Need help comparing these oil's datasheet

[Ilyushin]

Greetings, I'm a new writer to this forum but I've been reading you for a long time and your knowledge has allowed me to learn a lot about engine oil.

Now I'm in the procedure to choose oil for my 2 bikes that now are using Motul 7100 10w40 trouble-free and without oil burning. But I'd like to find a new oil that can be cheaper and also mantain the quality levels.

These 4 oils are "100% synthetic" as per Europeans - not Germany - regulations. All of them are 10w40 API SN JASO MA2, and albeit I have read about the benefits of the Shell Rotella T6, it isn't available here so is not an option.

So here are the datasheets with all the data the manufacturers says.

Motul 7100 for reference:
-Density 20°C (68°F) 0.859
-Viscosity 40°C (104°F) 88.8 mm²/s
-Viscosity 100°C (212°F) 13.5 mm²/s
-Viscosity index 154
-Flash point 236 ºC / 456.8ºF
-Freeze point -33°C / -27.4°F
-TBN 8.4 mg KOH/g

Oil 1:
-Density 15°C (68°F) 0.854
-Viscosity 40°C (104°F) 89 cSt
-Viscosity 100°C (212°F) 14.1 cSt
-Viscosity index 160
-Flash point 244 ºC
-Freeze point -33°C
-TBN ASTM 7.7 mg KOH/g


Oil 2:
-Density 15°C (68°F) 0.855
-Viscosity 40°C (104°F) 94.2
-Viscosity 100°C (212°F) 14.5 cSt
-Viscosity index 160
-Flash point 217 ºC
-Freeze point -36°C
-TBN ASTM 7.6 mg KOH/g


Oil 3:
-Density 15°C (68°F) 0.862
-Viscosity 100°C (212°F) 14.5 cSt
-Viscosity index 190
-Flash point 240 ºC
-Freeze point -42°C
-Ash 0.8%

What one would you choose? Thanks!

 

[CharBaby]

Well, all of the oils are right on top of one another in terms of their specs. I mean, you could bring these oils into a lab and retest them and get slightly different figures...but again, close!

Oil #3 left off the cSt at 40*C and its VI is higher. This may be a very small determining factor but any of these oils will be almost identical for the "everyday-ness". Others will chime in with more specifics about each oil or just one in particular. I'm not that advanced...sorry!

 

[BMWTurboDzl]

No 1: Very high flash point with a high but not ridicuously high VI.

(Assuming all examples used the same method to test Flash Point).

For some reason I believe this point to the quality of the base stock.

 

[LoneRanger]

Oil 3 may denote more PAO in the formula, given the broadest pour point range of the group as well as the highest viscosity index.

I choose oil oil #3.

 

[kschachn]

The quality level of the oil is dictated by the specifications the oil carries, not by guessing at the base stock composition nor by the manufacturer data sheets (which can be nominal values anyway). What specification or approval does your bike require? JASO MA2? If so, then buy the least expensive oil that has that classification since this is your stated goal.

 

[Taurus77]

Originally Posted by Ilyushin
Greetings, I'm a new writer to this forum but I've been reading you for a long time and your knowledge has allowed me to learn a lot about engine oil.

Now I'm in the procedure to choose oil for my 2 bikes that now are using Motul 7100 10w40 trouble-free and without oil burning. But I'd like to find a new oil that can be cheaper and also mantain the quality levels.

These 4 oils are "100% synthetic" as per Europeans - not Germany - regulations. All of them are 10w40 API SN JASO MA2, and albeit I have read about the benefits of the Shell Rotella T6, it isn't available here so is not an option.

So here are the datasheets with all the data the manufacturers says.

Motul 7100 for reference:
-Density 20°C (68°F) 0.859
-Viscosity 40°C (104°F) 88.8 mm²/s
-Viscosity 100°C (212°F) 13.5 mm²/s
-Viscosity index 154
-Flash point 236 ºC / 456.8ºF
-Freeze point -33°C / -27.4°F
-TBN 8.4 mg KOH/g

Oil 1:
-Density 15°C (68°F) 0.854
-Viscosity 40°C (104°F) 89 cSt
-Viscosity 100°C (212°F) 14.1 cSt
-Viscosity index 160
-Flash point 244 ºC
-Freeze point -33°C
-TBN ASTM 7.7 mg KOH/g


Oil 2:
-Density 15°C (68°F) 0.855
-Viscosity 40°C (104°F) 94.2
-Viscosity 100°C (212°F) 14.5 cSt
-Viscosity index 160
-Flash point 217 ºC
-Freeze point -36°C
-TBN ASTM 7.6 mg KOH/g


Oil 3:
-Density 15°C (68°F) 0.862
-Viscosity 100°C (212°F) 14.5 cSt
-Viscosity index 190
-Flash point 240 ºC
-Freeze point -42°C
-Ash 0.8%

What one would you choose? Thanks!


