Only have 8700 mi on my '13 Accord and am wondering if any gas additive would be useful
in the long term since it uses direct injection?
in the long term since it uses direct injection?
Is any additive useful in Direct Injection motors?
- Thread starter tc1446
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Nope.
Since the fuel is directly injected into the cylinder, it not touching the intake valve and an additive will not clean anything.
Since the fuel is directly injected into the cylinder, it not touching the intake valve and an additive will not clean anything.
Do some research on a product called an inverse oiler.
Its a system that hooks into a vacuum line. You have a container that contains a product such as mmo or even seafoam. A tube runs from the holding tank to a vacuum line and flow is controlled by a small valve.
I've got one on my charger right now.
The cleaning agent is sucked into the vacuum line and makes its way into the intake manifold where it's sucked into the engine but as it's vacuumed into the engine it cleans the intake which includes the ports and valves.
I have the valve adjusted so that the 2 quart reservoir lasts around 3000 miles. Look into the system. I think its a must have for direct injection. It works like a seafoam treatment but instead of completely flooding the intake tract with cleaner it's administered a drop at a time in a steady and consistent manner.
Just a thought.
Its a system that hooks into a vacuum line. You have a container that contains a product such as mmo or even seafoam. A tube runs from the holding tank to a vacuum line and flow is controlled by a small valve.
I've got one on my charger right now.
The cleaning agent is sucked into the vacuum line and makes its way into the intake manifold where it's sucked into the engine but as it's vacuumed into the engine it cleans the intake which includes the ports and valves.
I have the valve adjusted so that the 2 quart reservoir lasts around 3000 miles. Look into the system. I think its a must have for direct injection. It works like a seafoam treatment but instead of completely flooding the intake tract with cleaner it's administered a drop at a time in a steady and consistent manner.
Just a thought.
Use a top tier gasoline supplier and don't worry.
Shell V-power premium grade seems to be the most robust top tier available and in Canada, does not contain ethanol.
If you have engine issues, and if you install any extra add-ons - such as intake cleaners - they may void your warranty.
Shell V-power premium grade seems to be the most robust top tier available and in Canada, does not contain ethanol.
If you have engine issues, and if you install any extra add-ons - such as intake cleaners - they may void your warranty.
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Do some research on a product called an inverse oiler.
Its a system that hooks into a vacuum line. You have a container that contains a product such as mmo or even seafoam. A tube runs from the holding tank to a vacuum line and flow is controlled by a small valve.
I've got one on my charger right now.
The cleaning agent is sucked into the vacuum line and makes its way into the intake manifold where it's sucked into the engine but as it's vacuumed into the engine it cleans the intake which includes the ports and valves.
I have the valve adjusted so that the 2 quart reservoir lasts around 3000 miles. Look into the system. I think its a must have for direct injection. It works like a seafoam treatment but instead of completely flooding the intake tract with cleaner it's administered a drop at a time in a steady and consistent manner.
Just a thought.
Seriously ?...you're constantly running a cleaner through your engine ?
That make no sense to me at all .
Do some research on a product called an inverse oiler.
Its a system that hooks into a vacuum line. You have a container that contains a product such as mmo or even seafoam. A tube runs from the holding tank to a vacuum line and flow is controlled by a small valve.
I've got one on my charger right now.
The cleaning agent is sucked into the vacuum line and makes its way into the intake manifold where it's sucked into the engine but as it's vacuumed into the engine it cleans the intake which includes the ports and valves.
I have the valve adjusted so that the 2 quart reservoir lasts around 3000 miles. Look into the system. I think its a must have for direct injection. It works like a seafoam treatment but instead of completely flooding the intake tract with cleaner it's administered a drop at a time in a steady and consistent manner.
Just a thought.
Seriously ?...you're constantly running a cleaner through your engine ?
That make no sense to me at all .
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Do some research on a product called an inverse oiler. Its a system that hooks into a vacuum line. You have a container that contains a product such as mmo or even seafoam. A tube runs from the holding tank to a vacuum line and flow is controlled by a small valve. I've got one on my charger right now.
The cleaning agent is sucked into the vacuum line and makes its way into the intake manifold where it's sucked into the engine but as it's vacuumed into the engine it cleans the intake which includes the ports and valves. I have the valve adjusted so that the 2 quart reservoir lasts around 3000 miles. Look into the system. I think its a must have for direct injection. It works like a seafoam treatment but instead of completely flooding the intake tract with cleaner it's administered a drop at a time in a steady and consistent manner.
