Those electrics are coming,you knew that?

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Could be a good thing. The two all electric cars I have actually driven were very impressive performers but had a serious problem: range.

As soon as they make them run 3-400 miles or so they may actually be a good choice, many of us can't deal with the ridiculous distances they run right now and the extremely long time it takes to 'refuel'....
 
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It is like a CNG car...I can buy one from Honda locally and fuel it here in my town but I cannot leave town to go anywhere as there are no accessible fueling stations. This in PA which is awash in natural gas.
 
Originally Posted By: Charlie1935
I rode in an electric one time. The loudest noise wad the tires on the brick streets.
By the way it was a 1913 Detroit Electric opera coupe.


Amazing,,,in 1913, now we are just catching on,mercy.
 
I was tempted to buy an EV to take advantage of the carpool lane solo driving, but the range is not long enough for round trip. With so many people buying EV, the charging spots at work (free electricity baby) is always full, which means I have to stop and check for empty spot on a regular basis at work to charge my car so I can go home. This is based on a 2013 Leaf.

CNG cars also get the same carpool lane benefit, but there are only 2 fueling stations in town and if you are standing behind some garbage trucks that used up all the CNG, you will not be able to fill it up to the max, and it could take a few minutes and up to 20 mins in some cases to fuel. The stations are also less reliable than typical gas stations and undergoes repair / upgrade quite often. Most importantly, the CNG tanks are only certified for 15 years and by the end of that, replacement can cost (each with labor about $5-6k) more than an EV battery ($3-4k for a hybrid), which means CNG is not really a deal over EV in the long run other than having a good range.

For now it seems like plug in hybrid is the best option if you can swallow the high purchase price.
 
If Tesla motors keeps going in the right direction, we should soon have safe EV's with some decent range and a lower price point. The Model S rivals some supercars in performance and has a 200 mile range.

Dave
 
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Could be a good thing. The two all electric cars I have actually driven were very impressive performers but had a serious problem: range.

As soon as they make them run 3-400 miles or so they may actually be a good choice, many of us can't deal with the ridiculous distances they run right now and the extremely long time it takes to 'refuel'....


You mean like a Tesla P85?

I typically drive 300-400 miles a week so...I guess if you average 200-300 miles a day.
 
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I'd love an electric as a commuter car. Commute is 36 miles or so 1 way so would need at least 150 miles stated as range since I'm in PA and we do have winter. Plug it in at night and it's ready for tomorrow. For longer ranges we'd take the gas car.

Problem is all the ones that fit this bill are crazy expensive (Tesla). The Volt comes close but it's expensive. The Leaf, IIRC is lucky to do 100 miles on a charge in the best range form and it expensive.
 
Electric motors are good at launch because of their torque. Many of their characteristics are almost opposite of gas or diesel engines. Something that gives hybrids a chance to succeed.

But the problem is the not the motors, its the energy source.

Wind is air molecules in motion. Electricity is electrons in motion. You can't store wind, and for all practical purposes, you can't store electricity *(capacitors do, but very tiny amounts).

Batteries store chemicals that 'shed' electrons, producing a very low voltage electric current. All batteries that produce enough voltage to drive a motor consist of dozens, even hundreds, of low voltage cells, with connections between each cell. When one fails, they all stop, just like a string of Christmas tree bulbs.

When we talk about a truck to somebody, we say it's diesel powered, or gas powered, or natural gas powered. When we talk about electric cars we should be saying "it's ________ battery powered".

All of these newer batteries that even come close to being range practical are EXTREMELY expensive, and judging from the luck with Dream liner 787 lithium batteries, not quite mainstream ready.

I've actually owned two electric vehicles, and they had some fun value and did some things regular vehicles couldn't (I could drive on sidewalks and even drove my van inside a building to unload once) but they are still 'niche' , in my opinion.

There are cities that need 'niche' vehicles and might make a market for electric vehicles, but so far this latest batch from the major players aren't really selling too well.
 
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Could be a good thing. The two all electric cars I have actually driven were very impressive performers but had a serious problem: range.

As soon as they make them run 3-400 miles or so they may actually be a good choice, many of us can't deal with the ridiculous distances they run right now and the extremely long time it takes to 'refuel'....


