Opinions on the above coolant (Peak)....good or bad. How long is it good for?
Peak Lifetime Coolant....Opinions
- Thread starter Oregoonian
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I think its just your typical AMAM coolant. I'm not sure I would use it in a Ford though.
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Are you talking global lifetime or Peak long life? Long life has 2EHA, whereas Global lifetime has none. Global Lifetime would be fine in a Ford.
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I do not understand what difference it makes as long as you use a quality coolant and don't mix them. All cars are made essentially from the same metals and plastics and have cooling systems that operate at about the same pressure and temperature. Additives to the coolant could affect how long the coolant is good for, but any quality coolant should work for the manufacturer's recommended lifetime.
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Originally Posted By: redbone3
I do not understand what difference it makes as long as you use a quality coolant and don't mix them. All cars are made essentially from the same metals and plastics and have cooling systems that operate at about the same pressure and temperature. Additives to the coolant could affect how long the coolant is good for, but any quality coolant should work for the manufacturer's recommended lifetime.
Please stop giving advice. You're one of the many reasons why the quality of this website has declined.
I do not understand what difference it makes as long as you use a quality coolant and don't mix them. All cars are made essentially from the same metals and plastics and have cooling systems that operate at about the same pressure and temperature. Additives to the coolant could affect how long the coolant is good for, but any quality coolant should work for the manufacturer's recommended lifetime.
Please stop giving advice. You're one of the many reasons why the quality of this website has declined.
Originally Posted By: KingCake
Originally Posted By: redbone3
I do not understand what difference it makes as long as you use a quality coolant and don't mix them. All cars are made essentially from the same metals and plastics and have cooling systems that operate at about the same pressure and temperature. Additives to the coolant could affect how long the coolant is good for, but any quality coolant should work for the manufacturer's recommended lifetime.
Please stop giving advice. You're one of the many reasons why the quality of this website has declined.
Yeah, if he changed it and said use any coolant that meets the manufacturer's spec, then it would have been fine. However what he said was like saying use any transmission fluid, it's an oil.
Originally Posted By: redbone3
I do not understand what difference it makes as long as you use a quality coolant and don't mix them. All cars are made essentially from the same metals and plastics and have cooling systems that operate at about the same pressure and temperature. Additives to the coolant could affect how long the coolant is good for, but any quality coolant should work for the manufacturer's recommended lifetime.
Please stop giving advice. You're one of the many reasons why the quality of this website has declined.
Yeah, if he changed it and said use any coolant that meets the manufacturer's spec, then it would have been fine. However what he said was like saying use any transmission fluid, it's an oil.
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: KingCake
Originally Posted By: redbone3
I do not understand what difference it makes as long as you use a quality coolant and don't mix them. All cars are made essentially from the same metals and plastics and have cooling systems that operate at about the same pressure and temperature. Additives to the coolant could affect how long the coolant is good for, but any quality coolant should work for the manufacturer's recommended lifetime.
Please stop giving advice. You're one of the many reasons why the quality of this website has declined.
Yeah, if he changed it and said use any coolant that meets the manufacturer's spec, then it would have been fine. However what he said was like saying use any transmission fluid, it's an oil.
Not at all the same. Ethylene Glycol, water and additives. Engine is aluminum, steel, potmetal, plastic, rubber. Runs between 180 and 195 F. Still don't think it makes a Tinker's dam unless you have some really exotic engine made out of some unusual metal, or one that runs at a temperature out of the usual range. But you are certainly welcome to your opinion.
Originally Posted By: KingCake
Originally Posted By: redbone3
I do not understand what difference it makes as long as you use a quality coolant and don't mix them. All cars are made essentially from the same metals and plastics and have cooling systems that operate at about the same pressure and temperature. Additives to the coolant could affect how long the coolant is good for, but any quality coolant should work for the manufacturer's recommended lifetime.
Please stop giving advice. You're one of the many reasons why the quality of this website has declined.
