Thinking about going back to Conventional Oil

Bluestream · Jun 4, 2011

Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Most of the "crud" in oil is made from oil (oxidation). Quality synthetic oils should have little "crud". Unless we are talking soot in diesel.

I would say most of the "crud" is soot and other combustion by-products. Those will be there no matter what oil you use. However, synthetic can tolerate higher levels than conventional, hence longer OCI.

Y_K · Jun 4, 2011

Originally Posted By: XtraRevsSurely
I do not drive my car hard. I do a ton on highway miles so I'm rarely in traffic!

I thought about doing a longer change interval but wouldn't I have to replace the filter anyway?

I do a ton of highway miles on a modular V8 (town car): 20k miles per ODI on the same M1 filter and M1 5W-30 EP. Have over 400k miles on my workhorse car. I have yet to run a UOA. I could have achieved the same on any dino, but would have to lose more time.
Since you drive a lot, cover longer than average distance, you depend on your car more.
Both longer and shorter ODI strategies have their merits, e.g. with a shorter interval you, or your good mechanic, check other parts and units of your car on a more regular basis and give a more thorough inspection, etc.

You can develop a syn or dino strategy for your application, just give your car the best you can afford.
"Good Enough" will cost you more, the more you depend on your car.

Oregoonian · Jun 4, 2011

Originally Posted By: simple_gifts

You obviously put alot of miles on this vehicle and are a good candidate for synthetic oil. Just extend your OCI.

+2.....your OCI is way to short (4K) for a synthetic oil and the type of driving you do..

Here are my suggestions.....and it won't cost you any more than your spending now.

1. You live in Wisconson (extremly frigid winters). Go to Mobil 1... 0w20 or 0w30 (WalMart priced at $24.50 per 5 quart jug). Your vehicle will have better starts in the winter...and will run cooler in the summer.

2. Change your OCI to 8 to 10K. Save time (only do half the oil changes you are doing now)... and money....and still gets all the benifits of synthitic.

3. Your PureOne will easily do the above OCI.
_________________________________________
03' Ford Focus (2.3L Duratec) / 98K
PP 5w20 / PureOne / OCI: 8K +/-

ericthepig · Jun 4, 2011

Not sure how anyone can afford running dino these days. It's expensive and it doesn't last. Get a topshelf synthetic designed for long OCIs and go there.

Oregoonian · Jun 4, 2011

Originally Posted By: ericthepig
Not sure how anyone can afford running dino these days. It's expensive and it doesn't last. Get a topshelf synthetic designed for long OCIs and go there.

+1.....I don't think the dino guys get it.....it is actually more costly to run dino (with shorter OCI's) ....than to use a quality synthetic. Syn has many benifits that dino can't match.

M1 0w20 or 0w30 will fit most non-turbo vehicles year round....and be especially efficient in colder climates. In warmer climates..... 5w20 or 5w30 will work year round for the majority of vehicles.
_________________________________________
03'Ford Focus (2.3L Duratec) / 98K
PP 5w20 / Purolator PureOne / OCI: 8K +/-

hate2work · Jun 4, 2011

Originally Posted By: ericthepig
Not sure how anyone can afford running dino these days. It's expensive and it doesn't last. Get a topshelf synthetic designed for long OCIs and go there.

I think the best value in engine oil is to buy whatever well made dino or syn that is on sale and use it. Right now on my shelf I have some Chevron Supreme that I paid about $2 a quart for at Costco with a coupon, as well as some PU I picked up from Amazon when they had the wrong price posted. I got that for $17 for a case of 12, I bought 2 cases and they honored the price. You just have to be flexible about what you'll use, and watch for bargains. No long OCIs in my future, so It's easy to find great prices on oils that serve me well.

bigdawg74 · Jun 5, 2011

Originally Posted By: Oregoonian
Originally Posted By: ericthepig
Not sure how anyone can afford running dino these days. It's expensive and it doesn't last. Get a topshelf synthetic designed for long OCIs and go there.

+1.....I don't think the dino guys get it.....it is actually more costly to run dino (with shorter OCI's) ....than to use a quality synthetic. Syn has many benifits that dino can't match.

M1 0w20 or 0w30 will fit most non-turbo vehicles year round....and be especially efficient in colder climates. In warmer climates..... 5w20 or 5w30 will work year round for the majority of vehicles.
_________________________________________
03'Ford Focus (2.3L Duratec) / 98K
PP 5w20 / Purolator PureOne / OCI: 8K +/-

Well, not everybody can fully utilize all of the so called benefits of synthetic. My '91 Accord sees mostly short trips, and low (4k) annual miles. Mild winters here in western Washington, so I don't need a 0w-xx. I change every 6 months to get the crud out, irregardless of mileage. So I can either buy two 5 qt jugs of MS5k @ $12 a jug, or two 5 qt jugs of M1 @ $24.50 a jug.

$24 < $49

So, I am not quite sure what you mean by "not getting it". The OP has driving habits that would benefit by using syn and an extended OCI. As would many others. That's not to say that syn oil is the be all, end all and everybody would gain from using it. For some of us, the only gain would be a lighter wallet.

