I used to race karts that had briggs engines running on methanol spinning way faster than a briggs motor should ever be spun (8,000 RPM) and running a much hotter cam than normal. We used extremely thin oils and never experiences any oil related problems. We felt the thinner oils performed better.
Synth 20w = Bullet proof
- Thread starter ericthepig
- Start date
- Status
Originally Posted By: Detroit_Doc
I used to race karts that had briggs engines running on methanol spinning way faster than a briggs motor should ever be spun (8,000 RPM) and running a much hotter cam than normal. We used extremely thin oils and never experiences any oil related problems. We felt the thinner oils performed better.
My head is reeling from this. Did you have it encased in a case steel explosion-proof box?
M
I used to race karts that had briggs engines running on methanol spinning way faster than a briggs motor should ever be spun (8,000 RPM) and running a much hotter cam than normal. We used extremely thin oils and never experiences any oil related problems. We felt the thinner oils performed better.
My head is reeling from this. Did you have it encased in a case steel explosion-proof box?
M
That's nothing. Formula 1 engines spin to 18,000 rpms.I love how NASCAR states something as if it's leading edge when in reality the technology is right out of the 60's.
Originally Posted By: rshaw125
That's nothing. Formula 1 engines spin to 18,000 rpms.I love how NASCAR states something as if it's leading edge when in reality the technology is right out of the 60's.
I think Wallace was primarily talking about the technology of the oil (and the cars have come a ways themselves). I would imagine a 1960s 20wt oil wouldn't do so good in extreme conditions whehter the car was spec'd for it or not. So, yes, todays 20 grade technology is leading edge.
That's nothing. Formula 1 engines spin to 18,000 rpms.I love how NASCAR states something as if it's leading edge when in reality the technology is right out of the 60's.
I think Wallace was primarily talking about the technology of the oil (and the cars have come a ways themselves). I would imagine a 1960s 20wt oil wouldn't do so good in extreme conditions whehter the car was spec'd for it or not. So, yes, todays 20 grade technology is leading edge.
Originally Posted By: meep
My head is reeling from this. Did you have it encased in a case steel explosion-proof box?
M
No but a friend who tried his hand at rebuilding his motor (versus using an experienced builder) was going down the back straight once and had the con-rod blow right out the front of the case. It skittered right down the straight and came to rest at the corner workers feet. About 30 seconds later my friend rolled up to the same spot.
My head is reeling from this. Did you have it encased in a case steel explosion-proof box?
M
No but a friend who tried his hand at rebuilding his motor (versus using an experienced builder) was going down the back straight once and had the con-rod blow right out the front of the case. It skittered right down the straight and came to rest at the corner workers feet. About 30 seconds later my friend rolled up to the same spot.
Apples to oranges +1!
Quote:
Rusty: Yeah, a lot of people think that the more rpms you go, the hotter everything is, you've got to have this real thick oil, and that's not necessarily the case. In a lot of cases nowadays, we're qualifying in racing 0-weight oil.
Although still highly modified, a rally car is closer to a production car than a NASCAR car. Any rally cars running a 20 grade? Any race cars running oil for 5-7,000 mile OCI's?
Motul 300V 5W40 - References = Subaru World Rally Team
ELF LES PLEIADES 10W-50 for street cars.
-Dennis
Quote:
Rusty: Yeah, a lot of people think that the more rpms you go, the hotter everything is, you've got to have this real thick oil, and that's not necessarily the case. In a lot of cases nowadays, we're qualifying in racing 0-weight oil.
Although still highly modified, a rally car is closer to a production car than a NASCAR car. Any rally cars running a 20 grade? Any race cars running oil for 5-7,000 mile OCI's?
Motul 300V 5W40 - References = Subaru World Rally Team
ELF LES PLEIADES 10W-50 for street cars.
-Dennis
Last edited:
Engine life for Nascar is one race, about 800 miles ? In the 24 hr Le Mans they seem to run heavier oils, fuel dilution is probably more of a problem. What are people running in the Baja or the Paris-Dakkar ? Is it 20 wt ?
The article noted that 0 wt was used for qualifying and 20 wt (?) for racing, so what lubrication principle are they appealing to ?
The article noted that 0 wt was used for qualifying and 20 wt (?) for racing, so what lubrication principle are they appealing to ?
Originally Posted By: 1sttruck
Engine life for Nascar is one race, about 800 miles ? In the 24 hr Le Mans they seem to run heavier oils, fuel dilution is probably more of a problem. What are people running in the Baja or the Paris-Dakkar ? Is it 20 wt ?
The article noted that 0 wt was used for qualifying and 20 wt (?) for racing, so what lubrication principle are they appealing to ?
Exactly. Motul's Leman's oil (marketing name) was a 15w50 for exactly that reason.
Engine life for Nascar is one race, about 800 miles ? In the 24 hr Le Mans they seem to run heavier oils, fuel dilution is probably more of a problem. What are people running in the Baja or the Paris-Dakkar ? Is it 20 wt ?
