Isn't increased unsprung weight actually easier on the shocks?
KYB or Monroe rear struts
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Originally Posted By: maersk
I wouldn't think the trouble of getting springs off and on struts just to con the dealer is worth the price of new struts. Would the warranty also cover the labour?
And if they cut the old springs to lower the car then they'd have to get new springs as well just so the dealer doesn't raise a stink.
People do it ALL the time. My Father was a Manager of an Acura Dealer for years, OH BOY I have stories!! Switching springs and struts??? That is NOTHING compared with what people try to get away with.
Jeff
I wouldn't think the trouble of getting springs off and on struts just to con the dealer is worth the price of new struts. Would the warranty also cover the labour?
And if they cut the old springs to lower the car then they'd have to get new springs as well just so the dealer doesn't raise a stink.
People do it ALL the time. My Father was a Manager of an Acura Dealer for years, OH BOY I have stories!! Switching springs and struts??? That is NOTHING compared with what people try to get away with.
Jeff
You are certainly right on that my friend! You guys here on BITOG should see some of the humanity that my company deals with; it aint pretty.
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Originally Posted By: maersk
Isn't increased unsprung weight actually easier on the shocks?
In essence Yes, BUT its not so simple. Lighter is better. Add Heavy Rims, Heavy Wider Tires, And lowering springs? your lucky to make it 20K without a failure.
Jeff
Isn't increased unsprung weight actually easier on the shocks?
In essence Yes, BUT its not so simple. Lighter is better. Add Heavy Rims, Heavy Wider Tires, And lowering springs? your lucky to make it 20K without a failure.
Jeff
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Originally Posted By: Silver_civic
You are certainly right on that my friend! You guys here on BITOG should see some of the humanity that my company deals with; it aint pretty.
++++1
You are certainly right on that my friend! You guys here on BITOG should see some of the humanity that my company deals with; it aint pretty.
++++1
I have KYB and Tokico on my 2 older cars, both have been at least 50k and both are still holding up fine.
My understanding is Tokico (might also be KYB) has lifetime warranty as long as you are the owner. Depends on the car and how picky you are, both KYB and Monroe might work good enough, and Bilstein may be overkill depends on what you are willing to pay.
My understanding is Tokico (might also be KYB) has lifetime warranty as long as you are the owner. Depends on the car and how picky you are, both KYB and Monroe might work good enough, and Bilstein may be overkill depends on what you are willing to pay.
Thanks PandaBear and Jeff, but does anyone here replace the spring on the strut or no? Just wondering as the springs are ok. Let me know and thanks for all the replies.
Originally Posted By: Silver_civic
Thanks PandaBear and Jeff, but does anyone here replace the spring on the strut or no? Just wondering as the springs are ok. Let me know and thanks for all the replies.
Have never had to replace springs. Usually just use a spring compressor and replace strut and mounts etc.
Thanks PandaBear and Jeff, but does anyone here replace the spring on the strut or no? Just wondering as the springs are ok. Let me know and thanks for all the replies.
Have never had to replace springs. Usually just use a spring compressor and replace strut and mounts etc.
Originally Posted By: SLCraig
Originally Posted By: Silver_civic
Thanks PandaBear and Jeff, but does anyone here replace the spring on the strut or no? Just wondering as the springs are ok. Let me know and thanks for all the replies.
Have never had to replace springs. Usually just use a spring compressor and replace strut and mounts etc.
Measure your ride height to see if there's any saggage. You can compare it to the OE specs.
Originally Posted By: Silver_civic
Thanks PandaBear and Jeff, but does anyone here replace the spring on the strut or no? Just wondering as the springs are ok. Let me know and thanks for all the replies.
Have never had to replace springs. Usually just use a spring compressor and replace strut and mounts etc.
Measure your ride height to see if there's any saggage. You can compare it to the OE specs.
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Springs "generally" never need to be replaced. Like the above folks stated, you can measure but some sag is normal as the suspension settles which may give a false reading.
The way of really knowing is to have the springs tested on a spring rate meter, not sure of the exact title of the machine, but I know racing shops have them.
Do you need to do that?? I would say no. Unless your car is like 20+ yrs old. Or if you have been riding on blown struts for a long time and possibly fatigued the springs.
If that isn't the case then just put your OEM springs on your new struts. The odds are your springs are fine.
Jeff
The way of really knowing is to have the springs tested on a spring rate meter, not sure of the exact title of the machine, but I know racing shops have them.
Do you need to do that?? I would say no. Unless your car is like 20+ yrs old. Or if you have been riding on blown struts for a long time and possibly fatigued the springs.
If that isn't the case then just put your OEM springs on your new struts. The odds are your springs are fine.
Jeff
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Yeah, some people around my area feel you should replace the springs anyhow. I told them well I dont see the need to spend 60$ or even 90$ per spring when I dont need to. Thanks for the advice Jeff.
adam
adam
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
I again dissagree. They do not suck. It makes sense on the chryslers why they fail. My guess on the 300's with people putting those crazy 22" rims on them, haha.
If people put lowering springs, or alter the suspension in any way you are going to have failures. I know ALLOT of guys that drive Chryslers and had strut issues. BUT they had the car lowered and had HUGE HEAVEY rims on the car that contributed to them to go out early. They put the OEM springs back on, OEM rims tires then roll into the dealer wanting them changed. KYB's fault? mmmmm not sure.
