LubeGard Red - mixing with MMO?

[Falcon_LS]

When I bought my Mercury last year, I dumped in 180 ml of ARX to clean out the unit. When the time came to replace the fluid, I paid someone to do it due to time constraints. Despite telling them I want a cooler line flush, they only managed to get 5 liters out of the system. Total unit capacity, if memory serves me right, is 18 liters. At this point, 2 bottles of LubeGard Red also went in and the transmission started shifting noticeably better.

However, the fluid that came out was literally black. As only 5 liters of Motorcraft Mercon V went in, it mixed in with the remaining 13 liters in the unit and I'm sure there is some ARX left in there.

Call me old fashioned, but I like to do a cooler line flush every 40,000 km considering the heat the unit is exposed to and all the stop and go driving I've been doing of late. Also replace the filter/gaskets whilst I'm at it.

It's been roughly 22,910 km (14,319 miles) since the fluid change, and I was thinking if I should slowly start replacing the fluid over the course of the next 17,000 km and then do a cooler line flush. But I was wondering if it would make sense to extract 500 ml of ATF and substitute 500 ml of MMO for it (recommended dose), drive a while for it and then start slowly replacing fluid using the extraction method. Only issue is, would there be a problem adding MMO to the unit with LG Red already in there? Thanks!

 

[JHZR2]

I wouldnt add MMO into an AT. Too many sensitive things in there. LG is designed for ATF application, IMO MMO is not.

 

[HTSS_TR]

I would do the cooler line flush now and add LubeGard Red, I would not use MMO in transmission or power steering system.

 

[demarpaint]

I'll bite, LOL. I've used MMO in PS and AT with good results. I would add the suggested amount and run it 1000 miles, at that point I would do a pan drop, filter replacement, and line flush. Fill the unit and use LG red w/o MMO. I would not run MMO more than 1000-1500 miles in the transmission. Be sure if you are adding MMO that you do not overfill the unit.

LG red would be the last thing added after the line flush, and that I was certain I had no leaks. JMO

 

[Falcon_LS]

Thanks for all the input. I have actually used MMO in automatic transmissions before, although nothing else was in there other than ATF to begin with.

Friend of mine with a 2001 Taurus had an issue, where he was experiencing hard shifts so we dumped in a pint of MMO with the Mercon V already in there. In about 2,000 km, the shifting slowly stared getting softer and less noticeable, although the fluid was literally jet black. The shifts improved greatly within 5,000 km after adding the MMO, and after the fluid flush, the shifts were almost like new.

I'm open to suggestions as to what products would be good for cleaning transmission internals, however, particularly the valve body. Having the LG Red in there just made me a bit reluctant to add anything else. So before adding anything, I will drain all the fluid in the transmission and the torque converter, which has a drain, and take it from there.

 

[unDummy]

LubeGard will clean your transmission and so will Autorx.
MMO will thin the ATF out and give it a solvent like cleaning affect and is not needed if your'e already are using LG or ARX. Seafoam will too and is probably quicker than MMO.

The best thing to do is to change the fluid out in timely intervals to prevent issues. If you're cooking Mercon-V, you should consider a full synthetic.

An ATF cooler will help. But, your in a warm location and hot air doesn't cool hot ATF too well. Definitely consider a full synthetic if available.

The other option, if available, is a deeper ATF pan to add a quart or 2 of fluid capacity. Aftermarket B&M, Permacool, or remote oil filter type ATF filter kits will add ATF capacity and ATF cooling.

Lubegard makes a 5-minute flush too. Toss the bottle in, drive for 5 minutes, and then do a complete machine or cooler line flush!!!

 

[wander2039]

Originally Posted By: Falcon_LS
Only issue is, would there be a problem adding MMO to the unit with LG Red already in there? Thanks!

Sure hope not going to add 1/2 quart of MMO and 5oz of Lubegard to both the cars later. Already have 1/2 quart MMO in the Festiva and it shifts extremely smooth. I didn't realize how much till you compare it to the Aspire which is extremely harsh. I almost forget how hard the Festiva shifted when I first got it! Going to add 5oz of Lubegard will I'm at it. Probably doesn't need but for $10 easier than replacing a transmision.

 

[ltslimjim]

I heard that hard shifting sometimes is to PREVENT wear, for instance full temp middle of the summer, is this true? If you leave MMO in there too long, could it rob the ATF of friction modifiers etc or worse yet operating viscosity still protecting in severe service driving? Just wondering...

FWIW, I agree with the LG ATF Flush prior to a fluid/filter change, return line fluid exchange etc, over MMO or even SeaFoam's ATF flush additive(meant to be flush out). LG even says it doesn't matter if you aren't doing a flush after using their ATF flush additive since it's formulated to be a safe clean and won't harm the internal parts by having some remaining over.

http://lubegard.com/faqs.html#5

Quote:
If I do a pan drop and do not remove all of the used fluid is it safe to leave some of the LUBEGARD Transmission Flush in the transmission? LUBEGARD Transmission Flush does not contain solvents or other components harmful to the transmission so it is safe if some is left behind. Detergents and dispersants will continue to safely remove varnish and sludge keeping them in suspension until the next fluid change.

