RL 5W30 vs M1 5W30 vs 1997 Toyota 1MZ-FE

CelicaGT6 · Nov 30, 2004

I got my second UOA back via e-mail today:

The older sample was M1 5W30 with about 5300 miles on it and one oil filter change prior to draining. I have been using Toyota filters exclusively on these two samples. I also changed the filter once on this new sample.

For my new oil I am now using a K&N filter with the RL oil. I am anxious to see if they numbers change significantly.

The copper comment piques my interest. Anyone have any ideas why the copper level was so high?

Adrian

buster · Nov 30, 2004

Nice report. Don't know why the copper is high. My brother has the same engine in his car. He just took a sample of Mobil 1 5w-30 for 6,500 miles and we should be getting that back late this week. Here is the 5k one.

3.0L V6 M1 10w-30 UOA

Not the Autorx Frank · Nov 30, 2004

Better accross the board except copper. Nice considering a 50% longer run.

Si kinda elevated for a toy?

Terry · Nov 30, 2004

Si and copper bump are directly related. Correct Si and the copper will follow.

Al · Nov 30, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Terry:
Si and copper bump are directly related. Correct Si and the copper will follow.

The master has spoken

Steel Blue Wind Rider · Nov 30, 2004

Quick question, if previous sample was 45,000 on unit and last sample was 50,700, how did you get 7,200 miles on the oil? Wouldn't you have 52,200 on unit? Did you only put 5,700 on this last sample, not 7,200?

CelicaGT6 · Nov 30, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Steel Blue Wind Rider:
Quick question, if previous sample was 45,000 on unit and last sample was 50,700, how did you get 7,200 miles on the oil? Wouldn't you have 52,200 on unit? Did you only put 5,700 on this last sample, not 7,200?

That's an easy one. It's because I am estimating the mileage. Until recently(in the last 18 months), I did not have a working odometer. The engine was not the one that came in my car so there are a lot of idiosyncrasies with my car.

CelicaGT6 · Nov 30, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Terry:
Si and copper bump are directly related. Correct Si and the copper will follow.

Alright, I'll bite, what causes high Silicon content?

427Z06 · Nov 30, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by CelicaGT6:

quote:

Originally posted by Terry:
Si and copper bump are directly related. Correct Si and the copper will follow.

Click to expand...

Alright, I'll bite, what causes high Silicon content?

Dirt ingestion most likely through air filter/housing or vacuum plumbing.

Terry · Nov 30, 2004

Add recycled dirt that is introduced in any way to the engine.

Coolant,oxidation, reduced oil flow or volume, chemical reaction of any kind all will affect the copper component in bearings, bushings etc.

In your case it is dirt ingested as 427 noted.

Motorbike · Nov 30, 2004

Redline VOA Si 17ppm

I've seen that oil with as low as 11ppm and as high as 26ppm though

Al · Dec 1, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Motorbike:
Redline VOA Si 17ppm

I've seen that oil with as low as 11ppm and as high as 26ppm though

I went back and looked at about 25 used analysis of RL. The vast amount showed 12 or 13 or less. Some were higher but I believe those could be traced to other reasons.

Bottom line-its unlikely (IMHO) that this high silicon # is from RL.

CelicaGT6 · Dec 1, 2004

I'm trying to think back to see if I have treated the car any differently during this OCI. The only thing I recall that was different is that I ran 1/3 a can of Seafoam through the intake to clean out the combustion chambers. On this engine it did not make much of a difference (but it made a considerable difference on a 200,000 mile 87 civic).

I do not know what Seafoam is made of but it may attribute to the levels of copper and silicon.

Senor Quack · Dec 1, 2004

Well, geeze, you can't go comparing UOA's when you've used Seafoam during one of them. It might have knocked off all sorts of buried contaminates.

CelicaGT6 · Dec 1, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Senor Quack:
Well, geeze, you can't go comparing UOA's when you've used Seafoam during one of them. It might have knocked off all sorts of buried contaminates.

yeah, I realize that now. Almost makes the analysis complete useless I suppose. Ah well. We'll see now it does in another 6 months when I change the oil again.

I wonder if injector cleaner, such as the product from Redline, would affect the results significantly...

Idrinkmotoroil · Dec 2, 2004

I think think this is a good showing for Redline, better numbers all around. I personally dont see a problem with the copper number, considering you've gone 50% further it is normal that copper could increase, and I dont find 8ppms disturbing at all. If you break it down on a ppm/1000 mile level I think you will find it to be reasonable compared to the M1 sample. Plus the lead numbers are great , so I dont see a problem in terms of bearing issues. I think Redline is working excellent on this engine.

Like mentioned above, some of the silicon is from Redline but your levels are still on the high side.

Baveux · Dec 3, 2004

1.5 quarts of oil added within 7500 miles ? even with that the visc.number increased...

Thats a lots of oil added and its enough to screw up the UOA

Idrinkmotoroil · Dec 3, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Baveux:
1.5 quarts of oil added within 7500 miles ? even with that the visc.number increased...

Thats a lots of oil added and its enough to screw up the UOA

that consumption isnt really out of the ordinary, all my past Hondas would have used almost a quart in 3000 mile OCI's and they ran very well. Most manufacturers dont consider consumption excessive until you use 1 quart per 1000 miles, so this engine is well within acceptable levels. It does add a bit of fresh oil to the batch but not much you can do about it.

CelicaGT6 · Dec 7, 2004

quote:

Originally posted by Baveux:
1.5 quarts of oil added within 7500 miles ? even with that the visc.number increased...

Thats a lots of oil added and its enough to screw up the UOA

That's not too bad at all. That's roughly 1/2 a qt per oil standard 3000 mile OCI.

I think the engine burns a bit of oil when driven hard, like on a track, and this OCI did have two events on it.

I'm going to try to monitor the mileage and oil added more closely on this interval. I think the engine has a leak in one of the oil pan seals since one side of the block is grimy compared to the other side.

buster · Jul 10, 2005

This relates to pscholte's thread on metallurgy. RL does do well in Japanese/German cars.

RL 5W30 vs M1 5W30 vs 1997 Toyota 1MZ-FE

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