So am I not smart if I run Redline
- Thread starter HARTZSKY
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No need to worry about defrauding anyone as an oil related failure would have less likelyhood than being struck by lightning...twice.
Just isn't gonna happen or be an issue.
Has anyone on this board ever had an oil related failure in a car that was maintained reasonably? I never have and I have owned alot of nerw and beater vehicles in 32 years of driving.
Just isn't gonna happen or be an issue.
Has anyone on this board ever had an oil related failure in a car that was maintained reasonably? I never have and I have owned alot of nerw and beater vehicles in 32 years of driving.
Why not have NASA engineer an aerospace grade filter to go with the Redline oil too? Billet Ti and trans-polymeric valves with stainless media....it's "the best", so it must be necessary on his Honda Accord.
You're stuck with a [relatively] short OCI while you're in warranty. There simply won't be a difference between running Redline or PP/M1/SynPower/SynTec/Edge so why not save a few bucks and the hassle.
Redline the best? Hasn't been proven by anyone without a marketing degree or a brother who knows a guy who races....
Redline the best? Hasn't been proven by anyone without a marketing degree or a brother who knows a guy who races....
Odds are certainly with you that you won't need your warranty, but you paid for that warranty in the purchase price. And if you do need it, and you wouldn't be the first Honda owner that ever did, would it have been worth it?
Why use a $9 oil in an engine that is designed for and runs so well on dino?
Might as well pour champagne on your Cheerios. Or send in an extra donation to the IRS come April 15.
Someone will come along and say I'm wrong, using the best makes you warm and fuzzy, polar anions cling to wrist pins, or its got a pretty bottle.
Your money, but I think you really know the answer to your own question.
Why use a $9 oil in an engine that is designed for and runs so well on dino?
Might as well pour champagne on your Cheerios. Or send in an extra donation to the IRS come April 15.
Someone will come along and say I'm wrong, using the best makes you warm and fuzzy, polar anions cling to wrist pins, or its got a pretty bottle.
Your money, but I think you really know the answer to your own question.
Originally Posted By: FZ1
Right,you are not smart. Take the car to the dealer for all in warranty oil changes. You can take your own syn if it meets the oem spec. You would be even less smart if you tried to defraud the dealer/MFG as to what oil you used.
Now thats funny, I dont even take my car to the dealer when the oil changes are free and I would wager that not many on here do either.
Right,you are not smart. Take the car to the dealer for all in warranty oil changes. You can take your own syn if it meets the oem spec. You would be even less smart if you tried to defraud the dealer/MFG as to what oil you used.
Now thats funny, I dont even take my car to the dealer when the oil changes are free and I would wager that not many on here do either.
Thankfully, this board is full of guys who believe that the best way to get something done right is to do it yourself. I trust no one with putting the correct viscosity oil in my car, or with dealing correctly with the cartridge filter. More often than not, dealership service departments are leaving the mundane tasks to the shop hands, while keeping the ASE certified guys working on the difficult stuff. The dealer sees my car for warranty work....period.
Dealerships are becoming famous for putting in the wrong oil (Most, if not all new Mazdas are calling for 5W-20 now EXCEPT 2.3 DISI equipped cars, which requires 5W-30 (5W-40 if you have weeping turbo seals), therefore I don't want some yokel pouring 5W-20 dino into my car and crossthreading my plastic filter canister.
I'd highly recommend Redline to anyone, but remember that you're living in a cover-your-@ss world. What Honda doesn't know won't hurt them. If you're dead set on using Redline, go buy a jug of PP at WalMart, make a copy of the receipt, and then return the oil. Use the copy as your oil change record and forget about it. You're not going to suffer an oil-related failure by using Redline, so that's where the issue will die. If your engine throws a rod, spins a bearing, loses a cam, etc. it was going to happen no matter which oil you used. Someone screwed up at the factory and your car was pre-determined to die early. Honda will verify your oil change records, and fix it under warranty.
Just don't make the mistake of using Redline's racing oil for your street driven car. The only time I could recommend that is if you planned to pour it in, drive across the country, and drain it. It's not intended for daily duty of cold starts, idling, short trips, etc. Buy the best street-car oil they make and drive happy.
Having said ALL that, I believe you could run Mobil 1 or Pennzoil Platinum in an Accord for 500,000 miles without a hiccup. It's the good stuff for people who don't want to go through all the warranty paperwork hassle.
