Recommended value for money all season tires for 225/65/R17

[Risingphoenix339]

That tire has a UTQG of 800, which means it's a very hard tire. I would never buy a tire with such a high UTGQ. The tread depth is not listed. Canada tire says it's also m+s rated, and then says this: "The M+S symbol differentiates an All-Season tire from a Summer only tire. While rated for light snow, they will not match a winter tire for traction or stopping distance on snow and ice." Are they correct, that M+S is not also equivalent to a snow tire? I wouldn't buy an M+S rated tire for use as a spring/summer/fall tire.

So higher UTQG falls in cons for tires? As per this UTQG guide higher tread wear is better only when the vehicle is in frequent else it doesn’t matter. For me I will be driving the vehicle for 7k-12k a year. Mostly city bypass driving, so less of stop and go.

I anyways have a separate set for winter, which is still in good shape. So currently I need an all season set which I will switch to winter tires once the road temperature drops below 7 C

 

[Risingphoenix339]

Funny there are three pages of comments and one (one!) person (stormgol) who actually mentioned and provided UTQG data. This data should be one of the first things referenced...especially when the OP is seeking a value quotient. Most of the inputs here are subjective. That's fine as secondary data; however, nobody's posted the numbers!

Someone mentioned Douglas radials from Wal-Mart. I've used these a lot as value tires. For the OP's required size, here's the data:

UTQG 500AB, H-speed rated, 102 tire load index, 50K mile warranty, $84.00USD each

Lately I've purchased two sets of Armstrong tires, also available through Wal-Mart. Here are the specs for the same size (Tru-Trac HT):

UTQG 740AA, H-speed rated, 102 tire load index, 65K mile warranty, $79.91 USD.

Which likely provides better value?

Use the available data to help make the best decision.

UTQG for Scorpion as plus 3 is 800AA as per the different tire sites. I have also mentioned my usage in the reply above. What would be your choice in similar driving conditions?

 

[Rmay635703]

I put a set of these on my wife's CRV and have been happy with them:

https://www.walmart.com/ip/Goodyear...-Tire/158600281?athbdg=L1103&adsRedirect=true

Walmart had those for $49 in my size at the Black Friday sale

 

[SumGuy]

Canada tire's price for that Scorpion tire is $195, that's a lot for a tire with such a high UTGQ. I tend to equate high UTQG tires as budget or economy tires more than performance tires. In my opinion they're more suited for a more temperate and drier climate than Ontario / Toronto. They're a commuter tire for sure with that milage rating, but they're not going to be sticky and that gets worse when it gets cold or wet.

I don't see how they can be m+s rated with the tread they have. They're somewhat heavy, at 32 lbs if Canada tire's specs are right.

 

[Capt W]

That tire has a UTQG of 800, which means it's a very hard tire.

Not how it works. UTQG is comprised of three data bits - treadwear, traction, and temperature resistance. The numerical value represents the treadwear rating as compared to a generic baseline index of 100. The higher the number, the longer the treadwear (in theory). Tread depth will vary based on the compound(s) used. Tires can achieve high treadwear ratings based on compound, tread depth, or a combination thereof.

A tire's "hardness" is typically due to its compound -- and aspect ratio as shorter sidewalls are necessarily stiffer. Has nothing to do with its UTQG. In fact, you will find that true performance tires have some of the hardest compounds out there - with the lowest treadwear ratings.

The second part of the rating is wet traction and is rated best-to-worst as AA, A, B, or C

The third part is temperature resistance at high speed, measured as A, B, or C

The Armstrong tires I mentioned earlier are rated 740AA, which translates to good treadwear, good traction, and excellent temperature resistance.

UTQG is not a be-all, end-all piece of information, but it's still very important -- especially as a tool for comparison between tires. And most people have no idea what the numbers mean or how to use them to make a buying decision.


The Pirelli Scorpion Plus 3 in the OP's size is an 800AA tire, which are indeed excellent ratings:

Here's where the value proposition comes in. At $182.26 USD each, are they really worth over $100 more each than the 740AA Armstrong?? Their 70K-mile warranty barely eclipses the Armstrong's 65K-mile warranty, and other data is almost exactly the same (the Armstrong's tread depth is 1/32-inch more).

