Phaeton engine cuts out going uphill

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Dad's 2006 Phaeton W12 with 6-speed Tiptronic has developed a malfunction the dealer is unable to track down. Going uphill, usually while coasting letting off the gas, the engine will cut out for 1 or two seconds before catching and running normally. No indicator lights come on that indicate the engine has died. This leads me to believe that this event is due to a complete disruption in electrical power. This happens about once or twice a month, often in exactly the same spot when exiting a freeway via an uphill off-ramp. He says the engine once did not catch and the car came to a halt. He could just start it up without any problems and drive off. The dealer found no fault codes and, after close inspection, is stumped. I am suspecting the ignition switch. Other possibilities I am considering include the fuel pump, the ECM, or maybe a problem with the starter disabler/alarm system. I have driven his car a few times since and the engine cut out once for a second or so as he had described in the usual location under the same driving conditions. Dad loves his Phaeton, which has only 55k miles on it, and he'd like to hang on to it. Has anybody here experienced an engine cutting out while coasting or while letting off the gas going uphill?
 
I would assume the throttle is fly by wire and look at the position sensor or throttle butterfly actuator as a WAG.
 
Check for torn or cracked air intake boots on the throttle body, both sides. I had those same symptoms om a different car, and finally discovered this was the problem. The MAF sensor reads the air, but if there is a leak after the MAF it ruins the MAF output data and the computer sees the mixture wrong. The boots are 12 years old and the ribs crack with age or being bent from servicing.
 
I did check for air leaks very carefully and did not find any between MAF and throttle body. The thing that got me stumped is that the problem occurs only when going uphill. No vacuum leaks: vacuum is 22 Hg at idle.
 
According to Identafix this car needs a throttle body relearn...Whatever that means. The car also has 3 throttle position sensors and if any one of them gives a weird reading strange things can happen.
 
I suspect that it's chassis dynamics. Up hill and coasting means no load on teh engine, so no torque effect. Something is rocking back, or a chassis position sensor is loose/swinging, something like that.

The first thing I'd do is check all the ground cables. If any look suspect, make a new one with bigger wire with crimped and soldered lugs.

Once you are sure it's not a floating voltage, look at other things like the crash/inertial switch. It can send a signal to the ECU to kill the fuel pumps and the ignition ... Or it might be an intermitant open in the signal wire between the inertia switch and the ECU. Something like that ...
 
VCDS needs to be on and running while driving. Monitor addresses 01, 02, 11, 05, 16, and 17. Those are ECU, TCU, ECU2, start, steering, and instrument cluster. Address 71 is the battery management module and it may be a good idea to look at that one as well.

An error will surely show in one while the fault occurs. Unfortunately this is the long and tedious step after a complete visual inspection for loose or broken circuits.

You can try re-adapting the throttle as mentioned above; it certainly couldn't hurt.
 
My friend has 3.0TDi version...dunno if that applies to your model...but his car has additional 9V battery inside the cabin...to support all that electronic devices when you shut down the engine...and when this battery goes bad (voltage goes below certain level) car evolves array of strange electric problems wich are untracable via VCDS

Just my .50 EU cents
smile.gif
 
Originally Posted by Kamele0N
My friend has 3.0TDi version...dunno if that applies to your model...but his car has additional 9V battery inside the cabin...to support all that electronic devices when you shut down the engine...and when this battery goes bad (voltage goes below certain level) car evolves array of strange electric problems wich are untracable via VCDS

Just my .50 EU cents
smile.gif


No Phaeton, to my knowledge, has more than two batteries.

Both are located in the trunk. The RH battery in gas models is a conventional lead-acid and the LH battery is an AGM - this is the VPS. ( Vehicle Power Supply)

His being a V10 TDI he should have two identical group 49 AGM batteries installed.

Some early V6 cars only had one battery on the LH side.
 
Probably the other one. A VPS at 9V is a bad time.

You'd probably have to bridge the batteries just to get enough modules on to start the car properly.

Fun fact - turning the key all the way CW, then full CCW, then back CW bridges the batteries. If your VPS is alive you don't need jumper cables to start the Phaeton, and if your VPS is dead or dying you can still drive the car.
 
Replacing the engine speed sender, VW lingo for crankshaft position sensor, seems to have fixed it.
 
Originally Posted by vavavroom
Replacing the engine speed sender, VW lingo for crankshaft position sensor, seems to have fixed it.

Glad to hear you got it fixed.

Also glad to hear it's a long-term keeper for your Dad. It's more collectible than you may know: 2006 was the only year VW imported the upgraded 444HP BRP W12 (vs the original 414HP BAP W12). There are only about 25 in North America. Source: I have one.
smile.gif
FYI though, it's a 5-speed Tiptronic. Only the V8s got the 6-speed in the Phaeton.
 
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