Shop Labor Dispute

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I DID provide evidence, but you were did not read it. Here it is again:
Originally Posted By: veryHeavy
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
It'd be wise to research Texas case law before dispensing legal advice.

Done. It is called "deceptive trade practices" and it includes bait & switch scams. Here is one such case:

https://www.texasattorneygeneral.gov/oagnews/release.php?id=2747 "Texas Attorney General Greg Abbott today charged two online digital camera and electronics retailers with conducting an unlawful bait-and-switch sales scheme."
 
I did read your linked press release, and that's most certainly not "evidence." How in the world does that have anything to do with what's going on here?
 
Originally Posted By: veryHeavy
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
Suggestions?

After you sign a receipt, you're pretty much done. You can dispute the charge but Visa or MasterCard will say, "We were given a copy of the receipt, and you signed it."

Warranty complaint is still an option, if it was not installed correctly. You might need to a lawyer, or the Texas consumer affairs department.


That's not always true.. this isnt bestbuy and hes not buying a tv.
 
BAIT: "We will just have to eat the labor cost & do it for free." - Service Advisor

SWITCH: "Here's your bill for $300 labor."

It is a blatantly obvious case of bait & switch. The customer was promised a free install on rack #2, but then he was handed a bill. It's an open and shut case.
 
Originally Posted By: NHGUY
From my point of view,being in the business...is...after 12 years you got your ONE warranty exchange,and that is where their warranty liability ends.You don't get endless free replacements after that.Plus,most manufacturers offer ZERO labor claims,those that do issue flat rate national paid labor for a period of 90 days to one year,not 12 years.Next time you pay for one outright,you get a new warranty for ONE replacement.As for the quality of these,they must be Cardone rebuilds...try a BBB industries next time.They bought out ATSCO a while back.


He's not getting endless replacements when his ONE warranty exchange turned into a few defectives..

Reading your comment, especially since your'e "in the business" is quite infuriating.

I'll give you the benefit of the doubt and just assume you didn't thoroughly read the OP. I am guilty of that too.
 
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Go back and carefully re-read the first post. What you're so emphatically stating happened did not actually occur.

"I'm under the impression that I won't have to pay for labor. When asked about this I was told " the manuf. don't reimburse us, we just have to eat it." "

He was promised free labor to remove & replace the defective unit.
He was then charged.
Baited with "free" and then switched to $300. It is very clear & it would be clear to a judge too (if you went that far). This is my last post on the topic, because I don't want to be banned over this pointless debate. I'm outta here.
 
I should not have to explain this to someone who's accusing a business of fraudulent activity.

At no point was he "promised free labor." Those are solely your words. Furthermore, your "evidence" was to provide the press release from an entirely unrelated situation; not relevant Texas case law that would establish any criminal element to this matter.

What did occur is that he made an assumption about what a statement meant. A misunderstanding? Sure. It's not however a legal, valid, enforceable contract that the breach of would constitute the basis of a legal action moving forward.

Know what would be neat to see? If OP had actually mentioned the company name, they'd have sufficient standing to pursue you under Texas libel laws.
 
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
As a former P80 Volvo owner, I'm willing to bet this thing is only still in service because he has some sort of sentimental attachment, and has done most of the work himself. It's at the age/mileage now where a bunch of stuff starts going wrong on these cars, and it gets very expensive, very quickly; racking up bills in the several thousand dollar range (well exceeding vehicle value, which is why you find so many of them in junkyards) is commonplace.

Wasn't this the same guy that was having all sorts of power steering problems awhile back? I distinctly remember a thread about AT-205 and perpetual leakage. So after the mechanic-in-a-bottle, it failed, but was still covered under warranty.
Dude, why refer to me in the 3rd person? As if I'm not present? You're projecting, missing the target by a WIDE mark and don't know me nor the facts. Further, you're dragging my post off-topic by arguing with others. You can PM the other guy if you want to argue.