For the average Joe, the KYB's are all you need.
Jeff
There's no debate that altering factory setting can cause issues. That still doesn't explain OE KYB dampers failing before 30K miles, on a completely stock installation.
I again dissagree. They do not suck. It makes sense on the chryslers why they fail. My guess on the 300's with people putting those crazy 22" rims on them, haha.
If people put lowering springs, or alter the suspension in any way you are going to have failures. I know ALLOT of guys that drive Chryslers and had strut issues. BUT they had the car lowered and had HUGE HEAVEY rims on the car that contributed to them to go out early. They put the OEM springs back on, OEM rims tires then roll into the dealer wanting them changed. KYB's fault? mmmmm not sure.
For the average Joe, the KYB's are all you need.
Jeff
There's no debate that altering factory setting can cause issues. That still doesn't explain OE KYB dampers failing before 30K miles, on a completely stock installation.
I liked the Monroe Sensatracs that I had on my old cavalier. They rode smoothly, but still handled well in the corners.
As I read somewhere, Bilstein might be the only aftermarket company that has [censored] near 100% positive feedback across the internet. I've run Bilstein on all my cars. They are fantastic.
PS- Lifetime warranties do not cover labor. So if you like swapping struts, go with whatever you want. Just have a back up car for the week or so it'll take for you to ship your blown strut, have them "inspect" it, and then send you a new one.
PS- Lifetime warranties do not cover labor. So if you like swapping struts, go with whatever you want. Just have a back up car for the week or so it'll take for you to ship your blown strut, have them "inspect" it, and then send you a new one.
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Bilstein doesnt make struts for mine......
KYB Gas a Justs are great shocks.
The KYB Gr 2's I do not hear as many nice things about.
The KYB Gr 2's I do not hear as many nice things about.
It depends on whether your springs were shot or not. Most cars don't need to replace spring when doing strut/shock work, some exception do apply due to design error (Ford Taurus in gen 3/4 with sagging rear), but in those case you should UPGRADE to a beefier spring (i.e. MOOG cargo coil) instead of the same OEM replacement.
Thank you for that good advice PandaBear, as I havent dealt with a wide variety of struts in my young 30 yrs of life. Do a bunch of them at my work, just not variety of vehicles like the Taurus you mentioned as well as other car makes I probably havent heard of. Thank you again,
Adam
Adam
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Originally Posted By: rshunter
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
I again dissagree. They do not suck. It makes sense on the chryslers why they fail. My guess on the 300's with people putting those crazy 22" rims on them, haha.
If people put lowering springs, or alter the suspension in any way you are going to have failures. I know ALLOT of guys that drive Chryslers and had strut issues. BUT they had the car lowered and had HUGE HEAVEY rims on the car that contributed to them to go out early. They put the OEM springs back on, OEM rims tires then roll into the dealer wanting them changed. KYB's fault? mmmmm not sure.
For the average Joe, the KYB's are all you need.
Jeff
There's no debate that altering factory setting can cause issues. That still doesn't explain OE KYB dampers failing before 30K miles, on a completely stock installation.
I think you are "assuming" they are stock. Unless it happened to YOUR particular car and you know for a FACT that the vehicle was never modified in ANY way. Are KYB's the best? No, but they are VERY good. Like any GOOD company you have failures. You know how many failures Bilstein Has? Koni? LOTS on their OEM equipped cars. I know people that have Toyota pick ups, Lancer Evo's ect that the bilsteins fail, Vipers that Koni's fail, KYB's do too, so its no surprise. So its not just KYB. I am sure their failure rate is STILL better than average or Chrysler, Toyota, Mitsubishi and COUNTLESS other OEM's wouldn't use them at all. The KYB's you buy over the counter are just as good as OEM in quality. The only difference is the rates that they are calibrated. For 95% of the population KYB's that you can buy over the counter will do just fine.
Jeff
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
I again dissagree. They do not suck. It makes sense on the chryslers why they fail. My guess on the 300's with people putting those crazy 22" rims on them, haha.
If people put lowering springs, or alter the suspension in any way you are going to have failures. I know ALLOT of guys that drive Chryslers and had strut issues. BUT they had the car lowered and had HUGE HEAVEY rims on the car that contributed to them to go out early. They put the OEM springs back on, OEM rims tires then roll into the dealer wanting them changed. KYB's fault? mmmmm not sure.
For the average Joe, the KYB's are all you need.
Jeff
There's no debate that altering factory setting can cause issues. That still doesn't explain OE KYB dampers failing before 30K miles, on a completely stock installation.
I think you are "assuming" they are stock. Unless it happened to YOUR particular car and you know for a FACT that the vehicle was never modified in ANY way. Are KYB's the best? No, but they are VERY good. Like any GOOD company you have failures. You know how many failures Bilstein Has? Koni? LOTS on their OEM equipped cars. I know people that have Toyota pick ups, Lancer Evo's ect that the bilsteins fail, Vipers that Koni's fail, KYB's do too, so its no surprise. So its not just KYB. I am sure their failure rate is STILL better than average or Chrysler, Toyota, Mitsubishi and COUNTLESS other OEM's wouldn't use them at all. The KYB's you buy over the counter are just as good as OEM in quality. The only difference is the rates that they are calibrated. For 95% of the population KYB's that you can buy over the counter will do just fine.
Jeff
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