The third oil is certainly the Petronas Sprinta F900 10w40 .... most likely the viscosity index value could be wrong. I sent an email to Petronas but they never replied.

 

[Ilyushin]

Originally Posted by BMWTurboDzl
No 1: Very high flash point with a high but not ridicuously high VI.

(Assuming all examples used the same method to test Flash Point).

For some reason I believe this point to the quality of the base stock.



That one is Repsol Moto synt 4t, and it's my first option because it's datasheet seems similar to the Motul 7100 but being 10€ cheaper for 4 Liter pack, and also it's the cheapest of all these oils I'm wondering about

Originally Posted by Taurus77
The third oil is certainly the Petronas Sprinta F900 10w40 .... most likely the viscosity index value could be wrong. I sent an email to Petronas but they never replied.


Correct, oil nº 3 is Petronas Sprinta F900, it's values are very different to the other ones and I'm not sure what to think about it, because it's also pretty cheap

 

[BusyLittleShop]

Any of your oil choices will meet and exceed your mileage expectations...

The more you research oil the more you realize all of the major brands
will meet or exceed your mile expectations... there is not one brand
or grade in the 300,000 mileage club... there are 30 40 50 grade
oils... there are synthetic and mineral oils... in the real world the
majority of owners grow tired of their bike and sell before realizing
their mileage expectations...

 

[Bonz]

Illyushin, once you hang out here long enough you'll see which posts are original to threads you start and actually answer your question, and the ones that are cut and paste from previous threads with questionable originality and possibly low relevance to your thread.

I like oil #3.

 

[Ilyushin]

Thank you all for your replies. I have written to Petronas (oil #3) asking for the TBN and the viscosity at 40ºC because it's missing in the datasheets, if they reply me I'll post the data here.

Might it be useful to have a higher viscosity value at 100ºC in terms of engine protection?

 

[ZeeOSix]

Originally Posted by Ilyushin
Might it be useful to have a higher viscosity value at 100ºC in terms of engine protection?


Typically yes. What you really need to see is the specification of HTHS (high temperature high shear) viscosity (not all manufacturers give that spec out), which is the viscosity at 150C. Oils 1, 2 and 3 are very close in KV100, so look at other factors between them to choose. Oil #3 KV40 will probably be lower than the others since the VI is higher. So Oil #3 might have better overall specs.

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted by Ilyushin
Thank you all for your replies. I have written to Petronas (oil #3) asking for the TBN and the viscosity at 40ºC because it's missing in the datasheets, if they reply me I'll post the data here.

Might it be useful to have a higher viscosity value at 100ºC in terms of engine protection?

And yet we still don't know what bike you have and what specification or approval is required or recommended by the manufacturer.

 

[Ilyushin]

Originally Posted by kschachn
Originally Posted by Ilyushin
Thank you all for your replies. I have written to Petronas (oil #3) asking for the TBN and the viscosity at 40ºC because it's missing in the datasheets, if they reply me I'll post the data here.

Might it be useful to have a higher viscosity value at 100ºC in terms of engine protection?

And yet we still don't know what bike you have and what specification or approval is required or recommended by the manufacturer.



As stated in the first post, the 4 oils we are debating here meet or exceed the manufacturer specs, that means 10w40 Jaso ma2 and API SN, and both bikes have been running perfectly with the motul 7100 for a lot of miles, but now money is a concern

The cheapest one is #1 oil and #3 is the most expensive, closer to the Motul 7100, but my doubt is if it might be worth the expense, I have no experience about Petronas oils and there is little information of the Sprinta F900 on the internet

 

[Bonz]

You're looking for a less expensive oil that will protect your bikes. It would be nice to know what bikes you have, air-cooled, liquid-cooled, high-revving, V-Twin cruiser, recommended oil change interval, etc.

What do other users say about the specific oils in terms of how well shift quality holds up over an oil change interval? What do VOA's if available or UOA's say about the additive packages? Lots of info that I would be looking at besides a piece of white paper.

If your friend asked you to come over to his house and help him with a project and you brought a rubber mallet but he was framing a wall, it would have been helpful to know what the job was at hand so you have the right tool.

Same thing here, just looking at a piece of paper you are asking us to tell you the best oil for your bike. Who's to say 15w40 or 20w50 wouldn't be better based upon the temperatures you ride in and the recommendations of the manufacturer?