Seriously ?...you're constantly running a cleaner through your engine ?
That make no sense to me at all.
An upper cylinder oiler does more than just clean. The upper cylinder oil also lubricates the valves and rings. You should see an increase in compression (like the difference between 'wet' and 'dry' compression test reading). If your vehicle is prone to eating valves, this will reduce that appetite. On the downside, your catalytic converter may not be a happy camper.
You could accomplish much the same thing by adding the upper cylinder oil to the fuel tank. The oiler is more convenient - less messy. These devices have been around a very long time, now approaching 100 years!
Originally Posted By: Clevy
Do some research on a product called an inverse oiler. Its a system that hooks into a vacuum line. You have a container that contains a product such as mmo or even seafoam. A tube runs from the holding tank to a vacuum line and flow is controlled by a small valve. I've got one on my charger right now.
The cleaning agent is sucked into the vacuum line and makes its way into the intake manifold where it's sucked into the engine but as it's vacuumed into the engine it cleans the intake which includes the ports and valves. I have the valve adjusted so that the 2 quart reservoir lasts around 3000 miles. Look into the system. I think its a must have for direct injection. It works like a seafoam treatment but instead of completely flooding the intake tract with cleaner it's administered a drop at a time in a steady and consistent manner.
Seriously ?...you're constantly running a cleaner through your engine ?
That make no sense to me at all.
An upper cylinder oiler does more than just clean. The upper cylinder oil also lubricates the valves and rings. You should see an increase in compression (like the difference between 'wet' and 'dry' compression test reading). If your vehicle is prone to eating valves, this will reduce that appetite. On the downside, your catalytic converter may not be a happy camper.
You could accomplish much the same thing by adding the upper cylinder oil to the fuel tank. The oiler is more convenient - less messy. These devices have been around a very long time, now approaching 100 years!
I would just keep an eye on the intake valve heads after 10k miles and see how crusty they get - may be a non-issue. You may need to borrow a borescope. You should know if WOT performance starts to decline significantly - though that could be due to piston top carbon. IDK premium fuel would help - may cause more reversion if the timing doesn't advance.
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On the VW forums people have had good luck with Italian tune ups. Get on the freeway drop the gears to 4th drive at 70moh for 15 min then your done. You can do this in other ways but I feel that's the safest. Getting the intake valves hot burns off the crud. Some folks swear by it and have shown photos of their TSI DI motor with clean valves after 70 80 thousand miles. This is what I plan to do with my car.
Jeff
Jeff
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Out of curiosity what type of oil does Honda state to use?
I do feel also that quality of fuel does play a role but in a different way. Through the egr I am sure some of the gases get recirc through including the cleaning agents. It just may not be allot.
Use good gas use good oil and get the Revs up once a month and that's all you can do.
Jeff
I do feel also that quality of fuel does play a role but in a different way. Through the egr I am sure some of the gases get recirc through including the cleaning agents. It just may not be allot.
Use good gas use good oil and get the Revs up once a month and that's all you can do.
Jeff
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
On the VW forums people have had good luck with Italian tune ups. Get on the freeway drop the gears to 4th drive at 70moh for 15 min then your done. You can do this in other ways but I feel that's the safest. Getting the intake valves hot burns off the crud. Some folks swear by it and have shown photos of their TSI DI motor with clean valves after 70 80 thousand miles. This is what I plan to do with my car.
Jeff
Jeff , I would think that the best way to keep an engine clean of carbon , always worked before . When you have clear traffic conditions and no smokey's around give it some WOT for a bit .
IMHO additives can cause a lot of other issues and the main one would be the CAT but it could gunk up the EGR and actually cause deposits if it doesn't burn off clean .
On the VW forums people have had good luck with Italian tune ups. Get on the freeway drop the gears to 4th drive at 70moh for 15 min then your done. You can do this in other ways but I feel that's the safest. Getting the intake valves hot burns off the crud. Some folks swear by it and have shown photos of their TSI DI motor with clean valves after 70 80 thousand miles. This is what I plan to do with my car.
Jeff
Jeff , I would think that the best way to keep an engine clean of carbon , always worked before . When you have clear traffic conditions and no smokey's around give it some WOT for a bit .
IMHO additives can cause a lot of other issues and the main one would be the CAT but it could gunk up the EGR and actually cause deposits if it doesn't burn off clean .
