Rant on Centric Premium Rotors the 120-series

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Originally Posted By: Artem
I always pay a bit extra for higher quality parts, so this type of thing would never happen to me. I use Brembo Blank Rotors and Hawk HPS (High Performance Stree) pads on all my cars. Flawless operation for years on end and a few of my cars get beat on pretty bad on a daily basis.


I used to use Brembo blanks, but seeing that some of the applications are now being cast in China [nothing against China rotors] and over the past few years, I'm finding better prices on Raybestos which are also being cast in China. I also like the idea of the painted hat/vanes on the Raybestos AT. Given the same price and application and local availability, I'd choose Raybestos AT/Napa ultra-prem, Brembo, Centric, O'Reillys BrakeBest [these appear to have the same casting/machining marks as Raybestos rotors]. I've noticed that Brembo doesn't always make rotors for certain applications. Props for Brembo however, one time I ordered a set of rotors for my bro's track civic, and upon arrival, there was a wire clip on the inside of one of the vanes. I called their support, and they actually connected me to one of the engineers who explained that the clip is for balancing. That was over 8 years ago, so it may have been when they didn't necessarily mill-balance certain applications.

When I had a 94 civic, I have used HPS, however, didn't care for the bite and sometimes the backing plates didn't look sharply stamped/cut, always fit well though. That's when I started running HP+, good bite, stops well, not too much noise for me, but the brake dust from the HP+ is horrible. I then used Bendix CT-3 on the Civic and loved them. Good compromise of bite, little to no dust, and silent. I no longer drive like a bat out of 'ell so my brakes tend to last longer. When I put CT-3 on my current Mazda6, got the same impression. And I find that often the CT-3 are less expensive than HPS.
 
I, too, believe Raybestos' AT line of rotors are the best value out there. Not the cheapest for sure, but the best value. I put new front rotors on our Acura shortly after I got it. They were from Pep Boys, but had the anti-corrosion coating on them (which has worked) and they appeared to be a premium rotor. I've now had to turn these a few times to get rid of glazing, and have now switched to Akebono ceramic pads. If the rotors glaze again this summer, I'm replacing the rotors. The question of quality on these rotors is always in the back of my mind.
 
Most of the automotive items I have received from Amazon are rather new stock. Sometimes I purposely wait for a part to go 'will ship in 2-3 weeks' etc as this usually means they have stuff coming in. I ordered Ct-3 pads for my friends Corolla last year about August, and they're date stamped April '12. One thing is for sure, if I get old stock [say the newest part revision come with hardware or whatnot], it's easy enough to get RMA through Amazon, just have to wait. With rotors, however, I am going to think twice about ordering them online for fear of being dinged etc from shipping, but the prices, especially for front rotors [and free prime shipping for me since I'm a member] makes it really hard to justify shop locally, sometimes there are $30+ differences per rotor; maybe I can get my local Napa to bring the prices down some...I don't expect them to match or beat the prices as I'm sure Amazon's margins are different than Napa, but paying $85/front ea versus $48 on Amazon...In general, I always cross compare my local O'Reilly, Napa, Autozone to Amazon and Rockauto before buying parts. While I like the instant satisfaction of having the part now and getting them locally, something about getting weekly boxes from UPS is like Christmas all year for me
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Originally Posted By: The Critic
Originally Posted By: stephen9666

I'm not sure it's fair to say " Usually Amazon's auto parts are extremely old stock." How many times have you received "old stock"? I remember reading your thread about the old pads, but have you had other issues?

I've ordered auto parts from Amazon multiple times and never received old stock. My CT-3 pads were even date coded. When I received them they were 8 months old.


I recently ordered some ACDelco Durastop rotors for a Kia Sedona and they were also a couple years old.

Old stock is not always a bad thing, but it does increase the chances of the item being moved, banged around, etc...and this can be an issue for rotors.
 
