The Koreans...
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Mercedes seems to have started the really ugly rear, like the Honda minivan and some of the CRV's I see. They must have copied Mercedes. I guess it is just fashion, they must change all the time, to make us feel our present cars are out of style.
Some early 90's cars are much better designed from a drivability/visibility standpoint, and their lines were pretty clean sometimes. But if we drive it around, we feel like we are poor. compared to all the new cars. And other drivers treat you like you are poor trash too.
Some early 90's cars are much better designed from a drivability/visibility standpoint, and their lines were pretty clean sometimes. But if we drive it around, we feel like we are poor. compared to all the new cars. And other drivers treat you like you are poor trash too.
Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Buying a Hyundai Equus is exactly like buying a counterfeit Rolex. It might be bargain cheap and appear luxurious, but in the end it's still FAKE - and would get laughed at.
You mean just like anything with a Lexus, or Infiniti, badge? Well, other than the fact that they're anything but cheap...
Buying a Hyundai Equus is exactly like buying a counterfeit Rolex. It might be bargain cheap and appear luxurious, but in the end it's still FAKE - and would get laughed at.
You mean just like anything with a Lexus, or Infiniti, badge? Well, other than the fact that they're anything but cheap...
Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Buying a Hyundai Equus is exactly like buying a counterfeit Rolex. It might be bargain cheap and appear luxurious, but in the end it's still FAKE - and would get laughed at.
only laughed at by shallow label-obsessed fake people.
quality is quality no matter where it comes from.
Buying a Hyundai Equus is exactly like buying a counterfeit Rolex. It might be bargain cheap and appear luxurious, but in the end it's still FAKE - and would get laughed at.
only laughed at by shallow label-obsessed fake people.
quality is quality no matter where it comes from.
Going in the other direction here...I think that Cadillac and Buick have finaly cought on and have the right style in their segment.
Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Buying a Hyundai Equus is exactly like buying a counterfeit Rolex. It might be bargain cheap and appear luxurious, but in the end it's still FAKE - and would get laughed at.
It's nothing like what you described at all. There's nothing fake about it. It is a 385HP V8 real-wheel drive sedan that looks great inside and out, with just about all of the features anyone would want in a luxury sedan, at a great price for what you get. It is exactly as advertised... it is not like they are sticking a BMW badge on it.
Yes, it's a Hyundai. No, it's not a BMW, Mercedes, or an (insert yet another expensive luxury brand here). The brand only matters to those who view brands as a status symbol. Personally, I prefer a nice car over a nice brand.
There's no reason to look at what Hyundai was making 20 years ago and use that information to judge this car. They've come a long way and have proven themselves to be capable of making great cars.
Buying a Hyundai Equus is exactly like buying a counterfeit Rolex. It might be bargain cheap and appear luxurious, but in the end it's still FAKE - and would get laughed at.
It's nothing like what you described at all. There's nothing fake about it. It is a 385HP V8 real-wheel drive sedan that looks great inside and out, with just about all of the features anyone would want in a luxury sedan, at a great price for what you get. It is exactly as advertised... it is not like they are sticking a BMW badge on it.
Yes, it's a Hyundai. No, it's not a BMW, Mercedes, or an (insert yet another expensive luxury brand here). The brand only matters to those who view brands as a status symbol. Personally, I prefer a nice car over a nice brand.
There's no reason to look at what Hyundai was making 20 years ago and use that information to judge this car. They've come a long way and have proven themselves to be capable of making great cars.
Originally Posted By: Char Baby
Going in the other direction here...I think that Cadillac and Buick have finaly cought on and have the right style in their segment.
I agree with you on the Buicks, new ones are very nice to look at; Caddies.....still look like a woodcarving done with a chainsaw.
To the OP--I agree completely, their quality has caught with their looks too. I've had far, far less problems with my Spectra than I did with my Tacoma.
Going in the other direction here...I think that Cadillac and Buick have finaly cought on and have the right style in their segment.
I agree with you on the Buicks, new ones are very nice to look at; Caddies.....still look like a woodcarving done with a chainsaw.
To the OP--I agree completely, their quality has caught with their looks too. I've had far, far less problems with my Spectra than I did with my Tacoma.
Originally Posted By: Spazdog
Originally Posted By: mpvue
IMO the Japanese makes (except for Mazda) have gotten quite ugly recently, especially honda/acura...
Yeah, what's going on at Acura?
Other than adding a 6th gear to the MDX and a wagon variant (automatic 4 cyl only) to the TSX, they really haven't done anything.
They still have that dreadful guillotine blade grill. It's been around so long that my eyes are actually getting used to it. There have been no substantial upgrades in design or model changes anywhere.
It's as if they are saying, "We are so good at the Tier-II luxury level, we don't even need to try."
