Tesla Battery Replacement Costs

[JHZR2]

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/service-says-22k-for-new-battery-on-2012-model-s.221438/

Kind of a corner case situation, but $22K to do a Model S battery out-of-warranty. Basically same ballpark as a new long block engine from the dealer on a higher-end 4-cyl car.

Except you’re guaranteed to need to replace a battery at some point, while the ICE can last virtually indefinitely if not used/abused.

The clock starts ticking when the cells are formed in the factory. For the case of the long block, that’s a fluke or poor use/upkeep profile.

 

[Audiman]

I would advise anyone looking to buy a BEV for the long term to ask the dealer if the battery is rebuildable. Etron, GT and Q4 have all been designed to allow battery repair/ rebuild as opposed to full replacement. So if you have a isolated fault with a module pack or internal control unit you can just replace the required parts. In theory you would only need to replace all the module packs if you have damaged all the cells by fully charging too often. This can be worked around by using the 80% max charge function.

 

[Trav]

Definitely not in Euro-land these days.

We must be looking at different Euro cars, I frequently see them with 200K and more on them. I recently worked on a 2017 S550 with 230K on the clock, original engine and drive train, a few minor repairs in its history but nothing you wouldn't expect on any car including the sushi boats.

 

[nthach]

A co-worker bought a used Nissan Leaf cheap. Said it only has a 40 mile range.

Toyota and Nissan are still air cooling their batteries. The NiMH modules in all but the PHEV Prius/RAV4 have been battle-tested in cabs and more recently, Uber.

The Tesla packs are liquid cooled but potted in intumescent gel as a fire measure. Panasonic makes the cells, IIRC. GM is also liquid cooling their packs but the LG Chem packs on the Volt/Bolt are “naked” - no gel.

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

https://teslamotorsclub.com/tmc/threads/service-says-22k-for-new-battery-on-2012-model-s.221438/

Kind of a corner case situation, but $22K to do a Model S battery out-of-warranty. Basically same ballpark as a new long block engine from the dealer on a higher-end 4-cyl car.

I'm thinking the economics are even better if you compare an ICE with similar performance numbers as the Model S. Thinking 2012 M5/E55 AMG/RS6 etc.

 

[Audiman]

If you take a RS6 with a average of 15mpg and £9.00 a gallon over 100,000 miles you would use £60,000 worth of fuel. It’s one of those cars that you have to ask the question can I afford the fuel not the car. You can burn a full tank in 60 miles. Then think it comes with a 60,000 miles 3 year warranty in the uk and the high voltage batteries have a 8 year 100,000 mile’s warranty. Any one know what it would cost to do 100,000 miles in a comparable BEV? Both charging at home ( cheapest) and at commercial chargers ( most expensive). That would give a good indication if you could justify a battery replacement/ rebuild at the out of warranty point And still be ahead on cost of ownership vs ICE.

 

[Trav]

That is only if fuel cost that much, at the moment we are living with an agenda motivated fuel price increase in the US that hopefully will return to normal when sanity returns.

 

[Audiman]

Do me a favour Trav do the sums with a normal fuel price and post it up. For us a more normal fuel price would be £6 a gallon so fuel cost adjusts to £40,000. My maths was 100,000 miles divide by 15 mpg times by cost of a gallon of fuel. This will need adjusting for US market having a smaller gallon but also cheeper fuel.

 

[Trav]

You are missing the point by a country mile IMO. For most people it is easier to pay by tank than come up with 20K+ at one time. Sort of like buying a house, sure it is cheaper if you pay cash than if you take a mortgage with a %. The thing you neglect to mention in your equation is the cost of electricity, the more adopters the higher the price will go without any doubt, there will also need to a tax of some sort, or do you believe the government is going to loose 7 pounds a gallon on every gallon. This is just the beginning.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/ar...-recession-Russia-throttles-gas-supplies.html

 

[Audiman]

I do mention electricity I’ve asked for someone to calculate the cost over the same distance both on cheapest and most expensive. No one can guess what any government is going to do as far as taxes go so that part is pretty difficult to factor in.

I don’t think I’ve missed the point at all. Yes buying a complete battery pack is expensive as a one off cost however for someone who may look to put 200,000 miles on a car and budgets for it mid vehicle life then the overall cost of ownership can still be less than ICE.

The person that ends up getting screwed over is the 3rd owner at out of warranty time that’s got no means to fix the car.

Posting a article about Germany who’s current energy policy is so far down the drain pipe it’s frightening isn’t really anything to do with the topic at hand.