AT-205 was used and did stop the leak on the passenger side. Go back & read post #1. I remember you now...you wanted to argue about what AT-205 was and wasn't, didn't you?

Valvoline 100% synthetic ATF contains conditioners & additives appropriate to both PS systems that use ATF and auto transmissions using same. Does its use VOID any warranties? No.

You're not only barking up the wrong tree, you're barking mad...at your own reflection...

You should troll some other post or even better, back away from the keyboard!
 
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
missing the target by a WIDE mark and don't know me nor the facts.

As I already said, I'm a former P80 owner (thus hitting up their forums), and familiar with you from MVS. You not only posted the same thing over there (as this thread), but also posted this: https://www.matthewsvolvosite.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=77588

Here was my assesment:
"this thing is only still in service because he has some sort of sentimental attachment, and has done most of the work himself. It's at the age/mileage now where a bunch of stuff starts going wrong on these cars, and it gets very expensive, very quickly; racking up bills in the several thousand dollar range (well exceeding vehicle value, which is why you find so many of them in junkyards) is commonplace."

Here's what you had to say:
"Following up on Tryingbe's theme, here's a list of sled-work performed over the past eight months. I did all of it myself, except for the alignment. It's occupied ALL of my free time + badly encroached on lots of other time I usually spend on other tasks like yard work, house maintainence, contract work, woodworking, excercise, social visits, etc.

1. Original ETC sensor went Tango Uniform, making the sled very difficult to start in 50°F weather. Female socket crumbled. Will rebuild later. Found Volvo part in BA box locally for $27.
98 V70 Cold Start Problem Solved
ECT Connector Failure - Fixed

2. ECC lost it's head, blowing 100% HOT air towards drivers side. Pulled ECC code indicated a faulty driver temp control damper motor. Pulled & tested; it was fine. Extensive schematic reading & voltage testing revealed the ECC was itself faulty and wasn't capable of testing itself: Above ckt had a faulty motor driver that wouldn't reverse polarity. $100 for local & on-line used part. Got lucky and found one in a PNP for $16 that actually worked. Also discovered fault in Autodiagnos' motor calibration program.
98 V70 ECC-211 Damper Motor Position Sensor Fault
98 V70 ECC Driver HOT Passenger COLD Issue

3. Discovered turbo WG severely out-of-spec. Unfortunately, it's been like that since 1998 when I bought the car used from a dealer. They must have detuned it when it served as a loaner....
98 V70 Wastegate Rod Adjustment Results

4. Leaking WP gasket discovered. Later fixed.....
98 V70 Hepu WP Gasket Leaking
Front Crank Seals & Water Pump Leaking

5. IPD skidplate bushings replaced.

6. T-stat gasket split, causing coolant leak on garage floor. During replacement, discovered upper original radiator hose was coming apart from the inside out.

7. Discovered TB was riding outside of the TB idler pulley upon inspection! Warned to not drive the car until it's fixed.
TB Idler Pulley Offset w/ Belt

8. Replaced WP gasket, TB, idler & ten pulleys with OEM parts. These pulleys were all worn after 7yrs/70 kmi. New TB rides in the middle...where it should.
TB & WP Gasket Service

9. All coolant hoses save for heater, replaced with OEM. Remaining turbo compressor vacuum hose also replaced.
Lower Turbo Vacuum Hose Stuck

10. Auto transmission fluid flushed.

11. Power steering boots torn; rack's been leaking for years. Installed new boots. Flushed PS fluid. Added AT-205 which actually stopped the leaks! Cleaned up the mess down below. Leaks stopped and pump no longer noisy.
Power Steering Service
Power Steering Service

12. Outer TR boots torn. Replaced with Meyle HD outer tie rods. Sled needs an alignment.

13. Coolant tank cap replaced last year has now split. Installed a better part.

14. Broken plastic clip on front air dam repaired so it latches once again.

15. Misfire codes pulled. Bougi wire set displays blue glow after many years. Needs replacement. Tracking found in dist. cap & rotor. Both cleaned up and plug wires replaced. New spark plugs installed.