 

[kschachn]

Originally Posted by Ilyushin
As stated in the first post, the 4 oils we are debating here meet or exceed the manufacturer specs, that means 10w40 Jaso ma2 and API SN, and both bikes have been running perfectly with the motul 7100 for a lot of miles, but now money is a concern

There's no debate needed as to which meet the manufacturer's specification, right? It does or it does not.

"Exceed" is certainly a debate since no one on here can determine that. If they say they can, then have them post the exact requirements of the license and then show specifically which relevant attributes are better in any specific oil.

 

[Ilyushin]

Originally Posted by Bonz
You're looking for a less expensive oil that will protect your bikes. It would be nice to know what bikes you have, air-cooled, liquid-cooled, high-revving, V-Twin cruiser, recommended oil change interval, etc.

What do other users say about the specific oils in terms of how well shift quality holds up over an oil change interval? What do VOA's if available or UOA's say about the additive packages? Lots of info that I would be looking at besides a piece of white paper.

If your friend asked you to come over to his house and help him with a project and you brought a rubber mallet but he was framing a wall, it would have been helpful to know what the job was at hand so you have the right tool.

Same thing here, just looking at a piece of paper you are asking us to tell you the best oil for your bike. Who's to say 15w40 or 20w50 wouldn't be better based upon the temperatures you ride in and the recommendations of the manufacturer?



I live in an area that goes between 5 ºC (41º F) and 25ºC (77ºF)

One bike is a 2014 Suzuki Vstrom 650 with 35000 miles that does about 5000 miles per year and that is it's OCI,and this bikes gets all kind of rides, from commutes to highway and offroad too

Other is a 2003 Yamaha FZS 600 Fazer with 15000 miles that only rides about 1000 miles per year (also that is the oil change interval) and only for light touring usage

None of them burns any oil and always get a new oil filter when the oil is changed.

So I think it's perfect to stay with both manufacturers recommendation, that means 10w40 grades and API SJ or better

 

[Bonz]

That is a great statement of your situation and I agree, 10w40 is fine. Get the one that fits your budget, and that you feel best with, and go with it.

 

[Taurus77]

Hello guys!!
I have searched the net for reviews of the Petronas Sprinta F900 10w40 and 10w50 but I have not found anything. Personally I think Petronas is an excellent brand. I have been using Petronas for some time on my car and I have never had problems with both the engine and the DPF.
Do any of you have more detailed information on the Sprinta F900?

 

[kschachn]

I get so confused. Here is what you do, you pick a grade that is appropriate for your climate in accordance with the chart in your owner's manual. You also find out what specification, license or approval is required or recommended for your bike (from that same owner's manual). Then you find an oil for sale that has both of those values. If price is your concern then you pick the one that has both the certification and the grade but is the least expensive. You avoid any oil that is "recommended for" the certification or one where they aren't clear if it has the cert or not. Then you are done.

If you are convinced that Petronas is an "excellent brand" then find one that meets the two requirements above. You can be flexible on grade but don't be flexible on certification or approval.

"Reviews" are meaningless. Here are the manufacturer data sheets for the oils in question. Do the oils meet the requirements of your bike manufacturer?

https://www.pli-petronas.com/sites/...NAS%20SPRINTA%20F900_10W-40_PDS_VER3.pdf
https://www.pli-petronas.com/sites/...NAS%20SPRINTA%20F900_10W-50_PDS_VER3.pdf

 

[Taurus77]

Originally Posted by kschachn
I get so confused. Here is what you do, you pick a grade that is appropriate for your climate in accordance with the chart in your owner's manual. You also find out what specification, license or approval is required or recommended for your bike (from that same owner's manual). Then you find an oil for sale that has both of those values. If price is your concern then you pick the one that has both the certification and the grade but is the least expensive. You avoid any oil that is "recommended for" the certification or one where they aren't clear if it has the cert or not. Then you are done.

If you are convinced that Petronas is an "excellent brand" then find one that meets the two requirements above. You can be flexible on grade but don't be flexible on certification or approval.

"Reviews" are meaningless. Here are the manufacturer data sheets for the oils in question. Do the oils meet the requirements of your bike manufacturer?


Hello!!
I didn't understand if you're answering me or Ilyushin.
In any case I am not one of those who spend 20-30 € for a liter of oil because as my old professor at the university said "Pay the advertising, the placebo effect and your stupidity" Definitely respect the manufacturer's certifications is the first step to do ... then based on your skills and experience you can play on small variations of the choice. As for Petronas, here in Italy it has been the official supplier of the FCA group for many years and no one has ever had problems due to lubricants. Many cars owned by me and some of my friends arrived at the 500,000km threshold without special care, in practice only ordinary oil and filter maintenance.