Dealerships are becoming famous for putting in the wrong oil (Most, if not all new Mazdas are calling for 5W-20 now EXCEPT 2.3 DISI equipped cars, which requires 5W-30 (5W-40 if you have weeping turbo seals), therefore I don't want some yokel pouring 5W-20 dino into my car and crossthreading my plastic filter canister.
I'd highly recommend Redline to anyone, but remember that you're living in a cover-your-@ss world. What Honda doesn't know won't hurt them. If you're dead set on using Redline, go buy a jug of PP at WalMart, make a copy of the receipt, and then return the oil. Use the copy as your oil change record and forget about it. You're not going to suffer an oil-related failure by using Redline, so that's where the issue will die. If your engine throws a rod, spins a bearing, loses a cam, etc. it was going to happen no matter which oil you used. Someone screwed up at the factory and your car was pre-determined to die early. Honda will verify your oil change records, and fix it under warranty.
Just don't make the mistake of using Redline's racing oil for your street driven car. The only time I could recommend that is if you planned to pour it in, drive across the country, and drain it. It's not intended for daily duty of cold starts, idling, short trips, etc. Buy the best street-car oil they make and drive happy.
Having said ALL that, I believe you could run Mobil 1 or Pennzoil Platinum in an Accord for 500,000 miles without a hiccup. It's the good stuff for people who don't want to go through all the warranty paperwork hassle.
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: 7777
Originally Posted By: ZZman
I put RL and Amsoil in the best category. There are probably others premium oils also.
**I never claimed "very best".
Not very best, but hands down better than the rest!!
Oh,they have pretty good tranny+gear oil too.
If RL is hands down better than any other oil, or the rest, why don't we see a lot of others here using it?
Because half the board are oil snobs that hate anything that's not on sale and put down the people that want the best.
Originally Posted By: 7777
Originally Posted By: ZZman
I put RL and Amsoil in the best category. There are probably others premium oils also.
**I never claimed "very best".
Not very best, but hands down better than the rest!!
Oh,they have pretty good tranny+gear oil too.
If RL is hands down better than any other oil, or the rest, why don't we see a lot of others here using it?
Because half the board are oil snobs that hate anything that's not on sale and put down the people that want the best.
Originally Posted By: bepperb
You're stuck with a [relatively] short OCI while you're in warranty. There simply won't be a difference between running Redline or PP/M1/SynPower/SynTec/Edge so why not save a few bucks and the hassle.
Redline the best? Hasn't been proven by anyone without a marketing degree or a brother who knows a guy who races....
I'm interested, how do you know there won't be a difference running Redline? I assume you've run two engines, one with Redline and one with the cheap stuff under identical conditions and done teardowns on both?
You're stuck with a [relatively] short OCI while you're in warranty. There simply won't be a difference between running Redline or PP/M1/SynPower/SynTec/Edge so why not save a few bucks and the hassle.
Redline the best? Hasn't been proven by anyone without a marketing degree or a brother who knows a guy who races....
I'm interested, how do you know there won't be a difference running Redline? I assume you've run two engines, one with Redline and one with the cheap stuff under identical conditions and done teardowns on both?
Originally Posted By: HARTZSKY
I can get it locally for $8.95 a quart and no shipping charges. I mean to me its a million to 1 that I would ever have an issue thats oil related.
8.20 per shipped from OG Racing.
I can get it locally for $8.95 a quart and no shipping charges. I mean to me its a million to 1 that I would ever have an issue thats oil related.
8.20 per shipped from OG Racing.
"'m interested, how do you know there won't be a difference running Redline? I assume you've run two engines, one with Redline and one with the cheap stuff under identical conditions and done teardowns on both?"
I don't know there won't be a difference. The burden of proof isn't on me, it's on Redline or you to prove that it will work better than anything else. To be honest, I'm not even sure what "better" would be... generally around here "better" means cleaner/less wear. But on either K or J series the engine will long outlive the chassis on practically any oil, as proven by millions of J series, hundreds of thousands of K series on the road now. So basically we get into a "tree falling in the woods with nobody around can anyone hear it" where sure, maybe you did something "better" but if nobody benifits from the change it's not better, just different.
So, my point is that these other oils, M1/PP/xxx will perform perfectly. So if Redline somehow works "better" the burden is on you to define what better is, and prove that the product does indeed perform.
