Report: Toyota Repairs No Fix for Problems

[labman]

Originally Posted By: gofastman
Originally Posted By: John_K
Originally Posted By: ARB1977
Im saying again the only fix will be to go back to the original throttle body design and get rid of that [censored] drive my wire.


Exactly. Does EVERYTHING on a car have to be run by a computer?

John

It makes it easier to implement stability control, which is going to be mandated in 2011


What a stupid idea, completely unneeded in a FWD.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: SuperBusa
EVERY DBW car needs to have a brake/gas pedal interlock.

I would say every car with any form of automatic transmission needs DBW and a throttle override in the brake pedal. Manual transmissions have two built-in failsafes: clutch pedals and more aware drivers.

 

[labman]

Then how can people drive with one foot on the gas and the other on the brake?

 

[cchase]

Originally Posted By: labman
Then how can people drive with one foot on the gas and the other on the brake?


One of my "favorite" driver-types. Nothing like being behind some dope with the brake light on non-stop or just about non-stop.

My father had a co-worker with a recalled Camry. He just got it back last week and apparently it has started accelerating on its own 3 times since then. Prior to being recalled he had not had an issue with it. This will certainly be interesting once all the dust has settled.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: labman
Then how can people drive with one foot on the gas and the other on the brake?

Exactly.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
Originally Posted By: labman
Then how can people drive with one foot on the gas and the other on the brake?

Exactly.

I know a lot of people who drive that way, they use their left foot for the brake and right foot for the gas. Actually it is pretty annoying, and not a very safe, or smart way to drive, but it's done.

From what I've been reading about the Toyota issue, it seems some of the cars being returned after the "fix" are now worse. Not good.

 

[cchase]

None of the other makes have been having issues with DBW. Why can't Toyota (at this point) just look at what others are doing and try to figure something out? It sounds like at this point they're doing blind engineering.

At this point, it reminds me of when you have a personal vehicle problem, and you just start throwing parts at the problem hoping it goes away instead of diagnosing it.

 

[Norse]

Originally Posted By: cchase
Why can't Toyota (at this point) just look at what others are doing and try to figure something out? It sounds like at this point they're doing blind engineering.

Why? Because their Ego is colossal!

 

[Nick R]

Supposedly, according to CNN at least it looks like the "recalled" vehicles that have been supposedly "fixed" are accelerating even more than before they were "fixed". Toyota really screwed this whole thing over.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: labman
Originally Posted By: gofastman
It makes it easier to implement stability control, which is going to be mandated in 2011


What a stupid idea, completely unneeded in a FWD.

It definitely should be unnecessary. But it's the old vicious cycle: every time someone builds a better failsafe, someone else builds a bigger idiot...

I'd bet good money (although there's really no way to know) that if driver training and public transit were more effective in this country as a whole, a lot of what we now see as "safety concerns" would never be significant.

 

[d00df00d]

Originally Posted By: rudolphna
Supposedly, according to CNN at least it looks like the "recalled" vehicles that have been supposedly "fixed" are accelerating even more than before they were "fixed". Toyota really screwed this whole thing over.

Last I read about this, there were a grand total of 7 reports of unintended acceleration on fixed cars, and none of them had been confirmed by the NHTSA. Have you heard differently?

 

[LS2JSTS]

I've seen reports of between ten and fifteen new reports to NHTSA.....

http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/RunawayToy...ory?id=10004076


Sounds like they are currently under review.....


http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSTRE62304R20100304

 

[labman]

Not the first time a ''cure'' made things worse.

 

[d00df00d]

Nothing has gotten worse yet. Until these cases have been reviewed, they add up to no evidence at all.

That goes double since the hysteria over this issue is very likely causing people to blame stuff on unintended acceleration that really has nothing to do with it. We need to be EXTREMELY cautious and skeptical when we look at this stuff.

 

[daves87rs]

Originally Posted By: d00df00d
It definitely should be unnecessary. But it's the old vicious cycle: every time someone builds a better failsafe, someone else builds a bigger idiot...

I'd bet good money (although there's really no way to know) that if driver training and public transit were more effective in this country as a whole, a lot of what we now see as "safety concerns" would never be significant.

Amen!

People forget that driving is not a right.

At this point, I think it should cost more to own a car. Starting with driver test s every 5 years, and a points sysyem that will make it easier to lose your DL....

 

[LS2JSTS]

It's up to 60 cases of no evidence at all.....

http://www.freep.com/article/20100304/BU...ints-NHTSA-says

What in the heck goes on over at NHTSA?????!!!!! These idiots sound like a dog being wagged by it's tail, they dont seem to have anybody capable of delving into these high tech issues. Just a bunch of friends and family riding the public tax coat tails!

 

[d00df00d]

Well said. 60 cases of no evidence at all. Exactly right.

At this point, they're just complaints. Once the NHTSA investigates, then maybe we can start drawing conclusions.

A complaint is evidence of nothing but an unhappy person. 60 complaints = 60 unhappy people.

I'm NOT saying there definitely is no problem. Just saying we shouldn't flip out quite yet. The correct position is "post-recall-UA agnosticism," if you know what I mean.

It's entirely possible that all of those 60 cases are just the result of some kind of hysteria. I'm sure you'd agree it wouldn't be the first time many people have had the same hallucination. Let's wait till the jury is in, yes?

 

[LS2JSTS]

What on Earth will they be able to investigate when the main culprit is actively commiting fraud and covering up and even destroying evidence? If there is really no evidence at all, what on Earth is Toyota working so hard to cover up?......

https://bobistheoilguy.com/forums/posts/1804210/

But I do agree that we should be suspicious of many claims going forward. I've said that in the past on these forums, a lot of people know how to take advantage of situations such as this, and they will.

 

[d00df00d]

I don't know what you mean in the first part of your post. They received complaints of unintended acceleration on cars that had had recall work done; presumably that is one of the things they will be investigating.

The whole fraud-and-cover-ups thing is not really their domain. They deal in facts (or, more precisely, the pursuit thereof).

 

[jsharp]

Something else to add -

http://www.consumeraffairs.com/news04/2010/03/toyota_problems_continue.html

Tip of the iceberg?

Is it possible that, not only have investigators not found the source of the problem, but the Toyota recall is just the tip of a safety iceberg. Consider this.

In December an analysis of NHTSA's complaint database showed that, of all the reports of sudden acceleration, 40 percent involved Toyota of Lexus models. While that's a lot, it means that 60 percent of the sudden acceleration complaints were about cars made by manufacturers other than Toyota.


I don't know about anyone else, but my mass hysteria meter pegged a while back on this problem. Maybe because I'm old enough to remember the "possessed Audi" problem that started out with women putting their feet on the gas instead of the brake...