Yeah, if he changed it and said use any coolant that meets the manufacturer's spec, then it would have been fine. However what he said was like saying use any transmission fluid, it's an oil.
Not at all the same. Ethylene Glycol, water and additives. Engine is aluminum, steel, potmetal, plastic, rubber. Runs between 180 and 195 F. Still don't think it makes a Tinker's dam unless you have some really exotic engine made out of some unusual metal, or one that runs at a temperature out of the usual range. But you are certainly welcome to your opinion.
Originally Posted By: Urshurak776
Are you talking global lifetime or Peak long life? Long life has 2EHA, whereas Global lifetime has none. Global Lifetime would be fine in a Ford.
I use PGL in both my older vehicles with zero issues. I liked that it was dex cool "speced" but it does not have 2-EHA. I did a complete flush with distilled and filled it to 50/50 with PGL.
Are you talking global lifetime or Peak long life? Long life has 2EHA, whereas Global lifetime has none. Global Lifetime would be fine in a Ford.
I use PGL in both my older vehicles with zero issues. I liked that it was dex cool "speced" but it does not have 2-EHA. I did a complete flush with distilled and filled it to 50/50 with PGL.
Originally Posted By: Wolf359
Originally Posted By: KingCake
Originally Posted By: redbone3
I do not understand what difference it makes as long as you use a quality coolant and don't mix them. All cars are made essentially from the same metals and plastics and have cooling systems that operate at about the same pressure and temperature. Additives to the coolant could affect how long the coolant is good for, but any quality coolant should work for the manufacturer's recommended lifetime.
Please stop giving advice. You're one of the many reasons why the quality of this website has declined.
Yeah, if he changed it and said use any coolant that meets the manufacturer's spec, then it would have been fine. However what he said was like saying use any transmission fluid, it's an oil.
Not a fair comparison and I tend to agree with redbone3. So long as its serviced per the directions of the coolant manufacture, you'll be fine. Nothing wrong with IAT, plain ole neon green coolant.... just needs to be serviced more often.
That said, I put G-05 in everything I own... regardless of recommendations/spec. Its interesting how many types of coolant exist, considering its task is pretty basic. Seems more a push to extend service intervals, than anything else (better protection, lubrication, less toxicity, etc..).
Originally Posted By: KingCake
Originally Posted By: redbone3
I do not understand what difference it makes as long as you use a quality coolant and don't mix them. All cars are made essentially from the same metals and plastics and have cooling systems that operate at about the same pressure and temperature. Additives to the coolant could affect how long the coolant is good for, but any quality coolant should work for the manufacturer's recommended lifetime.
Please stop giving advice. You're one of the many reasons why the quality of this website has declined.
Yeah, if he changed it and said use any coolant that meets the manufacturer's spec, then it would have been fine. However what he said was like saying use any transmission fluid, it's an oil.
Not a fair comparison and I tend to agree with redbone3. So long as its serviced per the directions of the coolant manufacture, you'll be fine. Nothing wrong with IAT, plain ole neon green coolant.... just needs to be serviced more often.
That said, I put G-05 in everything I own... regardless of recommendations/spec. Its interesting how many types of coolant exist, considering its task is pretty basic. Seems more a push to extend service intervals, than anything else (better protection, lubrication, less toxicity, etc..).
Peal Global Lifetime is a Long Life OAT AF which does NOT contain 2eha as an inhibitor. The latter point makes it different than other 'universal' or All Makes Models AF which are dexclones ie., contain 2eha used in Dexcool.
Currently running it 01 Tacoma for ~3 years now after complete exchange replacing Toy Red, original radiator. Expect PGL to be good for 4-5 years normal service.
Works best with a complete exchange after distilled flush series to get full benefit on Long Life interval. Concentrate best for this, and can be found at some Napas part #0407. Some Napas will order it. A good Long Life AF, I recommend it.
Currently running it 01 Tacoma for ~3 years now after complete exchange replacing Toy Red, original radiator. Expect PGL to be good for 4-5 years normal service.