Just an update: The brakes were starting to squeak a bit upon light brake pressure, I attributed it to the cheap hardware wearing out that came with the Bendix CT-3 pads. I purchased on rockauto and replaced with Carlson brand with the rubberized coating and squeaks are gone. The Raybestos advanced rotors are still doing fine and overall the brakes are doing very well. When I was taking each corner apart, none of the hardware looked too worn or whatnot, but if new hardware fixed it then I'll gladly pay the $15 for front and rear hardware and an hour's worth of time versus new Akebono pads or using goop on the back of the shims.
 
glad to hear folks seem to like the raybestos AT rotors. I'm doing our MDX and ordered raybestos--- the pricier ones with the machined "slots". They were more $ but not much more when considering labor costs saved. I'll report in when done...
 
Man, there's alot to read in this thread so, I didn't read every word and just skimmed though most of it!

I've been a little dissatisfied with Centric Premium Rotors(Black E-Coating) and their Posi-Quiet Ceramic Pads.

I am finding that the rotors are either warpping soon(just past their 90 day warranty) or within a year, or getting lots of pad deposits causing brake pulsation.

And, I am also dissatisfied with their Posi-Quiet Ceramic Pads for the large amounts of BLACK Dust on my wheels(2 out of 3 vehicles) compared to other ceramic pads that I've used. BUT, after reading through Centric's website, of all of the benefits mentioned in the site, there is no mention about the Posi-Quiet Ceramic being "Low Dusting". I should have figured this out long ago!

The quiet braking is OK as with other ceramic pads that I've used so, I have no complaint there. Only complaining about what I mentioned above!

I may switch and experiment with other ceramic pads as I really do like ceramic pads for many reasons(no noise, smooth braking, low dust, lack of issues) that I dislike in other friction materials.

I realize that the term "Ceramic" is a gray area in the braking industry but, I really like the caramic pads that I've purchaced thus far(at least 6 different brands). Yes, even Centric! - I'll just be moving away from their product for now and placing Centric lower or not at all, on my recomemded list
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Originally Posted By: meep
glad to hear folks seem to like the raybestos AT rotors. I'm doing our MDX and ordered raybestos--- the pricier ones with the machined "slots". They were more $ but not much more when considering labor costs saved. I'll report in when done...


Why machined slots?
 
Brake rotors are a carp shoot. I have had cheap rotors last 120k and expensive ones have all kinds of judder and OEM factory ones last 200k while others are toast at 70k.

I think it is the quality of the metal they cast that day. In China they have a real difficult time getting repeatable quality in any metals industries. Steel or aluminum doesn't matter. Lots of variance. That is why you get some good some bad.
 
Ive heard nothing but good things bout Akebono's. Installing a set on the Corolla this wkend. I hate the jobber pads i put on.
 
Originally Posted By: Rolla07
Ive heard nothing but good things bout Akebono's. Installing a set on the Corolla this wkend. I hate the jobber pads i put on.

What rotors are you running?
 
I'm getting ready to order front brakes for the wife's G6. I don't know if it's the car or the driver but this thing eats rotors. I have not been happy with the economy stuff that I have ordered, other than the price. I ordered mid-line stuff from RockAuto, Wagner rotors & ThermoQuiet pads and they seemed to be not too bad. I haven't looked in a while but they weren't grooving like the cheap stuff on there before and on the G5 now.

So this time I'm going to take another step up and see if the front rotors will stay smooth for a while. I have seriously wanted to try Centric rotors and pads or maybe StopTech pads but after reading this I'm not sure.

Anyone have any experience with Centric's High-Carbon (125) line?
Right now I'm down to Centric (125), Durastop or Raybestos AT with Akebono, Durastop, Posi-Quiet or StopTech. I have been leaning more towards the Akebonos now that they have them for my cars on RA.
 
pads are like ice cream, over a million flavors. What works on one platform is likely not applicable to yours.

Even the "same" pads your buddy used on his car may not be the same formula for yours. So it's hard to give blanket recommendations.

Note also that many here have mistaken a PAD problem for a ROTOR problem...
 
Right, which is why I'm going with only a premium pad. Pretty much sold on the Akebonos as they seem to have the least percentage of unfavorable comments across the web, that I have found anyway.

But would the Centric 125s be worth the +$20 over the 120s or just go with the Raybestos ATs which are maybe +$5 from the 125s? Centric has had lots of good reviews too, some here as well. Maybe ChrisW is just having a bad run with them? I don't know.
 