16. Oil filter replaced.

17. ABS light illuminated after a long period of darkness. Investigation reveals previous fix finally failed. One bolt head stripped during removal. Ground off with Moto-tool. Motor terminals fixed again by widening contact with board. Reinstalled and ABS light now off. New bolts installed.
ABS Module Repair

18. Both front wheel guards reinstalled with new rivets.

19. Brake pads on all four corners replaced. Rotors OK. Brake fluid flushed with new.
Brake Pad Options

20. Cabin air blower speed very unstable on original OEM blower. Investigation revealed the commutator flat worn out. Replaced with new unit. Evap. core also cleaned and new cabin air filter installed.
Blower Motor Lubrication
Cabin Blower & Evap Core Service

21. Radiator fan began running with key out. Fault traced to faulty ETC female socket mentioned earlier. Extensive corrosion noted. Wiring & socket replaced using tinned copper, teflon-insulated wire.
ECT Connector Failure - Fixed

22. Discovered large, rigid, plastic PCV line from sep. box to intake was cracked just below distributer, rendering system inoperative. Fixed cracked section with a 4" section of silicone vac hose until I'm able to update hose per MVS recommendations. (Entire PCV system was replaced previously and this hose was cracked in-the-same-place! Fortunately no clogs were detected due to 100% synthetic oil use).
Hard Plastic PCV Pipe Broken

23. Rotted bumpers on both rear seat latches replaced with a pad of Sonneborn NP-1.
Rear Seat Latch Rattle Solved

24. Upon replacement of upper torque bushing, discovered Meyle replacement was too small! Previous OEM unit was reinstalled and remedy sought from Meyle.
Issue with Meyle HD Upper Torque Bushing

25. All electric door latch mechanisms began to slow/fail in Summer heat. Passenger door lever frozen; unable to open door from inside. Internal fault was worn out plastic, allowing metal cable holder to shift. Fixed with a brass screw. All four latch motors were cleaned, lubricated, as well as latch mechanisms. Multiple failures on adhesives used on HD polyethylene, allowing motor cover to seperate inside, disabling latch. Finally solved using UL-181BX acrylic adhesive duct tape.
Door Latch Motors Repaired
Bonding HD Polyethylene

26. Several internal door panel mounts failed during the above and needed to be reglued to ensure panel would remain tightly in place.

27. RR door latch mechanism later quits due to internal spring failure. Obtain PNP replacement and rebuild as above.
Door Latch Internal Spring Failure

28. Wicked P0-455 code returned: GROSS Evap Leak. Later traced to faulty 6 mo. old OEM gas cap seal. Replaced. Went away. Now it's back in Sept!
EVAP System Operation
P0-455: Gross EVAP Leak
Tracking Down EVAP Leaks with Smoke

29. Found (some) fog light parts @ PNP. Finally secured all save for shortened air dam inserts. (Still looking....).
Fog Light Schematic Q
Fog Light Installation Q

30. Went for alignment only to be told by one shop rack is too worn! Odd that....went to another. Thrust angle off to driver side. Front end over toed-in by 3X too much. Steering wheel recentered. Noticeable improvement in ride quality & lower vibration. Haven't added any fluid to PS rack for months now!
Steering Rack Too Worn for Alignment?

31. Oil and coolant spots on garage floor. WP gasket leaking due to not using new bolts. Didn't realize at time of replacement some bolts exit the rear! Leaked stopped with new bolts which come with RTV on threads.
Reseal Water Pump

32. Noticeable steering wheel vibration over speed bumps, rough roads and upon start traced to absence of lower, metal knee bolster which serves to tie wheel mount to both outer and inside console. Reinstallation eliminated all wheel vibrations. Pass. side bolster & cover also reinstalled along with glove box. (This was all previously removed while troubleshooting ECC fault noted above, cabin blower motor installation and fog light relay installation).
Steering Wheel Vibration Caused by Missing Knee Bolsters