Mazda? I still haven't got past the goofy front fascia styling on them. And I like Mazda. I see the back of the 3 and I'm like, "Oh, that's quite nice." Then I see the front and it's like styled from the movie "Cars".
i know,it`s got that stupid smiling front grille.i wonder if it puts the driver in a good mood while driving down the road? kinda like the dude on that med commercial for male enhancement.
with the perpetual smile.
Originally Posted By: mpvue
IMO the Japanese makes (except for Mazda) have gotten quite ugly recently, especially honda/acura...
Yeah, what's going on at Acura?
Other than adding a 6th gear to the MDX and a wagon variant (automatic 4 cyl only) to the TSX, they really haven't done anything.
They still have that dreadful guillotine blade grill. It's been around so long that my eyes are actually getting used to it. There have been no substantial upgrades in design or model changes anywhere.
It's as if they are saying, "We are so good at the Tier-II luxury level, we don't even need to try."
Mazda? I still haven't got past the goofy front fascia styling on them. And I like Mazda. I see the back of the 3 and I'm like, "Oh, that's quite nice." Then I see the front and it's like styled from the movie "Cars".
i know,it`s got that stupid smiling front grille.i wonder if it puts the driver in a good mood while driving down the road? kinda like the dude on that med commercial for male enhancement.
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: lexus114
Originally Posted By: Spazdog
Originally Posted By: mpvue
IMO the Japanese makes (except for Mazda) have gotten quite ugly recently, especially honda/acura...
Yeah, what's going on at Acura?
Other than adding a 6th gear to the MDX and a wagon variant (automatic 4 cyl only) to the TSX, they really haven't done anything.
They still have that dreadful guillotine blade grill. It's been around so long that my eyes are actually getting used to it. There have been no substantial upgrades in design or model changes anywhere.
It's as if they are saying, "We are so good at the Tier-II luxury level, we don't even need to try."
Mazda? I still haven't got past the goofy front fascia styling on them. And I like Mazda. I see the back of the 3 and I'm like, "Oh, that's quite nice." Then I see the front and it's like styled from the movie "Cars".
i know,it`s got that stupid smiling front grille.i wonder if it puts the driver in a good mood while driving down the road? kinda like the dude on that med commercial for male enhancement.
with the perpetual smile.
the good mood is called 'zoom-zoom'
my '09 Mazda5 missed the smiley face, but the new one in '12 has it
word is the next mazda look will be sans smiley; they are going in a new styling direction. we'll see...
Originally Posted By: Spazdog
Originally Posted By: mpvue
IMO the Japanese makes (except for Mazda) have gotten quite ugly recently, especially honda/acura...
Yeah, what's going on at Acura?
Other than adding a 6th gear to the MDX and a wagon variant (automatic 4 cyl only) to the TSX, they really haven't done anything.
They still have that dreadful guillotine blade grill. It's been around so long that my eyes are actually getting used to it. There have been no substantial upgrades in design or model changes anywhere.
It's as if they are saying, "We are so good at the Tier-II luxury level, we don't even need to try."
Mazda? I still haven't got past the goofy front fascia styling on them. And I like Mazda. I see the back of the 3 and I'm like, "Oh, that's quite nice." Then I see the front and it's like styled from the movie "Cars".
i know,it`s got that stupid smiling front grille.i wonder if it puts the driver in a good mood while driving down the road? kinda like the dude on that med commercial for male enhancement.
the good mood is called 'zoom-zoom'
my '09 Mazda5 missed the smiley face, but the new one in '12 has it
word is the next mazda look will be sans smiley; they are going in a new styling direction. we'll see...
My FIL bought an Accord V-6 at the same time as my parents bought an Elantra (2003?).
The Honda was retail $41k, we got it got $39,900 drive away. Hyundai was $19,990 dirve away, essentially half.
Both have/had leather interior, climate control (honda split side), electric mirrors, 4 wheel disks, ABS, alloy wheels etc.
Yes, the Honda felt more solid and put together, but seriously was it half the car that the Honda was (or was the Honda really twice the car the Hyundai was ?).
Honda got traded in for $11,000 two years ago after the fuel pump failed...even if my parents threw the Hyundai away (which they didn't, it's still going strong), they would be $9k up in comparison.
The Honda was retail $41k, we got it got $39,900 drive away. Hyundai was $19,990 dirve away, essentially half.
Both have/had leather interior, climate control (honda split side), electric mirrors, 4 wheel disks, ABS, alloy wheels etc.
Yes, the Honda felt more solid and put together, but seriously was it half the car that the Honda was (or was the Honda really twice the car the Hyundai was ?).
Honda got traded in for $11,000 two years ago after the fuel pump failed...even if my parents threw the Hyundai away (which they didn't, it's still going strong), they would be $9k up in comparison.
In the US an Accord V6 EX basically loaded would list for about $29,000, and an equivalent Hyundai would be very close in price. I don't really see Korean cars as being a better value. I don't believe they are as reliable as some seem to think or are their suspension tuning as settled as American and Japanese or especially European cars.