Originally Posted By: Char Baby
Originally Posted By: Rolla07
Ive heard nothing but good things bout Akebono's. Installing a set on the Corolla this wkend. I hate the jobber pads i put on.

What rotors are you running?


Right now I have jobber pads and rotors. I have some cheap drilled and slotted rotors lying around that im going to change to. Might get some better quality rotors to go with the pads. Havent decided yet.
 
Originally Posted By: cp3
Right, which is why I'm going with only a premium pad. Pretty much sold on the Akebonos as they seem to have the least percentage of unfavorable comments across the web, that I have found anyway.

But would the Centric 125s be worth the +$20 over the 120s or just go with the Raybestos ATs which are maybe +$5 from the 125s? Centric has had lots of good reviews too, some here as well. Maybe ChrisW is just having a bad run with them? I don't know.


I do several brake jobs every year on our fleet. I also have a machine shop in the family with two generations actively working in it.

IMO, iron is iron. If the rotor is made correctly it will perform the same whether or not it is labeled "premium". The long term performance will have much more to do with the pad and the driver than the metallurgy.

The only reason to buy a "premium" rotor is for finishes and venting, these can be cheap on the lesser models. Just compare them to OEM before purchase or call my buddies at R1 concepts...
 
centric rotor reviews are all over the place. also looks like it may be related to power stop, or vice versa. i've also read where there are "fake" centric products being sold under the same name. I thought centric was highly regarded-- which would then extend to power stop-- but if counterfeit products are a problem, how would you know what you've gotten is real?

Plus there's the problem with reviews.... any review this side of 15,000 may be premature anyway wrt warping. Plus there's the question of whether or not the reviewer knew what they were doing...

Which is why I chose the raybestos AT-300s. Yes they were more coin--- but it's all a carp shoot.... it will be hard for any DIY to warranty parts like rotors--- so I wanted the product with least % of poor reviews. They are a longer-established name, if nothing else...

The price, and at least the older reputation, of centric/power stop looks good... but for my effort--- it's worth a few for dollars.
 
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you are always spot-on with your comments IMO.

All of the iron gets cast in china now... machining done here. I "hoped" that the bigger names stay with higher QC standards at whatever foundry they use, but who knows. Poorer iron will warp sooner. Less iron will warp sooner.

completely agreed on trim lines within a given manuf.

Steve, in your experience at the tracks, have you ever noticed a difference with the slotted/drilled offerings?

I avoid drilled -- best friend use to autoX and drilled rotors would crack under hard use-- but provided better cooling.

This is my first go with anything above standard--- slotted rotors... and they do seem to have more in reserve as you dig hard in for an aggressive stop. But i can't tell for certain since the pads are also new (though less aggressive than what came off). what's your take?
 
IME the drilled ones are problematic, best used on cars with hugely oversized brakes already. I have observed both an improvement in wet weather braking and a lot of noise IME.

Slotteds are actually factory on my car. They are being used for a specific issue, the factory pads are very high performance and if they don't get hot enough they score up the rotors pretty bad. I don't see slotting as much of a performance advantage, just a way to address pad issues.

Tons of variables here, some cars have a lot of brakes for their weight and most seem to have just what they need and no extra reserve at all. So the solutions are different...
 
interesting... i didn't realize the finer differences in between. Also feel good about my choice-- I definitely did not need drilled for her car.

I do think some of what I'm feeling after road testing the wife's MDX is the slotted venting.... that is, brake pedal-to-results is usually pretty linear, until I hit a certain amount of pedal force where things sort of start to load up. I get the same sensation in the truck when towing. There's a certain point where, once you reach it, more force really doesn't seem to equate to more braking... like you've hit the wall.

With these rotors (or pad/rotor combination, to be fair)... there seems to be much more headroom. It feels like the vehicle could quite easily stand up on its front legs, in a nicely modulated/controlled manner.

This brake hardware appears to be shared with the accord of that same generation--- they are average sized rotors and smaller pads-- likely just adequate for what it needs to do, so there's room to improve.

I'm pretty convinced that it will be a wise move on the truck wrt towing. in that case though, heat dissipation could suggest drilled, though with its gearing the engine braking is very effective. lots of variables, as you said...
 
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