Mopar/Chrysler ATF+4 search problems

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903
Location
wa state
Since the site search function cant seem to find any threads that contain ATF in the subject(even though there is 12 threads on the front page containing "ATF"), can someone link or point me in the direction of a Mopar ATF+4 VOA or product data sheet? I have been using google to find different PDF's on different brands of ATF, and it seem they all range from 6.8-7.5 @100*C. I am just curious as to what the spec is for Mopar/Chrysler ATF+4. I have been using Amsoils ATF(6.8) lately, but I am thinking of trying Redlines C+ATF(7.5), or possibly something thicker like the Amsoil Syncromesh(9.8). I have been getting some notchy shifting lately with the Amsoil, so I was thinking of trying something a little thicker. The tranny is a New Venture T-850 manual recommending ATF+4 with 4OZ. of Mopar Limited Slip Modifier....Any recommendations for fluid?
 
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23,711
Location
CA
ATF+4 is in the 7.0 to 7.5 range. The data sheets will give you the viscosity for the fluid when it is new, but this doesn't tell you how much the fluid will shear during service.
 
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23,711
Location
CA
 Originally Posted By: hooligan24
Too late for an edit..... I just looked at the RP site and noticed that their Syncromax is only [email protected] and the ATF if [email protected] Why would they design their manual tranny fluid to almost be the same grade as ATF?
The manual transmission fluid is a different type of fluid. The friction modifiers needed for a manual transmissions are different than the ones for an automatic.
 
Messages
446
Location
York, PA
 Originally Posted By: hooligan24
I have been getting some notchy shifting lately with the Amsoil, so I was thinking of trying something a little thicker. The tranny is a New Venture T-850 manual recommending ATF+4....Any recommendations for fluid?
I'm currently running RP's Synchromax in my SRT-4. I personally think this car shifts like carp but this fluid is way better than the Mopar ATF+4/friction modifier concoction the factory calls for. The only problem is that about 2k miles after putting the Synchromax in, I started getting a drivetrain related growling noise. I'm almost 100% positive the noise is a wheel bearing problem but the timing of it had me worried initially. I even went as far as taking the Synchromax out and putting fresh ATF+4 in for testing purposes. The Synchromax went back in last weekend and I had forgotten how much better the shifting is with it. I'm hoping to get a chance to change out the wheel bearing within the next week or two to hopefully vindicate the Synchromax.
 

hooligan24

Thread starter
Messages
903
Location
wa state
 Originally Posted By: The Critic
ATF+4 is in the 7.0 to 7.5 range. The data sheets will give you the viscosity for the fluid when it is new, but this doesn't tell you how much the fluid will shear during service.
The higher the viscosity index the less it will shear during the service interval....is this correct? Redline seams to have the highest VI# of the bunch
 
Messages
23,711
Location
CA
 Originally Posted By: hooligan24
 Originally Posted By: The Critic
ATF+4 is in the 7.0 to 7.5 range. The data sheets will give you the viscosity for the fluid when it is new, but this doesn't tell you how much the fluid will shear during service.
The higher the viscosity index the less it will shear during the service interval....is this correct? Redline seams to have the highest VI# of the bunch
Not necessarily, it's very difficult to tell how shear stable the fluid will be based on the data you see on the data sheet. You can use a lot of VII in a fluid and that will boost the viscosity index as well. There are many ways to achieve a high viscosity index, and some methods will make the fluid less shear stable. It's just difficult to tell how the fluid was formulated.
 
Messages
446
Location
York, PA
 Originally Posted By: The Critic
 Originally Posted By: hooligan24
Too late for an edit..... I just looked at the RP site and noticed that their Syncromax is only [email protected] and the ATF if [email protected] Why would they design their manual tranny fluid to almost be the same grade as ATF?
The manual transmission fluid is a different type of fluid. The friction modifiers needed for a manual transmissions are different than the ones for an automatic.
Mopar actually specs AFT+4 plus 4oz of friction modifier for this transmission. Some have speculated that the friction modifier actually causes the transmission fluid to break down too quickly so the factory recommends a change interval of only 18k miles.
 
