dangerous it can be, especially in the case of directional tires............. SUPER glad I checked the tires over, because this is something that could easily be missed and driven for a long time in a potentially unsafe condition. Anyone else ever experience a tire mounted incorrectly?

Tires are either directional, or non directional. If they are directional they will by marked with a rotation arrow, showing which way they are supposed to rotate. Not, "INSIDE" / "OUTSIDE". Your tires are non directional. They can be safely mounted either way. This is done all the time with red striped and white lettered tires today. A lot of people do not want the white letters or the stripe showing. So the tire center will ask which way you want them mounted, facing in or out. They are also non directional, and it is NOT "dangerous" to do this. And many times the tread pattern is slightly different on these tires as well. The tires you purchased can also be rotated in a criss cross pattern, with the left front rotated to the right rear. Again SAFELY. If the tires are directional, again with an arrow showing the direction they should rotate, they can only be rotated front to back, while remaining on the same side, so they rotate in the same direction. Think about it. Tires like yours could be all mounted "correctly", with "OUTSIDE" showing on every tire. But if they were directional you would have an unsafe condition if you criss crossed them on rotation. That is why the ARROW is used to signify rotational direction, and not "INSIDE / OUTSIDE". The second tire center you went to, that said you had a, "dangerous condition", is giving you false information in regard to your tires. Because again, they are non directional. So no such, "dangerous condition" can be achieved by how they are mounted. The original tire center that put them on for you was giving you the correct information. With that said, they treated you poorly about it, and have now lost your business because of it. This falls under the classic saying, "The customer is always right........ Even if he isn't". Had they been more polite, and offered to switch them around, they would still have you as a customer. Apparently they felt you weren't worth that effort. But it doesn't change the fact the second place who changed them for you, handed you incorrect information. They were just nicer about it.