Last edited:
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Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
On the VW forums people have had good luck with Italian tune ups. Get on the freeway drop the gears to 4th drive at 70moh for 15 min then your done. You can do this in other ways but I feel that's the safest. Getting the intake valves hot burns off the crud. Some folks swear by it and have shown photos of their TSI DI motor with clean valves after 70 80 thousand miles. This is what I plan to do with my car.
Jeff
Jeff , I would think that the best way to keep an engine clean of carbon , always worked before . When you have clear traffic conditions and no smokey's around give it some WOT for a bit .
IMHO additives can cause a lot of other issues and the main one would be the CAT but it could gunk up the EGR and actually cause deposits if it doesn't burn off clean .
I agree WOT would be best, but not very easily done for most people. The Italian Tune Up Does work. I have seen photos. WOT once in a while would be nice, but you need to substain it long enough for the valves to burn on the carbon. Going WOT for 5-10 seconds if your lucky wont get the valves hot enough.
You need revs to build heat in the valve stem. 4k rpm for 15-20 min will do the job.
Just remembering to do it??? that is another story. haha.
Then again maybe Honda has the system down pat like Cadillac. They dont have the carbon issues.
Jeff
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
On the VW forums people have had good luck with Italian tune ups. Get on the freeway drop the gears to 4th drive at 70moh for 15 min then your done. You can do this in other ways but I feel that's the safest. Getting the intake valves hot burns off the crud. Some folks swear by it and have shown photos of their TSI DI motor with clean valves after 70 80 thousand miles. This is what I plan to do with my car.
Jeff
Jeff , I would think that the best way to keep an engine clean of carbon , always worked before . When you have clear traffic conditions and no smokey's around give it some WOT for a bit .
IMHO additives can cause a lot of other issues and the main one would be the CAT but it could gunk up the EGR and actually cause deposits if it doesn't burn off clean .
I agree WOT would be best, but not very easily done for most people. The Italian Tune Up Does work. I have seen photos. WOT once in a while would be nice, but you need to substain it long enough for the valves to burn on the carbon. Going WOT for 5-10 seconds if your lucky wont get the valves hot enough.
You need revs to build heat in the valve stem. 4k rpm for 15-20 min will do the job.
Just remembering to do it??? that is another story. haha.
Then again maybe Honda has the system down pat like Cadillac. They dont have the carbon issues.
Jeff
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
Out of curiosity what type of oil does Honda state to use?
Jeff
They call for 0-20. I have PP for the next change.
Out of curiosity what type of oil does Honda state to use?
Jeff
They call for 0-20. I have PP for the next change.
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
On the VW forums people have had good luck with Italian tune ups. Get on the freeway drop the gears to 4th drive at 70moh for 15 min then your done. You can do this in other ways but I feel that's the safest. Getting the intake valves hot burns off the crud. Some folks swear by it and have shown photos of their TSI DI motor with clean valves after 70 80 thousand miles. This is what I plan to do with my car.
Jeff
Jeff , I would think that the best way to keep an engine clean of carbon , always worked before . When you have clear traffic conditions and no smokey's around give it some WOT for a bit .
IMHO additives can cause a lot of other issues and the main one would be the CAT but it could gunk up the EGR and actually cause deposits if it doesn't burn off clean .
I agree WOT would be best, but not very easily done for most people. The Italian Tune Up Does work. I have seen photos. WOT once in a while would be nice, but you need to substain it long enough for the valves to burn on the carbon. Going WOT for 5-10 seconds if your lucky wont get the valves hot enough.
You need revs to build heat in the valve stem. 4k rpm for 15-20 min will do the job.
Just remembering to do it??? that is another story. haha.
Then again maybe Honda has the system down pat like Cadillac. They dont have the carbon issues.
Jeff
Drop in lower gear and watch your RPM's , you don't have to speed .
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
On the VW forums people have had good luck with Italian tune ups. Get on the freeway drop the gears to 4th drive at 70moh for 15 min then your done. You can do this in other ways but I feel that's the safest. Getting the intake valves hot burns off the crud. Some folks swear by it and have shown photos of their TSI DI motor with clean valves after 70 80 thousand miles. This is what I plan to do with my car.
Jeff
Jeff , I would think that the best way to keep an engine clean of carbon , always worked before . When you have clear traffic conditions and no smokey's around give it some WOT for a bit .
IMHO additives can cause a lot of other issues and the main one would be the CAT but it could gunk up the EGR and actually cause deposits if it doesn't burn off clean .