Messages
446
Location
York, PA
 Originally Posted By: StevieC
I would put a transmission cooler on it to keep the fluid thicker and use a quality synthetic.
It's a manual transmission so no cooler and Mopar ATF+4 already claims to be a full synthetic.
 

hooligan24

Thread starter
Messages
903
Location
wa state
I have tried the RP syncromax in the past, but never their ATF. I didnt like the way it shifted compared to the Amsoil ATF, so I went back to the Amsoil. Now I am on a quest to find the best shifting out of this S&^t-Box of a tranny. Its a very strong tranny, but I just wish it wouldnt shift like a full size truck. rumor has it, tranny originally was from a delivery/box truck sold over seas and I am starting to beleive it.
 
Messages
446
Location
York, PA
 Originally Posted By: hooligan24
I have tried the RP syncromax in the past, but never their ATF. I didnt like the way it shifted compared to the Amsoil ATF, so I went back to the Amsoil. Now I am on a quest to find the best shifting out of this S&^t-Box of a tranny. Its a very strong tranny, but I just wish it wouldnt shift like a full size truck. rumor has it, tranny originally was from a delivery/box truck sold over seas and I am starting to beleive it.
Maybe I will have to try the Amsoil ATF if its better than the Synchromax. I agree on the shifts like a truck deal. I read on some srt forums about people speed shifting these things and I can't image how? I guess that's how everybody ends up with the synchro problems. I was talking to E-booger from Mopar Action magazine about the SRT-4 (he has one as well) and he confirmed the box truck usage. He knew the details about exactly what model they were used in but I can't remember at the moment.
 
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1,603
Location
Ohio
The Valvoline ATF+4 has a cst of 7.55 @100*c I would imagine that the mopar labeled stuff is the same or very close. Iam running RP Syncromax right now, it seems to be a slight improvement over the atf4 and friction modifier. Next I am going to try Pennzoil Synchromesh fluid, it has a cst of 9.08 @100*c. The NV T-350 calls for a Synchromesh type fluid and has no recommended change interval,our T-850 is very very similar, I believe dodge went to the atf fluid in manual trannys for economic reasons, so they could use one fluid in everything.
 
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Messages
43
Location
New Jersey
I wouldnt use anything except what is called for in a Chrysler product. I had very bad experiance using a different oil in a Jeep Cherokee 5 speed. I believe I put a synchromesh type fluid in and it pretty much ruined the whole trans even when I went to put the +3 (at the time) back in. It was a perfectly good transmission and after about 1000 miles with the synchromesh type fluid I couldnt even get it out of first when the trans was cold. I believe chrysler transmissions both automatic or manual are very picky no matter which year. I have a 08 dodge and keep putting the +4 in the manual Getrag 238 and it works fine. I may try the +4 pennzoil if I could find it.
 
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39,805
Location
Pottstown, PA
I'm trying to recall a Cherokee 5 speed that took ATF The AX15 took a GL-3 (try and find a GL3 fluid in NA ..let alone a synthetic). Some have used other GL4 fluids with success. Now the t-cases ..sure.
 
Messages
520
Location
FL
 Originally Posted By: hooligan24
Too late for an edit..... I just looked at the RP site and noticed that their Syncromax is only [email protected] and the ATF if [email protected] Why would they design their manual tranny fluid to almost be the same grade as ATF?
The Synchromax is sold to replace the GM/Mopar Synchromesh fluids which is similar to a 5W-30 oil. It's also listed as an "upgrade" for ATF-spec'd. manuals. I've thought of trying it next fluid change in my Saturn VUE's Getrag F23, currently using M1 ATF, but may leave well enough alone instead. ;\)
 
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1,768
Location
NE
Try the Amsoil MTF in your SRT. I use it in my PT GT. I also use the Mopar and AMSOIL ATF in it but the MTF is much better. You do know that Chysler used to recommend ATF in the older A525 and 87 A555 Getrag and then switched to 5w-30 in 88 to increase the life. Ed Peters said they love to spec a single fluid for fill at the factory. My guess is they use the ATF for that reason. Try the MTF, only a couple qts.
 
My Chrysler liberty has the 6 speed nsg370 that is also found on current Wranglers. It calls for a synchromesh, and I have had rp synchromax in it for the past two years. IMHO it shifts much smoother and is a big improvement. I am very happy with the rp synchromax.
 
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