33. Inspection revealed front, lower torque and both hydraulic motor mounts were Tango Uniform. Explained sharp, coarse, "crashing" of front end over rough roads & pot holes. Replacement of all was a major undertaking without a lift or engine hoist, but results were well worth it as lower torque & both hydrau. motor mounts were original (18yrs old). Engine sits much higher in bay and easily rocks by hand. Back end of motor no longer sits on sub-frame.
Reflections on Refitting Lower Hydraulic Motor Mounts

34. Oil discharge on pass side diagnosed to leaking 7yr. old front camshaft seals last replaced by indy. Removal was quite difficult as they were fossilized in place and came out in pieces. New seals installed. Mess cleaned up yet again and no more oil nor coolant leaks in garage!!
Cam Timing Q
Reflections on Front Cam Seal Replacement

35. Various front & rear vibration issues to sort out.
Rear End Vibration
More Rear End Vibration

I'm finally finished...nine months later. Quite a marathon of work...one-thing-after-another-after-another. No wonder people ditch these cars. Not sure how much all of this would cost if someone else were to fix it. $4000? $5000? $6000? I spent about $550 in parts and fluids.

No doubt I left out a few things, like a lot of time spent cleaning grease, oil, coolant, grime off the underside. Makes me tired just typing it all! However, it is ALL NOW DONE and behind me, and no longer leaks, and rides very nice. Shocks, struts, spring seats, upper strut bearings, lower control arms, CV joint boots, tires, extensive P0-455 dragon slaying, were all replaced last year & year before. (Even more work and $$$ to add to the list.....).

I bought the sled from a local dealer in 1998 with 12 kmi on the odometer. Current mileage is about 214,500. She came out of the factory in Aug. 1997, so she's officially 19 yrs old! Never owned any car this old, nor this long. Previous milestone was a 1985 SAAB 900T I bought new, drove for 14yrs and racked up 256,000mi on many journeys. Gas was MUCH cheaper then plus I had more time for car trips, camp outs, travels. Lots of great memories. The SAAB was MUCH easier to work on, much simplier systems too. More room with an in-line four cylinder.

I've driven Swedish Steel only since 1985 and only two cars. Hard to argue with that. There have been times though.......................

I have gained a GREAT RESPECT for all mechanics that do this work, day in and day out, in the heat & humidity and constant grime, dirt, oil, coolant, not to mention customers complaining about the bill. Cheers & beers to yall. Prosit!

Caveat Emptor to any & all who would pick up one of these old cars "cheap" without knowing or turning their own wrench. You'll either soon learn or go broke trying as both your patience & wallet will be sorely tested!"
 
But the thread is about who pays for labor when a shop installs a defective part.
 
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
missing the target by a WIDE mark and don't know me nor the facts.

As I already said, I'm a former P80 owner (thus hitting up their forums), and familiar with you from MVS. You not only posted the same thing over there (as this thread), but also posted this: https://www.matthewsvolvosite.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=77588

Here was my assesment:
"this thing is only still in service because he has some sort of sentimental attachment, and has done most of the work himself. It's at the age/mileage now where a bunch of stuff starts going wrong on these cars, and it gets very expensive, very quickly; racking up bills in the several thousand dollar range (well exceeding vehicle value, which is why you find so many of them in junkyards) is commonplace."

Here's what you had to say:
"Following up on Tryingbe's theme, here's a list of sled-work performed over the past eight months. I did all of it myself, except for the alignment. It's occupied ALL of my free time + badly encroached on lots of other time I usually spend on other tasks like yard work, house maintainence, contract work, woodworking, excercise, social visits, etc.