The article noted that 0 wt was used for qualifying and 20 wt (?) for racing, so what lubrication principle are they appealing to ?
Exactly. Motul's Leman's oil (marketing name) was a 15w50 for exactly that reason.
Who in here really belives the majority of manufacturers have changed engine design just to accomodate a 20wt oil? I went back to when the TL was spec'd for 30wt and looked at bearing clearances and guess what? They're exactly the same as the current model that's spec'd for 20wt. Maybe oils have gotten better and that's why you can run a 20wt but I challenge anyone to find something different in the bottom end of any car when they switched it over to a lighter oil.
Like I said I wouldn't have as big of a problem running a lighter oil in a high revving car because peak cylinder pressure is most likely lower. It's the gasoline engines that make diesel like torque at low rpms that I think would have problems with the light stuff.
Again the GN makes roughly 700lbs of torque at the crank at 3,000rpm using a stock narrow bearing crank. I doubt it would make one full pass on a 20wt at full temp. You can't just recommend 20wt for every car and it's kind of irresposible to do so. This [censored] may be bulletproof in a Corolla but no thanks in a serious street/strip car.
Like I said I wouldn't have as big of a problem running a lighter oil in a high revving car because peak cylinder pressure is most likely lower. It's the gasoline engines that make diesel like torque at low rpms that I think would have problems with the light stuff.
Again the GN makes roughly 700lbs of torque at the crank at 3,000rpm using a stock narrow bearing crank. I doubt it would make one full pass on a 20wt at full temp. You can't just recommend 20wt for every car and it's kind of irresposible to do so. This [censored] may be bulletproof in a Corolla but no thanks in a serious street/strip car.
The title of my thread got truncated due to character length restrictions -
It was suppose to read - "Synth 20w - Bullet proof Corolla oil"
It was suppose to read - "Synth 20w - Bullet proof Corolla oil"
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
You can't just recommend 20wt for every car and it's kind of irresposible to do so.
Actually, I don't think anyone in this thread has recommended it for every app. In my case, I posted a link to Rusty Wallace's comments, and then I commented on those who stated that 20 grades should not be used in high RPM, high heat apps.
You can't just recommend 20wt for every car and it's kind of irresposible to do so.
Actually, I don't think anyone in this thread has recommended it for every app. In my case, I posted a link to Rusty Wallace's comments, and then I commented on those who stated that 20 grades should not be used in high RPM, high heat apps.
Originally Posted By: ericthepig
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
You can't just recommend 20wt for every car and it's kind of irresposible to do so.
Actually, I don't think anyone in this thread has recommended it for every app. In my case, I posted a link to Rusty Wallace's comments, and then I commented on those who stated that 20 grades should not be used in high RPM, high heat apps.
I wasn't directing it only toward you but the board as a whole. I'm sure 20wt will work fine in the majortiy of cars and especially the higher rpm/ lower torque motors. It's just the general attitude, you could get a guy on here with a top fuel dragster wanting to get oil advise and the first 10 people would automatically reply 0-20 with no understanding of the special needs of a particular motor.
It's like trying so hard to not be trendy that you end up being trendy.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
You can't just recommend 20wt for every car and it's kind of irresposible to do so.
Actually, I don't think anyone in this thread has recommended it for every app. In my case, I posted a link to Rusty Wallace's comments, and then I commented on those who stated that 20 grades should not be used in high RPM, high heat apps.
I wasn't directing it only toward you but the board as a whole. I'm sure 20wt will work fine in the majortiy of cars and especially the higher rpm/ lower torque motors. It's just the general attitude, you could get a guy on here with a top fuel dragster wanting to get oil advise and the first 10 people would automatically reply 0-20 with no understanding of the special needs of a particular motor.
It's like trying so hard to not be trendy that you end up being trendy.
Last edited:
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2002
- Messages
- 39,793
Quote:
so what lubrication principle are they appealing to ?
One has to last 5 laps (or whatever) ..the other 500+ miles. Both are to provide lowest parasitic losses over the duration of use.
so what lubrication principle are they appealing to ?
One has to last 5 laps (or whatever) ..the other 500+ miles. Both are to provide lowest parasitic losses over the duration of use.
Interesting that many MotoGP and World Superbike teams like Ducati run 10w-40 synthetic in 800cc/990cc bike engines producing over 225hp and running 18-19000 rpm's. I would imagine that these engines are as high-tech as Nascar. (Ya think?!)
Drew
Drew
- Joined
- Sep 28, 2002
- Messages
- 39,793
It might have something to do with evolutions from a long time air cooled environment to liquid cooled (or still air cooled).
I'd use API SF grade 20w oil for 7500 miles. It is as OK as a 15w 40 per the manual. But I'm not sure how to extrapolate the milage for the SL SM oils.
- Status