To add to that - yes, range isn't great in the summer. Up here in the winter ... it's simply unusable.

On the honda fit EV forum, some people are getting 20 miles ... 20 MILE range on a full battery. That's just unacceptable.
 
Originally Posted By: datech

When we talk about a truck to somebody, we say it's diesel powered, or gas powered, or natural gas powered. When we talk about electric cars we should be saying "it's ________ battery powered".


In reality(U.S. 2012) it's:

When we talk about a truck to somebody, we say it's diesel powered, or gas powered, or natural gas powered. When we talk about electric cars we should be saying "it's ________ battery powered".

Coal 37%
Natural Gas 30%
Nuclear 19%
Hydropower 7%
Other Renewable 5%
Biomass 1.42%
Geothermal 0.41%
Solar 0.11%
Wind 3.46%
Petroleum 1%
Other Gases < 1%

Ed
 
Originally Posted By: edhackett
Originally Posted By: datech

When we talk about a truck to somebody, we say it's diesel powered, or gas powered, or natural gas powered. When we talk about electric cars we should be saying "it's ________ battery powered".


In reality(U.S. 2012) it's:

When we talk about a truck to somebody, we say it's diesel powered, or gas powered, or natural gas powered. When we talk about electric cars we should be saying "it's ________ battery powered".

Coal 37%
Natural Gas 30%
Nuclear 19%
Hydropower 7%
Other Renewable 5%
Biomass 1.42%
Geothermal 0.41%
Solar 0.11%
Wind 3.46%
Petroleum 1%
Other Gases < 1%

Ed


Thank you for pointing out that clean green electric cars are actually mostly coal powered. Ironic truth.
 
If all the oil used in the U.S. were replaced with electricity, joule for joule, you'd have to burn 50% more coal for power, put in 50% more coal power plants, and find some other way of turning on the lights for the users of the existing coal power...
 
Originally Posted By: Shannow
If all the oil used in the U.S. were replaced with electricity, joule for joule, you'd have to burn 50% more coal for power, put in 50% more coal power plants, and find some other way of turning on the lights for the users of the existing coal power...


Absolutely. True rechargeable electric cars would collapse our existing grid like the house of cards it is!
 
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
Originally Posted By: Shannow
If all the oil used in the U.S. were replaced with electricity, joule for joule, you'd have to burn 50% more coal for power, put in 50% more coal power plants, and find some other way of turning on the lights for the users of the existing coal power...


Absolutely. True rechargeable electric cars would collapse our existing grid like the house of cards it is!


You got that right! I find it funny that "it's green" ... even though it's running on electricity produced from a coal fired plant. Guess my gasoline car doens't look too bad then.

I also find it funny the people that buy "green" energy. Apparently they don't understand how that works. If you are closest to a nuclear plant, you get nuclear power. If you are closest to a coal plant, you get coal power - doesn't matter which "green" energy you get.

If the range was better, recharge was quicker and it was economically feasible to put solar everywhere for these things, it would be great!

I like the idea of solar. It's great that you can just plop something on your roof or in your yard and it makes electricity. I don't like how expensive it is and the fact that they wear out quickly. Plus, up here - solar only works slightly 6 months a year. The other 6 months it just doesn't work.
 
At the airport, my friends own Tesla's. I've got to admit that the 85KWH Tesla Model S "Performance" is as close to the ideal car as I can imagine.

Interestingly, Oak Ridge and MIT have tripled the capacity of the batteries used in the Model S, using a sulfur/lithium technology. It looks very promising, cheaper and more capable. 600 mile range is "possibly" on the horizon for Tesla.
 
Originally Posted By: Cujet
At the airport, my friends own Tesla's. I've got to admit that the 85KWH Tesla Model S "Performance" is as close to the ideal car as I can imagine.

Interestingly, Oak Ridge and MIT have tripled the capacity of the batteries used in the Model S, using a sulfur/lithium technology. It looks very promising, cheaper and more capable. 600 mile range is "possibly" on the horizon for Tesla.


And these cars are exciting to me because of the huge reduction in maintenance, repairs, etc. Not to mention the outrageous performance they offer in dead silence...
 
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