1. Original ETC sensor went Tango Uniform, making the sled very difficult to start in 50°F weather. Female socket crumbled. Will rebuild later. Found Volvo part in BA box locally for $27.
98 V70 Cold Start Problem Solved
ECT Connector Failure - Fixed

2. ECC lost it's head, blowing 100% HOT air towards drivers side. Pulled ECC code indicated a faulty driver temp control damper motor. Pulled & tested; it was fine. Extensive schematic reading & voltage testing revealed the ECC was itself faulty and wasn't capable of testing itself: Above ckt had a faulty motor driver that wouldn't reverse polarity. $100 for local & on-line used part. Got lucky and found one in a PNP for $16 that actually worked. Also discovered fault in Autodiagnos' motor calibration program.
98 V70 ECC-211 Damper Motor Position Sensor Fault
98 V70 ECC Driver HOT Passenger COLD Issue

3. Discovered turbo WG severely out-of-spec. Unfortunately, it's been like that since 1998 when I bought the car used from a dealer. They must have detuned it when it served as a loaner....
98 V70 Wastegate Rod Adjustment Results

4. Leaking WP gasket discovered. Later fixed.....
98 V70 Hepu WP Gasket Leaking
Front Crank Seals & Water Pump Leaking

5. IPD skidplate bushings replaced.

6. T-stat gasket split, causing coolant leak on garage floor. During replacement, discovered upper original radiator hose was coming apart from the inside out.

7. Discovered TB was riding outside of the TB idler pulley upon inspection! Warned to not drive the car until it's fixed.
TB Idler Pulley Offset w/ Belt

8. Replaced WP gasket, TB, idler & ten pulleys with OEM parts. These pulleys were all worn after 7yrs/70 kmi. New TB rides in the middle...where it should.
TB & WP Gasket Service

9. All coolant hoses save for heater, replaced with OEM. Remaining turbo compressor vacuum hose also replaced.
Lower Turbo Vacuum Hose Stuck

10. Auto transmission fluid flushed.

11. Power steering boots torn; rack's been leaking for years. Installed new boots. Flushed PS fluid. Added AT-205 which actually stopped the leaks! Cleaned up the mess down below. Leaks stopped and pump no longer noisy.
Power Steering Service
Power Steering Service

12. Outer TR boots torn. Replaced with Meyle HD outer tie rods. Sled needs an alignment.

13. Coolant tank cap replaced last year has now split. Installed a better part.

14. Broken plastic clip on front air dam repaired so it latches once again.

15. Misfire codes pulled. Bougi wire set displays blue glow after many years. Needs replacement. Tracking found in dist. cap & rotor. Both cleaned up and plug wires replaced. New spark plugs installed.

16. Oil filter replaced.

17. ABS light illuminated after a long period of darkness. Investigation reveals previous fix finally failed. One bolt head stripped during removal. Ground off with Moto-tool. Motor terminals fixed again by widening contact with board. Reinstalled and ABS light now off. New bolts installed.
ABS Module Repair

18. Both front wheel guards reinstalled with new rivets.

19. Brake pads on all four corners replaced. Rotors OK. Brake fluid flushed with new.
Brake Pad Options

20. Cabin air blower speed very unstable on original OEM blower. Investigation revealed the commutator flat worn out. Replaced with new unit. Evap. core also cleaned and new cabin air filter installed.
Blower Motor Lubrication
Cabin Blower & Evap Core Service

21. Radiator fan began running with key out. Fault traced to faulty ETC female socket mentioned earlier. Extensive corrosion noted. Wiring & socket replaced using tinned copper, teflon-insulated wire.
ECT Connector Failure - Fixed

22. Discovered large, rigid, plastic PCV line from sep. box to intake was cracked just below distributer, rendering system inoperative. Fixed cracked section with a 4" section of silicone vac hose until I'm able to update hose per MVS recommendations. (Entire PCV system was replaced previously and this hose was cracked in-the-same-place! Fortunately no clogs were detected due to 100% synthetic oil use).
Hard Plastic PCV Pipe Broken

23. Rotted bumpers on both rear seat latches replaced with a pad of Sonneborn NP-1.
Rear Seat Latch Rattle Solved

24. Upon replacement of upper torque bushing, discovered Meyle replacement was too small! Previous OEM unit was reinstalled and remedy sought from Meyle.
Issue with Meyle HD Upper Torque Bushing