Honestly, if I showed you five Honda J series V6's with 100,000 miles, each with M1/PP/SynPower/Syntec/Redline, how much money would you be willing to bet you could spot the redline engine? I'd give you a micrometer if you thought it would help.
Let me explain one last time. My opinion is that any will perform the same. This is evidenced by hundreds of thousands of these cars on the road with no significant differences in performance when correlated to the brand of oil used. If you want to prove there is an exception, the burden of proof is on you, not me.
I don't know there won't be a difference. The burden of proof isn't on me, it's on Redline or you to prove that it will work better than anything else. To be honest, I'm not even sure what "better" would be... generally around here "better" means cleaner/less wear. But on either K or J series the engine will long outlive the chassis on practically any oil, as proven by millions of J series, hundreds of thousands of K series on the road now. So basically we get into a "tree falling in the woods with nobody around can anyone hear it" where sure, maybe you did something "better" but if nobody benifits from the change it's not better, just different.
So, my point is that these other oils, M1/PP/xxx will perform perfectly. So if Redline somehow works "better" the burden is on you to define what better is, and prove that the product does indeed perform.
Honestly, if I showed you five Honda J series V6's with 100,000 miles, each with M1/PP/SynPower/Syntec/Redline, how much money would you be willing to bet you could spot the redline engine? I'd give you a micrometer if you thought it would help.
Let me explain one last time. My opinion is that any will perform the same. This is evidenced by hundreds of thousands of these cars on the road with no significant differences in performance when correlated to the brand of oil used. If you want to prove there is an exception, the burden of proof is on you, not me.
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Originally Posted By: bepperb
So, my point is that these other oils, M1/PP/xxx will perform perfectly. So if Redline somehow works "better" the burden is on you to define what better is, and prove that the product does indeed perform.
It should be better though. RedLine uses the best base oils money can buy and uses one of the most robust additive packages of any oil available. The only downside is cost, but you get what you pay for.
RedLine should provide the least amount of deposits of any motor oil, it has outstanding HTHS and high temp stability, the most polar base oil available, low volatility (which could improve power through superior ring seal), and a ton of moly and ZDDP for antiwear. How can this stuff not perform?
So, my point is that these other oils, M1/PP/xxx will perform perfectly. So if Redline somehow works "better" the burden is on you to define what better is, and prove that the product does indeed perform.
It should be better though. RedLine uses the best base oils money can buy and uses one of the most robust additive packages of any oil available. The only downside is cost, but you get what you pay for.
RedLine should provide the least amount of deposits of any motor oil, it has outstanding HTHS and high temp stability, the most polar base oil available, low volatility (which could improve power through superior ring seal), and a ton of moly and ZDDP for antiwear. How can this stuff not perform?
Originally Posted By: HARTZSKY
in my new Accord? The warranty etc. What do you think?
In your climate I'd recommend their 0W-20.
You'll be maximizing fuel economy and power plus you'll have all the benefits of an ester based syn including a "kick-[censored]" ad' pack'.
in my new Accord? The warranty etc. What do you think?
In your climate I'd recommend their 0W-20.
You'll be maximizing fuel economy and power plus you'll have all the benefits of an ester based syn including a "kick-[censored]" ad' pack'.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Originally Posted By: HARTZSKY
I can get it locally for $8.95 a quart and no shipping charges. I mean to me its a million to 1 that I would ever have an issue thats oil related.
That's the way I looked at it. On top of that, what are the odds that they would actually pursue the oil as the cause of failure? On top of that, how hard would it be to drain and refill if that one in a million engine failure happened?
I'm sure the towing company will take the car to your house, wait for the oil change and then take it to Honda.
Honda of course would not think about fresh oil and the engine that is not even primed from a oil change.
If you want to wear the big boy pants and take a risk, IF something happens you fix it since you did not follow the warranty requirements.
Keeping separate books or changing the oil when something happens?
That's a honest thing to do.
Quote:
But on either K or J series the engine will long outlive the chassis on practically any oil, as proven by millions of J series, hundreds of thousands of K series on the road now. So basically we get into a "tree falling in the woods with nobody around can anyone hear it" where sure, maybe you did something "better" but if nobody benifits from the change it's not better, just different.
""
Excellent post and so true.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Because half the board are oil snobs that hate anything that's not on sale and put down the people that want the best.