 

[Trav]

It does for Germans paying the bills and has a government that is hell bent on eliminating ICE. This crap could be where you live, don't count it out.
Do you have telephone poles on every street with an electric grid that is not much more reliable than a sub Saharan grid? What I pay for electricity is some of the highest in the US outside of Hawaii. If you want to buy an EV that's your business, have at it.

 

[MalibuRam65]

EV are the future

 

[Spyderman24_7]

EV are the future

In the next century it's a possibility, bwahahaha...

 

[Ws6]

Well, lets look at it this way. My Acura costs me $480/mo in fuel. The C40 I am replacing it with, will cost me $80 or less in electrons.

The Acura needs diff fluid changed at least once a year. It also needs tires rotated every 8k or so. It needs 4 oil changes per year. It needs at least 1 air filter per year. The Volvo needs one $400 service visit per year or 20k miles. This averages to $600/year for me. For the full 140k mile manual's direction. The tires are not rotated. The costs for the Acura per year for me tally up to about $600, as well...but hidden is the valve adjustment at 105k ($700), the transmission fluid every 50k ($600ish), and the fact that it will consume brakes much faster. All told, the C40 over its life will save me about $3-500/year or so in PM.

Lets call "its life" 100k miles. Thats $2500-3K in PM. Its $24K in fuel (at current prices, and since I don't have a crystal ball...). So a total of roughly $28K. All while: not requiring me to stop for fuel except on roat trips. Being an absolute rocket compared to my RDX.

And thats just presuming 100k...stretch it out to 200k miles and the savings alone literally pay for the entire car. Compared to my Acura, I will have gotten the C40. For. Free. Literally the same cost as if someone had just handed me the keys to the Acura and said "Its yours, free and clear, just fill er up and maintain her!"

 

[Cujet]

My Jaguar X-type (an old Ford really) has fuel costs of approx 12 to as high as 15c per mile (depending on where I purchase fuel) . 225,000 miles and the engine still runs perfectly (M1 5W-40 always)

A $22K Tesla battery at 120K/12 years has a cost of 18c per mile. This does not include elec power. Which, despite the claims, is nearly never 12c per KWh (yeah, you may get charged that at home, but add in fees, taxes and overages and it turns out to be MUCH higher). And 33 to 42c per KWh at public chargers. So 8c to 21c per mile for power, depending.

Camry/Accord Hybrids can operate at less than 10c per mile, fuel costs, in real world conditions.

 

[Andrew1972]

Tesla Model S is a low volume vehicle at that age. I am more interested in battery pack cost for Model 3 or other volume seller.

 

[Ws6]

My Jaguar X-type (an old Ford really) has fuel costs of approx 12 to as high as 15c per mile (depending on where I purchase fuel) . 225,000 miles and the engine still runs perfectly (M1 5W-40 always)

A $22K Tesla battery at 120K/12 years has a cost of 18c per mile. This does not include elec power. Which, despite the claims, is nearly never 12c per KWh (yeah, you may get charged that at home, but add in fees, taxes and overages and it turns out to be MUCH higher). And 33 to 42c per KWh at public chargers. So 8c to 21c per mile for power, depending.

Camry/Accord Hybrids can operate at less than 10c per mile, fuel costs, in real world conditions.

No, I pretty much get charged 12 cents. Yes there are fees, etc. on top of it, but the meter fee etc. is something I'd be paying even without the PEV, so it doesn't make sense to pretend they are part of owning/operating the PEV.

 

[Cujet]

No, I pretty much get charged 12 cents. Yes there are fees, etc. on top of it, but the meter fee etc. is something I'd be paying even without the PEV, so it doesn't make sense to pretend they are part of owning/operating the PEV.

Mine is also 12c but with my typical 600-750KWh per month, the taxes, fees and charges conspire to increase the real world cost to over 18c per KWh. Furthermore, if I consume more than 750, the rate increases to nearly double.

But any way you slice it, I would not want to own an EV outside of the warranty period. The RISK-REWARD-RATIO is currently seriously skewed on this.

 

[UncleDave]

I could care less what it cost to replace anything on a 10 year old EV because it isnt relevant to anything or any deal I'd get I'd get going forward.

 

[gman2304]

EV are the future

I Agree and we all know it’s coming. But It won’t be tomorrow, or next year or this decade. A slow gradual sensible transition to EV’s is what consumers should get instead of a head long rush into a senseless oblivion by the deceptive, manipulating, and down right lying from the “powers that be” inside the beltway!
As bad as the tree huggers, fools, and fanboyz want it yesterday, it ain’t gonna happen…..yet. Our infrastructure isn’t near ready for EV’s……yet.