Rusted Brake Lines

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I have a 98 Expedition 5.4 4x4.
The vehicle is from the north and the steel brake lines are showing heavy rusting on the outside.
I would like to start changing them out, starting at the distribution valve.
Any advice on this proceedure?
Can I buy the brake lines from the dealer already bent, or should I just buy pre-terminated lengths and bend them myself?
Or plan to flare and terminate steel lines myself?
Anyone with any experience in this area?
 
I bought some pre-terminated lengths from Napa to replace the section from the proportioning valve to the passenger side flex hose.

I had access to the bending tools and it was not difficult using the broken line as a template. I had to use a coupler, which I did not really want to do.

I hear the Preterminated lengths Napa sells are much easier to bend than the line you flare yourself, but have no proof or corroboration of this, and am interested in the replies of those more knowledgeable.
 
I have this problem right now,on a 95 neon. BAD rusted. i did ask my local mechanic...he said you can go to NAPA and ask em for brake lines. but..your going to have to flair the lines yuorself, and make sure yuo put connectors on the ends, to thread em back onto ports. he would o it for a price of course. each brake line goes for something like $22 a piece.
i asked a few chrysler dealers around me over the past 6 or 7 years about pre bent brake lines. they all told me the same thing( like 5 of them) chrysler dosnt have anymore around for a neon...yuor going to have to flair the lines to fit.
as fora Ford* i dunno. Try calling local dealers and dont give up. About 3 years ago, i was looking for new pre bent fuel lines...thier was only 4 left iin the entire chrysler company, but they dont ship* ide have to pick it up. hard to do, since im in CT, adn they were around the kentuckey, NC areas.
I found a local chrysler dealer just enetering NY from me, in Rye..he had 2 of them! sold em to me for $19 a piece. i found him by talking to another dealer. other dealers didnt tell me about him.
good luck in yuor brake line fix*
 
Buy the sticks of pre made stuff, some couplings and and a double flaring tool, then do the work yourself. I'ts pretty easy to do.
 
Flaring the ends is really easy. It would be the easiest part of the job, actually.

I never figured out why they couldn't make these [censored] things out of stainless. Never had to replace one on my euro cars.
 
Stainless is (generally) more prone to fatigue, and issues like Stress Corrosion cracking than carbon steels (generally are).
 
You can get lines all different lenghts and might get lucky most of the time if you are just changing 1 or 2 lines.
But if you are going to do much you will surely have to learn to make a DOUBLE FLARE properly.

You will need a double flaring kit, a cutter and a bending tool so you dont end up with a "kink". Also a set of line wrenches is nice.

One tip I can give you is when removing an old rusted line dont waste time trying to get the nut loose from the line, just cut the line close to the nut then use a 6 point socket over the nut to remove it.
 
Skip the flaring all together, and use pre-flared lines with union fittings in between the flares. That's what 95% of garages would do around me for that repair, as a legal, safe repair. Cost of those lines should be about $6-8 apiece for the longest ones. I'd wildly guess it would be approximately $100-120 worth of lines and fittings to do an Expedition.

Get a set of tubing pliers or something else besides that cheesy "tubing bender" they rent/sell at most parts stores. That will save you a lot of frustration.
 
Turns out a halfway decent flare tool is only around $20. Try looking on amazon. A double flare tool also makes bubble flares, just quit halfway.

Lots of brake line now comes with a thin layer of green stuff-- plastic or something-or-other, looks like it's supposed to help it last longer.

It's pretty likely the wheel cylinders, Tees, and prop valve have different size/thread nuts than the ones on prebuilt lines. The master cylinder will have four different sizes to help the assembly line people get it right. Plus you have an acre of frame between the firewall and rear axle. I'd get at least one 25 foot roll of bulk line for flaring.

You can get adapters from the standard 3/16 double flare line nut to the wheel or master cylinder but they're $6 or so each and you pretty much have to bring the old one to the parts store to compare. They won't be able to look it up for you in any computer. They could probably pull a wheel cylinder or caliper to check its thread if business is slow... but better to bring it in.

By the time you get adaptors, unions every five feet, etc in the pursuit of not flaring, it gets expensive and you have more failure points.

If you flare, you can often reuse the old end nuts. They don't look great but will work.

Hint, if the end nuts are threaded all they way down they go with a double flare (looks like a funnel). If they have a smooth spot all the way down, they go with a bubble flare. There is no rule anymore about domestic vs foreign, metric vs standard, bubble double. Especially on Fords.
lol.gif
What you find, you put back.

Finally, flare or line wrenches look cool but rarely work for me. My "best" brake tools are regular open end wrenches, vise grips, and 6 pt sockets after cutting the lines off. You can apply the torque you need with an open end wrench on new lines.

Advance auto has the bulk brake line but you have to ask. They also have bags of ten unions for $8 while they will happily sell them one at a time for $3 ea.
 