Art_Vandelay · Jun 5, 2011

Originally Posted By: bigdawg74

Well, not everybody can fully utilize all of the so called benefits of synthetic. My '91 Accord sees mostly short trips, and low (4k) annual miles. Mild winters here in western Washington, so I don't need a 0w-xx. I change every 6 months to get the crud out, irregardless of mileage.

The fuel dilution / short trip category should have their own subsection. It's the only group that should use the cheapest oil possible and just change it often.
There's no doubt that you are right. Synthetic, or even better conventional, does absolutely nothing for you.

friendly_jacek · Jun 5, 2011

Instead of wasting oil by frequent oil changes with short trips, I would start driving longer trips or start walking/biking more.

d00df00d · Jun 5, 2011

Originally Posted By: Art_Vandelay
The fuel dilution / short trip category should have their own subsection. It's the only group that should use the cheapest oil possible and just change it often.

If contaminants are a big problem, it's easy to make a case for running the best oil you can get your hands on so that it can resist being (chemically) torn to shreds and continue to perform.

Yes, you can say "just change it often," but sometimes the difference between a cheap oil and an expensive one means the difference between a 1.5k mile OCI and a 6k+ mile OCI. Back to square one.

Now, some people may find themselves in a situation in which expensive oils don't long outlast the cheap ones. In those cases, yes, it may be best just to save money and use a cheap oil with a short OCI. But the only way to know whether that's true for you is through UOAs. It's impossible to know in advance.

d00df00d · Jun 5, 2011

Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Instead of wasting oil by frequent oil changes with short trips, I would start driving longer trips or start walking/biking more.

Amen.

Art_Vandelay · Jun 5, 2011

Originally Posted By: d00df00d

If contaminants are a big problem, it's easy to make a case for running the best oil you can get your hands on so that it can resist being (chemically) torn to shreds and continue to perform.

Yes, you can say "just change it often," but sometimes the difference between a cheap oil and an expensive one means the difference between a 1.5k mile OCI and a 6k+ mile OCI.

A 1500 mile OCI in a modern fuel injected car? If the severity of service actually warranted such an OCI, then how could you feel comfortable running anything (no matter how good) four times longer?

bigdawg74 · Jun 6, 2011

Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Instead of wasting oil by frequent oil changes with short trips, I would start driving longer trips or start walking/biking more.

4 qts of oil every 6 months is wasting?

wtd · Jun 6, 2011

I was a long time synthetic user that went back to conventional oil and never looked back. I don't feel that I have less protection because of it.

Wayne

The Critic · Jun 6, 2011

Considering that engine oil and filter are so inexpensive compared to amount of money we spend on gasoline, I am curious why we are arguing over a rather insignificant amount of money.

HTSS_TR · Jun 6, 2011

I agree. If yearly mileage is 15k miles then the cost of fuel on average is about $1000. If you do 3 OCI's a year with dino then the cost of oil and filter is about $50-55(15 quarts + 3 filters), if you do 2 OCI's with synthetic then the cost is about $65-70(10 quarts + 2 filters). The difference is only about $15-20 a year.

The Critic · Jun 6, 2011

Originally Posted By: HTSS_TR
I agree. If yearly mileage is 15k miles then the cost of fuel on average is about $1000.

15,000 miles / 30 mpg= 500 gallons.

500 gallons * $4/gal= $2,000.

Yes, we really are bickering about an insignificant amount of money in the big picture.

d00df00d · Jun 6, 2011

Originally Posted By: Art_Vandelay
A 1500 mile OCI in a modern fuel injected car? If the severity of service actually warranted such an OCI, then how could you feel comfortable running anything (no matter how good) four times longer?

1. Gather the right evidence to show that your car is okay on one oil + OCI combo and not on the other.

2. Love your car enough to jump through a hoop or two for it.

Art_Vandelay · Jun 6, 2011

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: Art_Vandelay
A 1500 mile OCI in a modern fuel injected car? If the severity of service actually warranted such an OCI, then how could you feel comfortable running anything (no matter how good) four times longer?

1. Gather the right evidence to show that your car is okay on one oil + OCI combo and not on the other.

2. Love your car enough to jump through a hoop or two for it.

I understand how you would demonstrate whether something is sufficient or not. But I was asking, more or less, how any oil could have 4 times the longevity of another oil under such extreme conditions.

If Walmart Super Tech conventional(as a cheap example) is shot from severe fuel dilution at 1500 miles, which oil(s) are you suggesting could contend with that for 4 times longer (6000+ miles)? It just seems like an exaggerated spread is all. I don't mean for that to sound harsh by the way.

d00df00d · Jun 7, 2011

Look up RI_RS4's posts on oil for his Audi RS4 and other problematic direct injection engines. Some of those engines were tearing up high-dollar synthetics in under 2,000 miles, whereas RLI 5w-40 HD (the development of which he bankrolled) ran much, much longer.

If you're looking for exact chemical details, that's above my pay grade, unfortunately. All I've been able to understand for sure is that it's all about matching the formulation to the application.

On the point about exaggeration, this obviously is an extreme case. The bigger point I was making is that you can't know what you stand to gain (or not) from any product without testing.

Thinking about going back to Conventional Oil

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