Still waiting on what is "best"
And people are snobs because they don't want to WASTE their $$?
Wow...
Originally Posted By: HARTZSKY
I can get it locally for $8.95 a quart and no shipping charges. I mean to me its a million to 1 that I would ever have an issue thats oil related.
That's the way I looked at it. On top of that, what are the odds that they would actually pursue the oil as the cause of failure? On top of that, how hard would it be to drain and refill if that one in a million engine failure happened?
I'm sure the towing company will take the car to your house, wait for the oil change and then take it to Honda.
Honda of course would not think about fresh oil and the engine that is not even primed from a oil change.
If you want to wear the big boy pants and take a risk, IF something happens you fix it since you did not follow the warranty requirements.
Keeping separate books or changing the oil when something happens?
That's a honest thing to do.
Quote:
But on either K or J series the engine will long outlive the chassis on practically any oil, as proven by millions of J series, hundreds of thousands of K series on the road now. So basically we get into a "tree falling in the woods with nobody around can anyone hear it" where sure, maybe you did something "better" but if nobody benifits from the change it's not better, just different.
""
Excellent post and so true.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Because half the board are oil snobs that hate anything that's not on sale and put down the people that want the best.
Still waiting on what is "best"
And people are snobs because they don't want to WASTE their $$?
Wow...
Originally Posted By: Ben99GT
It should be better though. RedLine uses the best base oils money can buy and uses one of the most robust additive packages of any oil available. The only downside is cost, but you get what you pay for.
RedLine should provide the least amount of deposits of any motor oil, it has outstanding HTHS and high temp stability, the most polar base oil available, low volatility (which could improve power through superior ring seal), and a ton of moly and ZDDP for antiwear. How can this stuff not perform?
The latest purchase...
It should be better though. RedLine uses the best base oils money can buy and uses one of the most robust additive packages of any oil available. The only downside is cost, but you get what you pay for.
RedLine should provide the least amount of deposits of any motor oil, it has outstanding HTHS and high temp stability, the most polar base oil available, low volatility (which could improve power through superior ring seal), and a ton of moly and ZDDP for antiwear. How can this stuff not perform?
The latest purchase...
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RedLine should provide the least amount of deposits of any motor oil, it has outstanding HTHS and high temp stability, the most polar base oil available, low volatility (which could improve power through superior ring seal), and a ton of moly and ZDDP for antiwear. How can this stuff not perform?
It would have a hard time not performing in a superior manner in a comparative "stressed" environment. While RL has improved the extended drain capability(by most standards, that's barely beyond OEM recommendations for some cars), it's not its target niche market.
275C for 22 hours was chosen for a reason on that chart. Not 150C of the Sequence III-G test. Not even 175C or 200C. The reason is obvious. It took that level of heat to show the distinction. That's beyond the Fire Point (not flash point) of just about any formulated motor oil.
Optimized polyol ester burns cleaner.
Again, RL produces a great product. Whether you can take advantage of the features and benefits is another story.
RedLine should provide the least amount of deposits of any motor oil, it has outstanding HTHS and high temp stability, the most polar base oil available, low volatility (which could improve power through superior ring seal), and a ton of moly and ZDDP for antiwear. How can this stuff not perform?
It would have a hard time not performing in a superior manner in a comparative "stressed" environment. While RL has improved the extended drain capability(by most standards, that's barely beyond OEM recommendations for some cars), it's not its target niche market.
275C for 22 hours was chosen for a reason on that chart. Not 150C of the Sequence III-G test. Not even 175C or 200C. The reason is obvious. It took that level of heat to show the distinction. That's beyond the Fire Point (not flash point) of just about any formulated motor oil.
Optimized polyol ester burns cleaner.
Again, RL produces a great product. Whether you can take advantage of the features and benefits is another story.
Originally Posted By: Bill in Utah
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Originally Posted By: HARTZSKY
I can get it locally for $8.95 a quart and no shipping charges. I mean to me its a million to 1 that I would ever have an issue thats oil related.
That's the way I looked at it. On top of that, what are the odds that they would actually pursue the oil as the cause of failure? On top of that, how hard would it be to drain and refill if that one in a million engine failure happened?
I'm sure the towing company will take the car to your house, wait for the oil change and then take it to Honda.
Honda of course would not think about fresh oil and the engine that is not even primed from a oil change.