Works best with a complete exchange after distilled flush series to get full benefit on Long Life interval. Concentrate best for this, and can be found at some Napas part #0407. Some Napas will order it. A good Long Life AF, I recommend it.
Got to thinking, I really should have asked what you plan on using it for? If you're planning on using it on the 03 Focus in your signature, I'd just use G-05 that is spec. It's readily available in a concentrate(Zerex or MC Gold), relatively inexpensive and it too is a Long Life AF.
Otoh, if you're looking for one AF to use for multiple vehicles with different AF specs, PGL is a good choice imo.
Otoh, if you're looking for one AF to use for multiple vehicles with different AF specs, PGL is a good choice imo.
Originally Posted By: redbone3
I do not understand what difference it makes as long as you use a quality coolant and don't mix them. All cars are made essentially from the same metals and plastics and have cooling systems that operate at about the same pressure and temperature. Additives to the coolant could affect how long the coolant is good for, but any quality coolant should work for the manufacturer's recommended lifetime.
All engines are not engineered the same and do not contain the same materials, particularly, gasket material. Here is a SAE article that talks about the changes in engineering and materials that were made in new engines, changes that were made to existing lines, and lines that did not get changes due to being phased out. Ford did not back-spec any engines to their new 2-EHA containing coolant for these reasons.
http://articles.sae.org/8242/
Quote:
Unlike silicates and phosphates, which deplete as they go to work coating the cooling system, OAT-alone formulas have very long service life. But OATs work very slowly, perhaps taking over 5000 miles to form a protective oxide surface. So they are unable to provide the fast re-protection of cavitation-pockmarked surfaces in water pumps.
If a cooling system is prone to cavitation and the vehicle is used in the kind of load service that is conducive to it, the pockmarking increases and can corrode, affecting water pump service life. As a result, Ford has continued with the yellow S-HOAT on the older 4.6-L and 5.4-L V8s and will not change, as these engines are planned for phase-out.
Quote:
One of the organic acids, 2-EHA, is a plasticizer, softening some synthetic rubbers and plastics, particularly silicone gaskets and the Nylon 66 used for gasket carriers and radiator tanks. This was another reason for the continued use of the S-HOAT in the 4.6-L and 5.4-L V8s. All OAT-equipped engines have silicone-free gaskets and validated Nylon 66 radiator tanks.
Quote:
Systems with OAT antifreeze are more sensitive to low coolant levels, because the OAT provides best protection when in full contact with coolant passages. The issue is acute with cast-iron engine architectures, but one also exists with aluminum.
For the OAT systems, the sensors combine with improved powertrain computer algorithms for detecting overheating and deploying the limited engine performance strategy Ford has been using to prevent damage to engines if coolant level drops significantly.
Additionally, Ford upgraded cooling system seals, gaskets, and clamps, and it evaluated (reworking where necessary) the assembly line processes to ensure a full fill. Further, the antifreeze is mixed 50-50 with de-ionized water for consistent new vehicle protection across all product lines.
Filling a car with a 2-EHA containing coolant without knowing if the design and materials are validated for it is a fools errand.
Ed
I do not understand what difference it makes as long as you use a quality coolant and don't mix them. All cars are made essentially from the same metals and plastics and have cooling systems that operate at about the same pressure and temperature. Additives to the coolant could affect how long the coolant is good for, but any quality coolant should work for the manufacturer's recommended lifetime.
All engines are not engineered the same and do not contain the same materials, particularly, gasket material. Here is a SAE article that talks about the changes in engineering and materials that were made in new engines, changes that were made to existing lines, and lines that did not get changes due to being phased out. Ford did not back-spec any engines to their new 2-EHA containing coolant for these reasons.
http://articles.sae.org/8242/
Quote:
Unlike silicates and phosphates, which deplete as they go to work coating the cooling system, OAT-alone formulas have very long service life. But OATs work very slowly, perhaps taking over 5000 miles to form a protective oxide surface. So they are unable to provide the fast re-protection of cavitation-pockmarked surfaces in water pumps.