I agree WOT would be best, but not very easily done for most people. The Italian Tune Up Does work. I have seen photos. WOT once in a while would be nice, but you need to substain it long enough for the valves to burn on the carbon. Going WOT for 5-10 seconds if your lucky wont get the valves hot enough.
You need revs to build heat in the valve stem. 4k rpm for 15-20 min will do the job.
Just remembering to do it??? that is another story. haha.
Then again maybe Honda has the system down pat like Cadillac. They dont have the carbon issues.
Jeff
Drop in lower gear and watch your RPM's , you don't have to speed .
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
On the VW forums people have had good luck with Italian tune ups. Get on the freeway drop the gears to 4th drive at 70moh for 15 min then your done. You can do this in other ways but I feel that's the safest. Getting the intake valves hot burns off the crud. Some folks swear by it and have shown photos of their TSI DI motor with clean valves after 70 80 thousand miles. This is what I plan to do with my car.
Jeff
Jeff , I would think that the best way to keep an engine clean of carbon , always worked before . When you have clear traffic conditions and no smokey's around give it some WOT for a bit .
IMHO additives can cause a lot of other issues and the main one would be the CAT but it could gunk up the EGR and actually cause deposits if it doesn't burn off clean .
I agree WOT would be best, but not very easily done for most people. The Italian Tune Up Does work. I have seen photos. WOT once in a while would be nice, but you need to substain it long enough for the valves to burn on the carbon. Going WOT for 5-10 seconds if your lucky wont get the valves hot enough.
You need revs to build heat in the valve stem. 4k rpm for 15-20 min will do the job.
Just remembering to do it??? that is another story. haha.
Then again maybe Honda has the system down pat like Cadillac. They dont have the carbon issues.
Jeff
Drop in lower gear and watch your RPM's , you don't have to speed .
Good idea. If that will do it, I'll give it a try. Did a little of that when breaking in the Accord; running the RPM's up and down some by changing the gears. Local roads and interstates are not conducive to varying the actual speed much.
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
On the VW forums people have had good luck with Italian tune ups. Get on the freeway drop the gears to 4th drive at 70moh for 15 min then your done. You can do this in other ways but I feel that's the safest. Getting the intake valves hot burns off the crud. Some folks swear by it and have shown photos of their TSI DI motor with clean valves after 70 80 thousand miles. This is what I plan to do with my car.
Jeff
Jeff , I would think that the best way to keep an engine clean of carbon , always worked before . When you have clear traffic conditions and no smokey's around give it some WOT for a bit .
IMHO additives can cause a lot of other issues and the main one would be the CAT but it could gunk up the EGR and actually cause deposits if it doesn't burn off clean .
I agree WOT would be best, but not very easily done for most people. The Italian Tune Up Does work. I have seen photos. WOT once in a while would be nice, but you need to substain it long enough for the valves to burn on the carbon. Going WOT for 5-10 seconds if your lucky wont get the valves hot enough.
You need revs to build heat in the valve stem. 4k rpm for 15-20 min will do the job.
Just remembering to do it??? that is another story. haha.
Then again maybe Honda has the system down pat like Cadillac. They dont have the carbon issues.
Jeff
Drop in lower gear and watch your RPM's , you don't have to speed .
Good idea. If that will do it, I'll give it a try. Did a little of that when breaking in the Accord; running the RPM's up and down some by changing the gears. Local roads and interstates are not conducive to varying the actual speed much.
Originally Posted By: gregk24
Use a low NOACK oil and top tier fuel. Thats probably the best way to prevent issues. Techron will help keep the injectors clean.
Definitely use a PEA detergent every few thousand miles to keep the injectors clean. They are exposed to combustion and keeping them clean will have an effect on your fuel economy and combustion efficiency. It won't do anything for your intake vavles, but they have standalone intake products that you can use after 100k or so.
Use a low NOACK oil and top tier fuel. Thats probably the best way to prevent issues. Techron will help keep the injectors clean.
Definitely use a PEA detergent every few thousand miles to keep the injectors clean. They are exposed to combustion and keeping them clean will have an effect on your fuel economy and combustion efficiency. It won't do anything for your intake vavles, but they have standalone intake products that you can use after 100k or so.
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Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
On the VW forums people have had good luck with Italian tune ups. Get on the freeway drop the gears to 4th drive at 70moh for 15 min then your done. You can do this in other ways but I feel that's the safest. Getting the intake valves hot burns off the crud. Some folks swear by it and have shown photos of their TSI DI motor with clean valves after 70 80 thousand miles. This is what I plan to do with my car.