25. All electric door latch mechanisms began to slow/fail in Summer heat. Passenger door lever frozen; unable to open door from inside. Internal fault was worn out plastic, allowing metal cable holder to shift. Fixed with a brass screw. All four latch motors were cleaned, lubricated, as well as latch mechanisms. Multiple failures on adhesives used on HD polyethylene, allowing motor cover to seperate inside, disabling latch. Finally solved using UL-181BX acrylic adhesive duct tape.
Door Latch Motors Repaired
Bonding HD Polyethylene

26. Several internal door panel mounts failed during the above and needed to be reglued to ensure panel would remain tightly in place.

27. RR door latch mechanism later quits due to internal spring failure. Obtain PNP replacement and rebuild as above.
Door Latch Internal Spring Failure

28. Wicked P0-455 code returned: GROSS Evap Leak. Later traced to faulty 6 mo. old OEM gas cap seal. Replaced. Went away. Now it's back in Sept!
EVAP System Operation
P0-455: Gross EVAP Leak
Tracking Down EVAP Leaks with Smoke

29. Found (some) fog light parts @ PNP. Finally secured all save for shortened air dam inserts. (Still looking....).
Fog Light Schematic Q
Fog Light Installation Q

30. Went for alignment only to be told by one shop rack is too worn! Odd that....went to another. Thrust angle off to driver side. Front end over toed-in by 3X too much. Steering wheel recentered. Noticeable improvement in ride quality & lower vibration. Haven't added any fluid to PS rack for months now!
Steering Rack Too Worn for Alignment?

31. Oil and coolant spots on garage floor. WP gasket leaking due to not using new bolts. Didn't realize at time of replacement some bolts exit the rear! Leaked stopped with new bolts which come with RTV on threads.
Reseal Water Pump

32. Noticeable steering wheel vibration over speed bumps, rough roads and upon start traced to absence of lower, metal knee bolster which serves to tie wheel mount to both outer and inside console. Reinstallation eliminated all wheel vibrations. Pass. side bolster & cover also reinstalled along with glove box. (This was all previously removed while troubleshooting ECC fault noted above, cabin blower motor installation and fog light relay installation).
Steering Wheel Vibration Caused by Missing Knee Bolsters

33. Inspection revealed front, lower torque and both hydraulic motor mounts were Tango Uniform. Explained sharp, coarse, "crashing" of front end over rough roads & pot holes. Replacement of all was a major undertaking without a lift or engine hoist, but results were well worth it as lower torque & both hydrau. motor mounts were original (18yrs old). Engine sits much higher in bay and easily rocks by hand. Back end of motor no longer sits on sub-frame.
Reflections on Refitting Lower Hydraulic Motor Mounts

34. Oil discharge on pass side diagnosed to leaking 7yr. old front camshaft seals last replaced by indy. Removal was quite difficult as they were fossilized in place and came out in pieces. New seals installed. Mess cleaned up yet again and no more oil nor coolant leaks in garage!!
Cam Timing Q
Reflections on Front Cam Seal Replacement

35. Various front & rear vibration issues to sort out.
Rear End Vibration
More Rear End Vibration

I'm finally finished...nine months later. Quite a marathon of work...one-thing-after-another-after-another. No wonder people ditch these cars. Not sure how much all of this would cost if someone else were to fix it. $4000? $5000? $6000? I spent about $550 in parts and fluids.

No doubt I left out a few things, like a lot of time spent cleaning grease, oil, coolant, grime off the underside. Makes me tired just typing it all! However, it is ALL NOW DONE and behind me, and no longer leaks, and rides very nice. Shocks, struts, spring seats, upper strut bearings, lower control arms, CV joint boots, tires, extensive P0-455 dragon slaying, were all replaced last year & year before. (Even more work and $$$ to add to the list.....).