The OP wanted value suggestions, not advice on how to needlessly empty a bank account.

 

[Sequoiasoon]

So higher UTQG falls in cons for tires? As per this UTQG guide higher tread wear is better only when the vehicle is in frequent else it doesn’t matter. For me I will be driving the vehicle for 7k-12k a year. Mostly city bypass driving, so less of stop and go.

I anyways have a separate set for winter, which is still in good shape. So currently I need an all season set which I will switch to winter tires once the road temperature drops below 7 C

How old and how much tread left on the winter tires? Mine I always found I get about 5-6 winters out of them and then between rubber getting harder and tread depth at about 6/32" definitely decreased performance.

The Pirelli AS3 is a good all around choice. I have previous version on 2 vehicles and would not hesitate to get the AS3 depending sales/promo's. November Continental often has a double rebate thing if you use their credit card. I opened one last year just for that to get my son some Conti TrueContact Tour (all season). The rebate was $220. I actually bought/installed them at my local dealer using the card which made it cheaper than buying from on-line and then paying for install.

If that is the potential case then the Conti CrossContact LX25 (not sport or other versions) would be a solid choice also.

My kids are on Conti VikingContact 7 for winter. They were a solid test product and recommended. With the sales and rebates they had going I was able to get 4 my daughters CRV with new TPMS sensors installed cheaper than Micheline X-ice Snow from Costco even with their sales/promos. Wife is on Conti WinterContact Si but will probably last winter on them as they are at 6-7/32" and will be the 6th winter. If traction issues may get replaced during the winter. She runs Michelin Defender LTX M/S currently for 3 season and still have like 9-10/32" at 5 years old.

 

[Capt W]

Canada tire's price for that Scorpion tire is $195, that's a lot for a tire with such a high UTGQ. I tend to equate high UTQG tires as budget or economy tires more than performance tires.

Does Canada have its own UTQG scale? The one we use was developed by our NHTSA. If you're referencing our system you clearly have some reading to do.

 

[factorytuned2012]

You’ll be much happier with an H/T tire if majority of your driving is on paved roadways

 

[IndyIan]

Does Canada have its own UTQG scale? The one we use was developed by our NHTSA. If you're referencing our system you clearly have some reading to do.

We use the same UTGQ.
If you search Michelin tires sorted by treadwear for this size, the longest lasting one is the worst tire for dry and wet pavement performance. The Defender2 is a fine tire, but the ones with lower treadwear ratings will easily out grip it.
I don't know what the highest treadwear tire is, that has a AA traction rating, but I doubt its over 400. AA traction summer tires in my experience, are much much better than A traction all seasons in the wet and dry, and the only B traction rated tire (uniroyal tigerpaw) I've had was a joke for wet grip.

 

[Risingphoenix339]

I checked the tire tread life on my suv all seasons (Goodyear assurance fuel max cs) 90% of the treads are 6/32”. So I guess I have time until they go down to 3/32”. 2/32” is the provincial limit when the insurance gets voided But I think I should change it when it goes down to 4/32”. I also checked my sedan all seasons and they are 7/32”. They are Hankook Kinergy GT.

 

[jsean]

About the price, I’m not sure where you’re at but there’s a company called Quattro tires, their website usually has one of the best deals and FS destination LE3 Is 50$ expensive than Pirelli scorpion as plus 3. Check it out if you ever need in future.

Thanks for the heads up. I’ve always used Tire Rack’s testing data and the consumers’ ratings for relating rankings between the tire choices I pick. You’ll be happy with the Pirelli - they’re even better rated than the Firestone LE3s.

 

[Risingphoenix339]

Not how it works. UTQG is comprised of three data bits - treadwear, traction, and temperature resistance. The numerical value represents the treadwear rating as compared to a generic baseline index of 100. The higher the number, the longer the treadwear (in theory). Tread depth will vary based on the compound(s) used. Tires can achieve high treadwear ratings based on compound, tread depth, or a combination thereof.