Originally Posted By: Fitz98
I have a 98 Expedition 5.4 4x4.
The vehicle is from the north and the steel brake lines are showing heavy rusting on the outside.
I would like to start changing them out, starting at the distribution valve.
Any advice on this proceedure?
Can I buy the brake lines from the dealer already bent, or should I just buy pre-terminated lengths and bend them myself?
Or plan to flare and terminate steel lines myself?
Anyone with any experience in this area?


If you looked under most any vehicle up here the rust would scare you......
I advise to wash the undercarriage with a pressure washer, let it dry and oil spray it. If it's not leaking, don't mess with it !
 
Originally Posted By: sciphi
Skip the flaring all together, and use pre-flared lines with union fittings in between the flares. That's what 95% of garages would do around me for that repair, as a legal, safe repair. Cost of those lines should be about $6-8 apiece for the longest ones. I'd wildly guess it would be approximately $100-120 worth of lines and fittings to do an Expedition.

Get a set of tubing pliers or something else besides that cheesy "tubing bender" they rent/sell at most parts stores. That will save you a lot of frustration.



Your going to run into different size nut and threads on the same size line so you are going to have to do some flaring and switching of nuts on the line because preflared lines only comes with one size nut. I run into this all the time on M/C or distribution valves. It drives me crazy.
 
Originally Posted By: bradepb
Originally Posted By: sciphi
Skip the flaring all together, and use pre-flared lines with union fittings in between the flares. That's what 95% of garages would do around me for that repair, as a legal, safe repair. Cost of those lines should be about $6-8 apiece for the longest ones. I'd wildly guess it would be approximately $100-120 worth of lines and fittings to do an Expedition.

Get a set of tubing pliers or something else besides that cheesy "tubing bender" they rent/sell at most parts stores. That will save you a lot of frustration.



Your going to run into different size nut and threads on the same size line so you are going to have to do some flaring and switching of nuts on the line because preflared lines only comes with one size nut. I run into this all the time on M/C or distribution valves. It drives me crazy.


I stand corrected.

The suggestion was intended to reduce the amount of flaring needed in the project so it could go faster instead of flaring every single line being replaced.
 
I am doing my 99 Expedition next month.
I use Copper nickel line,you can find it at AA under the name NiCopp.Order it online and pick it up in store.They also have nuts or you can get them at NAPA.

This stuff will never rot is DOT approved and used as OEM on many high end cars.You can bend it around your finger without kinking without any tools even a 90 degree is easy with your fingers.
AA will loan you a flairing tool if you don't want to buy one,the NiCopp flairs easily.

Using this line will reduce the time of the job by half,and be a lot easier than steel lines.
Whatever you do never use a compression union to join brake lines it dangerous and in most states illegal.


http://www.advanceautoparts.com/1/1/5416...rt-cnc-325.html

This is the manufacturer of line AA sells.
It is 90/10 copper nickel same as Porsch,Rolls Royce,Aston martin,Volvo etc use

http://www.agscompany.com/automotive/brake-fuel-transmission-lines/nicopp
 
no matter what use anti-seize compound on ALL bolts on the bottom of the truck, and more important the break line tubing nuts.
 
Great advice from all. I have decided to use the Poly-Armour.
20.00 for 25 feet, and new fittings about 3-5 bucks for 4-6 of them depending on size. Autozone has free usage of their flaring tool and bender. I figure if I got more than 10 years out of the conventional steel lines from the factory and the vehicle is from Conneticut, then I should get the rest of the life of the vehicle in Florida from the Poly-Armour.
I like the idea of using anti-seize. Will definately do that.
Some funky bends ahead of me....

Anyone know why the front portions of the lines have that spiral winding around the line? I was curious about that.

Also on my truck, there is a piece of flex stainless in the middle of the line connecting the master cylinder to the proportion valve. Is that just for ease of install? I would imagine I will be O.K using a hard connection there right?
 
Originally Posted By: Fitz98

Also on my truck, there is a piece of flex stainless in the middle of the line connecting the master cylinder to the proportion valve. Is that just for ease of install? I would imagine I will be O.K using a hard connection there right?


Personally, I would replace like with like. Automakers aren't going to add more pieces (and more expensive ones at that) if they don't need to. Perhaps this is a point of vehicle flex and hard lines would fail in that area due to movement or twisting.

It's your brakes - put it back like you found it.
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If you are removing a line that is going to be replaced, cut it off close to the nut with a hacksaw. [takes 10 seconds]
Then you can use a flank drive or 6 point socket to remove the fastener without stripping it with a line wrench and resorting to vice grips and cussing.
 
On the older cars where there was risk of brake line flex, usually at the master cylinder where the firewall flexes independently from the frame, they put about 720 degrees of couple-inch-diameter curls in the line, basically making what looks like a spring coil.

The spiral winding is some sort of rock protection. I don't know anyone that sticks that on aftermarket replacement lines, or where you'd even find it. It could also be to protect the lines when they are rapidly yanked and unfolded on the assembly line in the first place.

Be careful if you find a 10mm wheel cylinder that you don't try to thread a 3/8" nut in there. It'll go just long enough to strip out. As ghetto as it looks and sounds I'd reuse the existing nuts whenever possible to be sure you're right.
 
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