I bought the sled from a local dealer in 1998 with 12 kmi on the odometer. Current mileage is about 214,500. She came out of the factory in Aug. 1997, so she's officially 19 yrs old! Never owned any car this old, nor this long. Previous milestone was a 1985 SAAB 900T I bought new, drove for 14yrs and racked up 256,000mi on many journeys. Gas was MUCH cheaper then plus I had more time for car trips, camp outs, travels. Lots of great memories. The SAAB was MUCH easier to work on, much simplier systems too. More room with an in-line four cylinder.

I've driven Swedish Steel only since 1985 and only two cars. Hard to argue with that. There have been times though.......................

I have gained a GREAT RESPECT for all mechanics that do this work, day in and day out, in the heat & humidity and constant grime, dirt, oil, coolant, not to mention customers complaining about the bill. Cheers & beers to yall. Prosit!

Caveat Emptor to any & all who would pick up one of these old cars "cheap" without knowing or turning their own wrench. You'll either soon learn or go broke trying as both your patience & wallet will be sorely tested!"


Dude...you're approaching stalker levels of creepy.
 
Originally Posted By: Jarlaxle
Originally Posted By: Ramblejam
(5-page essay deleted)


Dude...you're approaching stalker levels of creepy.

Agree.
Also ANY judge would say, "Eat the cost of labor" is an idiom which means "free labor" on the second install. So the customer would win, and the garage would lose. (Consumer Protection Laws almost always decide for the customer.)
 
Whomever the shop buys parts from almost certainly has a process to claim for the labor. I have been in the Auto Parts business for 20 years it is standard. Also touted as a major reason to use such supplier. I would ask the shop to file a claim for the 2nd and 3rd installation labor and reimburse me if they get paid. They have a relationship with their supplier that is a 2 way street. I have authorized tens of thousands in warranty reimbursement myself.
 
Wow...rj sure has the bit in his mouth, eh? He's now on MY ignore list so I didn't see his original post. His train long left the station for "stalker levels of creepy". Typical of 'net trolls....

More info:
  • I noticed on my car key tag both the license plate # and manufacturer are wrong.
  • On the receipt, the vehicle mileage is more than 5,000mi out-of-date and the license plate # is wrong.
  • On the NEXT receipt, they corrected the mileage but not the plate #, which was 3 sets of plates ago. Obviously no one bothered to check.
  • "Warranty is 12mo or 12,000mi whichever occurs first, unless specified otherwise"
  • I signed no work authorization, no final bill. Never was asked to.

Point being, no attention to current details.
 
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
Wow...rj sure has the bit in his mouth, eh? He's now on MY ignore list so I didn't see his original post. His train long left the station for "stalker levels of creepy". Typical of 'net trolls....

More info:
  • I noticed on my car key tag both the license plate # and manufacturer are wrong.
  • On the receipt, the vehicle mileage is more than 5,000mi out-of-date and the license plate # is wrong.
  • On the NEXT receipt, they corrected the mileage but not the plate #, which was 3 sets of plates ago. Obviously no one bothered to check.
  • "Warranty is 12mo or 12,000mi whichever occurs first, unless specified otherwise"
  • I signed no work authorization, no final bill. Never was asked to.

Point being, no attention to current details.


In California if there is no customer signature on the original work order, they owe nothing. They also have to keep records of any changes in price and who and how was contacted to approve them.
 
Originally Posted By: sleddriver
..... "If we put in 5 racks, you don't think all that labor would be free, do you?"



Yeah, I do. This is an issue between the shop and their supplier. The risk of loss is not your concern. If I contract with a shop to furnish me a working replacement steering rack, they are paid for a rack and install, and the rack is defective, on my end of the contract there is failure of consideration - I didn't get what I paid for.

I would want my piece of paper back that entitled me to a free rack after twelve years, and all my money back, so I could go somewhere else. Or they can just keep having at it until they get a good rack in there.

Why should the risk of loss fall on you? You agreed to pay money. Was your money good?. They agreed to install a rack. Was their rack any good? They agreed to do risky stuff for money. Seems straightforward to me.
 
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