 

[Falcon_LS]

Originally Posted By: unDummy
LubeGard will clean your transmission and so will Autorx.
MMO will thin the ATF out and give it a solvent like cleaning affect and is not needed if your'e already are using LG or ARX. Seafoam will too and is probably quicker than MMO.

The best thing to do is to change the fluid out in timely intervals to prevent issues. If you're cooking Mercon-V, you should consider a full synthetic.

An ATF cooler will help. But, your in a warm location and hot air doesn't cool hot ATF too well. Definitely consider a full synthetic if available.

The other option, if available, is a deeper ATF pan to add a quart or 2 of fluid capacity. Aftermarket B&M, Permacool, or remote oil filter type ATF filter kits will add ATF capacity and ATF cooling.

Lubegard makes a 5-minute flush too. Toss the bottle in, drive for 5 minutes, and then do a complete machine or cooler line flush!!!


Thanks for the input! In that case, I will just drain and refill with Liqui-Moly Top Tec 1200 Synthetic ATF and 2 bottles of LG Red.

That said, the vehicle is equipped with an ATF cooler and an engine oil cooler. The engine oil cooler uses the radiator, but I'm not sure how effective the ATF cooler is either to be honest.

I am also considering a Magnefine inline transmission filter, although I didn't think about a deeper pan - thanks for pointing that out. Should be especially helpful once the J-Mod is done to the unit.

Originally Posted By: Eric Smith
Sure hope not going to add 1/2 quart of MMO and 5oz of Lubegard to both the cars later. Already have 1/2 quart MMO in the Festiva and it shifts extremely smooth. I didn't realize how much till you compare it to the Aspire which is extremely harsh. I almost forget how hard the Festiva shifted when I first got it! Going to add 5oz of Lubegard will I'm at it. Probably doesn't need but for $10 easier than replacing a transmision.


It's either one or the other. I'm not too big on experimenting with different additives all in the one go, so in this case I will just stick with LG Red.

Originally Posted By: ltslimjim
FWIW, I agree with the LG ATF Flush prior to a fluid/filter change, return line fluid exchange etc, over MMO or even SeaFoam's ATF flush additive(meant to be flush out). LG even says it doesn't matter if you aren't doing a flush after using their ATF flush additive since it's formulated to be a safe clean and won't harm the internal parts by having some remaining over.

http://lubegard.com/faqs.html#5

Quote:
If I do a pan drop and do not remove all of the used fluid is it safe to leave some of the LUBEGARD Transmission Flush in the transmission? LUBEGARD Transmission Flush does not contain solvents or other components harmful to the transmission so it is safe if some is left behind. Detergents and dispersants will continue to safely remove varnish and sludge keeping them in suspension until the next fluid change.


Will check to see if it's available - fingers crossed!

 

[ltslimjim]

I wonder if LG sells the LG Red and ATF Flush in packs, if you can't find the flush alone or can get a better deal on a pack?

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: ltslimjim
I wonder if LG sells the LG Red and ATF Flush in packs, if you can't find the flush alone or can get a better deal on a pack?


IIRC Amazon.com sold it in pairs. The ATF Flush and LG Red together.

 

[ltslimjim]

Napa has it too for about $23 or so, but it just depends on if the specific Napa has it and/or if it can be purchased online/shipped to you.

 

[Donald]

Forget MMO, the only mystery is why people still use it. The only cost effective way to change all the ATF is via a cooler line flush. Changing a few quarts here and there is not cost effective if you want all the old ATF out. If it was black, then you need a total change. The exception is if you only want to "refresh" the ATF, then doing a pan drain and refill makes sense. Also if you have work done where the pan needs to be dropped, then maybe just add the new ATF to fill the pan.

Don't forget the Magnefine filter!

 

[Letter_K]

Originally Posted By: ltslimjim
I wonder if LG sells the LG Red and ATF Flush in packs, if you can't find the flush alone or can get a better deal on a pack?


O'Reilly - If they dont' have it you can get it shipped tot he store in a few days. Can order on the website and pick up in store. They send an email when it is in.

Part Number: 98602
$15.99
•LUBEGARD® ATF Flush & Protect Pack
Believe it is Red

or

Part Number: 98010
•LUBEGARD® Universal ATF Flush & Protect Pack Platinum
$21.99

 

[HTSS_TR]

That is a good price, 98602 is $23 and $27 for 98010 at NAPA.

 

[ltslimjim]

^Yes, good find.

 

[Letter_K]

I found out when I tried to get some Platinum LubeGard. Placed the order and got an email in 15 minutes. I called the store and they stocked it. Not sure if they stock the flush packs, but I"m going to order some soon when I do my switch out.

Which should I go with Red or Platinum? Red is proven, but platinum has the benefits of red, plus a new additive, IIRC, Synergol? I only wonder about platinum ability to be a fluid convertor and universal LubeGard additive.