Jeff
Jeff , I would think that the best way to keep an engine clean of carbon , always worked before . When you have clear traffic conditions and no smokey's around give it some WOT for a bit .
IMHO additives can cause a lot of other issues and the main one would be the CAT but it could gunk up the EGR and actually cause deposits if it doesn't burn off clean .
I agree WOT would be best, but not very easily done for most people. The Italian Tune Up Does work. I have seen photos. WOT once in a while would be nice, but you need to substain it long enough for the valves to burn on the carbon. Going WOT for 5-10 seconds if your lucky wont get the valves hot enough.
You need revs to build heat in the valve stem. 4k rpm for 15-20 min will do the job.
Just remembering to do it??? that is another story. haha.
Then again maybe Honda has the system down pat like Cadillac. They dont have the carbon issues.
Jeff
Drop in lower gear and watch your RPM's , you don't have to speed .
Yes you can do this for sure. Just need to maintain RPM around 4K for 15 min or so. If possible.
Jeff
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
Originally Posted By: nitehawk55
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
On the VW forums people have had good luck with Italian tune ups. Get on the freeway drop the gears to 4th drive at 70moh for 15 min then your done. You can do this in other ways but I feel that's the safest. Getting the intake valves hot burns off the crud. Some folks swear by it and have shown photos of their TSI DI motor with clean valves after 70 80 thousand miles. This is what I plan to do with my car.
Jeff
Jeff , I would think that the best way to keep an engine clean of carbon , always worked before . When you have clear traffic conditions and no smokey's around give it some WOT for a bit .
IMHO additives can cause a lot of other issues and the main one would be the CAT but it could gunk up the EGR and actually cause deposits if it doesn't burn off clean .
I agree WOT would be best, but not very easily done for most people. The Italian Tune Up Does work. I have seen photos. WOT once in a while would be nice, but you need to substain it long enough for the valves to burn on the carbon. Going WOT for 5-10 seconds if your lucky wont get the valves hot enough.
You need revs to build heat in the valve stem. 4k rpm for 15-20 min will do the job.
Just remembering to do it??? that is another story. haha.
Then again maybe Honda has the system down pat like Cadillac. They dont have the carbon issues.
Jeff
Drop in lower gear and watch your RPM's , you don't have to speed .
Yes you can do this for sure. Just need to maintain RPM around 4K for 15 min or so. If possible.
Jeff
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Originally Posted By: tc1446
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
Out of curiosity what type of oil does Honda state to use?
Jeff
They call for 0-20. I have PP for the next change.
I know Honda knows what they are doing, what service intervals are they requiring for this 20w oil? The thing is, USUALLY DI motors shear oil, not as bad as a Turbo does, but the Fuel delivery USUALLY causes fuel dilution issues that causes the oil to come out of "range". This can be seen on numerous UOA's on different DI motors.
I would go 3k miles on the oil, get a sample sent out. If it comes back "in range" shoot for 5k. Then re test. Comes out ok shoot for 7500 etc. I believe Honda recommends 7500 OCI's if Im not mistaken.
I always side on the cautious side. I would rather change the oil before it NEEDS to be changed. I always like having a "margin of error". These cars just cost too much to wait till the oil is near death to change it.
Just my ten cents
Jeff
Originally Posted By: Jeffs2006EvoIX
Out of curiosity what type of oil does Honda state to use?
Jeff
They call for 0-20. I have PP for the next change.
I know Honda knows what they are doing, what service intervals are they requiring for this 20w oil? The thing is, USUALLY DI motors shear oil, not as bad as a Turbo does, but the Fuel delivery USUALLY causes fuel dilution issues that causes the oil to come out of "range". This can be seen on numerous UOA's on different DI motors.
I would go 3k miles on the oil, get a sample sent out. If it comes back "in range" shoot for 5k. Then re test. Comes out ok shoot for 7500 etc. I believe Honda recommends 7500 OCI's if Im not mistaken.
I always side on the cautious side. I would rather change the oil before it NEEDS to be changed. I always like having a "margin of error". These cars just cost too much to wait till the oil is near death to change it.
Just my ten cents
Jeff
Last edited:
Originally Posted By: tc1446
any gas additive would be useful in the long term since it uses direct injection?
fuel surface-tension reduction agent
any gas additive would be useful in the long term since it uses direct injection?
fuel surface-tension reduction agent
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