Based strictly on looks, I agree that Hyundai and even Kia have some really nice designs. Better then most. I still think the Santa Fe is kind of homely but I am sure the new model will look pretty cool.
American cars are getting better looking but I think it varies by model. The new Regal, CTS, Malibu, Camaro are nice. I also like the new Taurus, Explorer, Mustang, Focus, Grand Cherokee and Challenger. I still think most of the other American cars are not attractive. To make things fair, I also think almost every Toyota and half the Hondas are downright ugly.
American cars are getting better looking but I think it varies by model. The new Regal, CTS, Malibu, Camaro are nice. I also like the new Taurus, Explorer, Mustang, Focus, Grand Cherokee and Challenger. I still think most of the other American cars are not attractive. To make things fair, I also think almost every Toyota and half the Hondas are downright ugly.
I just compared a 2011 Sonata Limited Turbo to a V6 Accord EX-L 5Spd auto. Honda was only a few hundreds $$$ more, but had fewer options (no turn indicators in mirrors, not garage opener, no standard foglights, no standard tinted glass, no standard CD Changer), shorter warranty and much less HP/Torque. 190/162 vs 274/269 in Sonata.
I can see why people would choose Sonata over Accord.
I can see why people would choose Sonata over Accord.
The Accord is pricey but it has value in other areas that are harder to qauntify whether it be slightly higher quality, reliability or better sorted suspension tuning and most of all higher domestic parts content and assembly. There are other vehicles that are a better value than the Accord to compare against the Sonata like the Malibu, Fusion, Camry etc. IMO they are a better value overall.
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
The Accord is pricey but it has value in other areas that are harder to qauntify whether it be slightly higher quality, reliability or better sorted suspension tuning and most of all higher domestic parts content and assembly.
What's the domestic parts and labor % on each, any idea?
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
There are other vehicles that are a better value than the Accord to compare against the Sonata like the Malibu, Fusion, Camry etc. IMO they are a better value overall.
Not necessarily, depends on who is doing the valuation; what is important to one person may not be important to another. For example, how many of the cars you listed offer 5/60K bumper to bumper and 10/100K powertrain warranties? It is important to ME, since I tend to hold onto my vehicles.
The Accord is pricey but it has value in other areas that are harder to qauntify whether it be slightly higher quality, reliability or better sorted suspension tuning and most of all higher domestic parts content and assembly.
What's the domestic parts and labor % on each, any idea?
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
There are other vehicles that are a better value than the Accord to compare against the Sonata like the Malibu, Fusion, Camry etc. IMO they are a better value overall.
Not necessarily, depends on who is doing the valuation; what is important to one person may not be important to another. For example, how many of the cars you listed offer 5/60K bumper to bumper and 10/100K powertrain warranties? It is important to ME, since I tend to hold onto my vehicles.
The new Kia's look great to me. Especially the soul and optima. The Hyundai's look good too. A buddy of mine traded his '07 E class Mercedes for a Genesis sedan when they first came out. He liked it so much, he bought another one in a different color. He has since traded the second Genesis in for a new Audi, but has nothing bad to say about the Hyundai, which is pretty impressive.
I suspect that my generation will always think poorly of Korean cars, just like my parents generation always thought poorly of Japanese. They certainly are worlds ahead of where they were 20 years ago.
I suspect that my generation will always think poorly of Korean cars, just like my parents generation always thought poorly of Japanese. They certainly are worlds ahead of where they were 20 years ago.
Originally Posted By: CBR.worm
The new Kia's look great to me. Especially the soul and optima. The Hyundai's look good too. A buddy of mine traded his '07 E class Mercedes for a Genesis sedan when they first came out. He liked it so much, he bought another one in a different color. He has since traded the second Genesis in for a new Audi, but has nothing bad to say about the Hyundai, which is pretty impressive.
I suspect that my generation will always think poorly of Korean cars, just like my parents generation always thought poorly of Japanese. They certainly are worlds ahead of where they were 20 years ago.
wait...." A buddy of mine traded his '07 E class Mercedes for a Genesis sedan" what?? i mean i like hyundai/kia and all but......??
The new Kia's look great to me. Especially the soul and optima. The Hyundai's look good too. A buddy of mine traded his '07 E class Mercedes for a Genesis sedan when they first came out. He liked it so much, he bought another one in a different color. He has since traded the second Genesis in for a new Audi, but has nothing bad to say about the Hyundai, which is pretty impressive.
I suspect that my generation will always think poorly of Korean cars, just like my parents generation always thought poorly of Japanese. They certainly are worlds ahead of where they were 20 years ago.
wait...." A buddy of mine traded his '07 E class Mercedes for a Genesis sedan" what?? i mean i like hyundai/kia and all but......??
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