If you want to wear the big boy pants and take a risk, IF something happens you fix it since you did not follow the warranty requirements.
Keeping separate books or changing the oil when something happens?
That's a honest thing to do.
Quote:
But on either K or J series the engine will long outlive the chassis on practically any oil, as proven by millions of J series, hundreds of thousands of K series on the road now. So basically we get into a "tree falling in the woods with nobody around can anyone hear it" where sure, maybe you did something "better" but if nobody benifits from the change it's not better, just different.
""
Excellent post and so true.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Because half the board are oil snobs that hate anything that's not on sale and put down the people that want the best.
Still waiting on what is "best"
And people are snobs because they don't want to WASTE their $$?
Wow...
I took the risk and had no consequences. Never even thought about it during the warranty period.
Don't preach to me about honesty. I would have no problem refilling the crankcase with approved oil because everyone here knows if there was an engine failure it was not because of the Redline. I don't see the dishonesty here, only the dealer trying to weasel out of warranty work when a much better than required oil is used. You're acting as if I was experimenting with an extreme viscosity or an SA oil, had a failure, and tried to cover it up. Give me a break.
Yes, you guys are snobs. You talk [censored] every time someone uses anything but the cheapest dino stuff that's on sale. Sorry but some of us like the best. We both know the benefits of Redline, I don't care to get into that.
Some of us will drive the cars till the wheels fall off and as I've stated in my climate the engine will likely be the determining factor as to when it goes to the junkyard.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Originally Posted By: HARTZSKY
I can get it locally for $8.95 a quart and no shipping charges. I mean to me its a million to 1 that I would ever have an issue thats oil related.
That's the way I looked at it. On top of that, what are the odds that they would actually pursue the oil as the cause of failure? On top of that, how hard would it be to drain and refill if that one in a million engine failure happened?
I'm sure the towing company will take the car to your house, wait for the oil change and then take it to Honda.
Honda of course would not think about fresh oil and the engine that is not even primed from a oil change.
If you want to wear the big boy pants and take a risk, IF something happens you fix it since you did not follow the warranty requirements.
Keeping separate books or changing the oil when something happens?
That's a honest thing to do.
Quote:
But on either K or J series the engine will long outlive the chassis on practically any oil, as proven by millions of J series, hundreds of thousands of K series on the road now. So basically we get into a "tree falling in the woods with nobody around can anyone hear it" where sure, maybe you did something "better" but if nobody benifits from the change it's not better, just different.
""
Excellent post and so true.
Originally Posted By: BuickGN
Because half the board are oil snobs that hate anything that's not on sale and put down the people that want the best.
Still waiting on what is "best"
And people are snobs because they don't want to WASTE their $$?
Wow...
I took the risk and had no consequences. Never even thought about it during the warranty period.
Don't preach to me about honesty. I would have no problem refilling the crankcase with approved oil because everyone here knows if there was an engine failure it was not because of the Redline. I don't see the dishonesty here, only the dealer trying to weasel out of warranty work when a much better than required oil is used. You're acting as if I was experimenting with an extreme viscosity or an SA oil, had a failure, and tried to cover it up. Give me a break.
Yes, you guys are snobs. You talk [censored] every time someone uses anything but the cheapest dino stuff that's on sale. Sorry but some of us like the best. We both know the benefits of Redline, I don't care to get into that.
Some of us will drive the cars till the wheels fall off and as I've stated in my climate the engine will likely be the determining factor as to when it goes to the junkyard.
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Quote:
I don't see the dishonesty here, only the dealer trying to weasel out of warranty work when a much better than required oil is used. You're acting as if I was experimenting with an extreme viscosity or an SA oil, had a failure, and tried to cover it up. Give me a break.
Exactly. It's the weasel and hassle factor not "honesty". The dealer will always default on a disingenuous assertion that nullified your warranty when there is no relationship between the cause and the denial.
You're eliminating an escape hatch for liars.
I don't see the dishonesty here, only the dealer trying to weasel out of warranty work when a much better than required oil is used. You're acting as if I was experimenting with an extreme viscosity or an SA oil, had a failure, and tried to cover it up. Give me a break.
Exactly. It's the weasel and hassle factor not "honesty". The dealer will always default on a disingenuous assertion that nullified your warranty when there is no relationship between the cause and the denial.
You're eliminating an escape hatch for liars.
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