If a cooling system is prone to cavitation and the vehicle is used in the kind of load service that is conducive to it, the pockmarking increases and can corrode, affecting water pump service life. As a result, Ford has continued with the yellow S-HOAT on the older 4.6-L and 5.4-L V8s and will not change, as these engines are planned for phase-out.
Quote:
One of the organic acids, 2-EHA, is a plasticizer, softening some synthetic rubbers and plastics, particularly silicone gaskets and the Nylon 66 used for gasket carriers and radiator tanks. This was another reason for the continued use of the S-HOAT in the 4.6-L and 5.4-L V8s. All OAT-equipped engines have silicone-free gaskets and validated Nylon 66 radiator tanks.
Quote:
Systems with OAT antifreeze are more sensitive to low coolant levels, because the OAT provides best protection when in full contact with coolant passages. The issue is acute with cast-iron engine architectures, but one also exists with aluminum.
For the OAT systems, the sensors combine with improved powertrain computer algorithms for detecting overheating and deploying the limited engine performance strategy Ford has been using to prevent damage to engines if coolant level drops significantly.
Additionally, Ford upgraded cooling system seals, gaskets, and clamps, and it evaluated (reworking where necessary) the assembly line processes to ensure a full fill. Further, the antifreeze is mixed 50-50 with de-ionized water for consistent new vehicle protection across all product lines.
Filling a car with a 2-EHA containing coolant without knowing if the design and materials are validated for it is a fools errand.
Ed
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Originally Posted By: redbone3
Wow! Now I am somewhat confused. Is the plasticizer in there purposely to soften gaskets, or do you have to beware you don't use it ordinary gaskets? Or, does Ford use [censored] gaskets that require an agent to keep them pliable?
That's why you use whatever the manufacturer specs. If a particular brand meets manufacturer spec, then it's ok to use it.
Wow! Now I am somewhat confused. Is the plasticizer in there purposely to soften gaskets, or do you have to beware you don't use it ordinary gaskets? Or, does Ford use [censored] gaskets that require an agent to keep them pliable?
That's why you use whatever the manufacturer specs. If a particular brand meets manufacturer spec, then it's ok to use it.
Originally Posted By: redbone3
Wow! Now I am somewhat confused. Is the plasticizer in there purposely to soften gaskets, or do you have to beware you don't use it ordinary gaskets? Or, does Ford use [censored] gaskets that require an agent to keep them pliable?
2-EHA is the primary corrosion inhibitor used in antifreeze with it in the formula. The primary use of 2-EHA in industry is as a plasticizer for PVC. It happens to work as a corrosion inhibitor and it is cheap. In their quest to save a fraction of a cent anywhere they can GM thought it was a good idea to use it in antifreeze. Did I mention it is cheap? Witness the problems they had when they first introduced Dex Cool; leaking intake manifold gaskets due to the nylon and silicone being softened and sludged up radiators when air entered the system.
Ford learned from GM's mistakes and addressed the issues of using Dex Cool, as GM has done. Why go to all the bother? It's cheap. It has nothing to do with 2-EHA being a good idea to use in antifreeze.
Ed
Wow! Now I am somewhat confused. Is the plasticizer in there purposely to soften gaskets, or do you have to beware you don't use it ordinary gaskets? Or, does Ford use [censored] gaskets that require an agent to keep them pliable?
2-EHA is the primary corrosion inhibitor used in antifreeze with it in the formula. The primary use of 2-EHA in industry is as a plasticizer for PVC. It happens to work as a corrosion inhibitor and it is cheap. In their quest to save a fraction of a cent anywhere they can GM thought it was a good idea to use it in antifreeze. Did I mention it is cheap? Witness the problems they had when they first introduced Dex Cool; leaking intake manifold gaskets due to the nylon and silicone being softened and sludged up radiators when air entered the system.
Ford learned from GM's mistakes and addressed the issues of using Dex Cool, as GM has done. Why go to all the bother? It's cheap. It has nothing to do with 2-EHA being a good idea to use in antifreeze.
Ed
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