A tire's "hardness" is typically due to its compound -- and aspect ratio as shorter sidewalls are necessarily stiffer. Has nothing to do with its UTQG. In fact, you will find that true performance tires have some of the hardest compounds out there - with the lowest treadwear ratings.

The second part of the rating is wet traction and is rated best-to-worst as AA, A, B, or C

View attachment 246167

The third part is temperature resistance at high speed, measured as A, B, or C

View attachment 246168

The Armstrong tires I mentioned earlier are rated 740AA, which translates to good treadwear, good traction, and excellent temperature resistance.

UTQG is not a be-all, end-all piece of information, but it's still very important -- especially as a tool for comparison between tires. And most people have no idea what the numbers mean or how to use them to make a buying decision.


The Pirelli Scorpion Plus 3 in the OP's size is an 800AA tire, which are indeed excellent ratings:

View attachment 246169

Here's where the value proposition comes in. At $182.26 USD each, are they really worth over $100 more each than the 740AA Armstrong?? Their 70K-mile warranty barely eclipses the Armstrong's 65K-mile warranty, and other data is almost exactly the same (the Armstrong's tread depth is 1/32-inch more).

The OP wanted value suggestions, not advice on how to needlessly empty a bank account.

Armstrong? Is that the brand or model? Please provide more info. I’ll keep that in mind.

 

[edyvw]

Funny there are three pages of comments and one (one!) person (stormgol) who actually mentioned and provided UTQG data. This data should be one of the first things referenced...especially when the OP is seeking a value quotient. Most of the inputs here are subjective. That's fine as secondary data; however, nobody's posted the numbers!

Someone mentioned Douglas radials from Wal-Mart. I've used these a lot as value tires. For the OP's required size, here's the data:

UTQG 500AB, H-speed rated, 102 tire load index, 50K mile warranty, $84.00USD each

Lately I've purchased two sets of Armstrong tires, also available through Wal-Mart. Here are the specs for the same size (Tru-Trac HT):

UTQG 740AA, H-speed rated, 102 tire load index, 65K mile warranty, $79.91 USD.

Which likely provides better value?

Use the available data to help make the best decision.

We just posted in another thread CR test of various tires and they are all over the place with longevity. As that test showed, many companies don’t even come close to UTQG they claim. Only company that meets it is Michelin.

 

[Risingphoenix339]

We just posted in another thread CR test of various tires and they are all over the place with longevity. As that test showed, many companies don’t even come close to UTQG they claim. Only company that meets it is Michelin.

Please provide a link to it. Thanks

I think I got it Ratings. Will go through it.

 

[D1dad]

I’ve had a few sets of this size on our 18 rogue. I installed a set of continental lx25 this last spring for around $600 out the door that replaced a set of cross climate 2s and couldn’t be happier. A great tire all around and $400 less than the Michelins.

 

[camrydriver111]

These are some pics of my all seasons. Please advise what do you think about its state and whether it needs replacing.

View attachment 244002

View attachment 244003

View attachment 244004

If you're driving in the GTA, combined with the age, I would replace.

I would wait until next year though because you will be installling winters soon.

Most reputable tires have a satisfaction guarantee. I would like to test the tires after buying rather than putting them away in a few weeks. In the unlikely event you have any issues, like the balancing being slightly off, you could get them taken care of right away.

I am also in the GTA and putting on my winters next weekend. I could wait longer but I DIY so I'd like to do it while it still relatively warm.

In the GTA I would run a top brand, or at the very least a good mid-tier brand of tire. I would not buy a private label tire made by an unknown manufacturer.

There are many times where I had to brake from 100 km/h to full stop on GTA highways.

 

[D1dad]

I’ve had 500aa tires last as long or longer than a 700aa tire. Alignment, rotation and reputable brands sure do help. Anytime I’ve used Bridgestone they’ve worn out pretty fast, but this set I’ve got on my car currently are wearing like iron.