I can't help but wonder if part not buying another hybrid is from people who bought a first or second generation Prius and drove it in areas where traffic congestion is a problem. These cars can't creep. In heavy traffic you need to be able to inch forward. Other hybrids can do it. The third gen Prius can do it. The early Prius cars just aren't programmed for very slow movement. The first and second Prius present a challenge of gently pressing down on the accelerator to find the spot where the car begins to move and immediately jamming on the brake with the other foot in a small fraction of a second.
Hybrid owners not re-buying
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Originally Posted By: yonyon
I can't help but wonder if part not buying another hybrid is from people who bought a first or second generation Prius and drove it in areas where traffic congestion is a problem. These cars can't creep. In heavy traffic you need to be able to inch forward. Other hybrids can do it. The third gen Prius can do it. The early Prius cars just aren't programmed for very slow movement. The first and second Prius present a challenge of gently pressing down on the accelerator to find the spot where the car begins to move and immediately jamming on the brake with the other foot in a small fraction of a second.
What are you talking about? I've driven Priuses and I've found them to be fantastic at creeping along at low speeds - I've actually considered that to be their strongest selling point, because they don't burn fuel to do it.
Maybe you could say that the Insight couldn't do it, because.. yeah, my MT insight won't move from a stop (with the engine on autostop) unless I start the motor and engage the clutch.
I can't help but wonder if part not buying another hybrid is from people who bought a first or second generation Prius and drove it in areas where traffic congestion is a problem. These cars can't creep. In heavy traffic you need to be able to inch forward. Other hybrids can do it. The third gen Prius can do it. The early Prius cars just aren't programmed for very slow movement. The first and second Prius present a challenge of gently pressing down on the accelerator to find the spot where the car begins to move and immediately jamming on the brake with the other foot in a small fraction of a second.
What are you talking about? I've driven Priuses and I've found them to be fantastic at creeping along at low speeds - I've actually considered that to be their strongest selling point, because they don't burn fuel to do it.
Maybe you could say that the Insight couldn't do it, because.. yeah, my MT insight won't move from a stop (with the engine on autostop) unless I start the motor and engage the clutch.
Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Originally Posted By: yonyon
I can't help but wonder if part not buying another hybrid is from people who bought a first or second generation Prius and drove it in areas where traffic congestion is a problem. These cars can't creep. In heavy traffic you need to be able to inch forward. Other hybrids can do it. The third gen Prius can do it. The early Prius cars just aren't programmed for very slow movement. The first and second Prius present a challenge of gently pressing down on the accelerator to find the spot where the car begins to move and immediately jamming on the brake with the other foot in a small fraction of a second.
What are you talking about? I've driven Priuses and I've found them to be fantastic at creeping along at low speeds - I've actually considered that to be their strongest selling point, because they don't burn fuel to do it.
Maybe you could say that the Insight couldn't do it, because.. yeah, my MT insight won't move from a stop (with the engine on autostop) unless I start the motor and engage the clutch.
Not low speeds, extremely low speeds. Traffic situations where you have to move a maybe 3 or 4 inches slowly over 30 seconds so that the guy in the next lane doesn't cut you off. The first and second generation Prius just plain can't do it. Waiting in line for 15 minutes to get past a traffic light can turn into an hour+ ordeal in these cars.
Originally Posted By: yonyon
I can't help but wonder if part not buying another hybrid is from people who bought a first or second generation Prius and drove it in areas where traffic congestion is a problem. These cars can't creep. In heavy traffic you need to be able to inch forward. Other hybrids can do it. The third gen Prius can do it. The early Prius cars just aren't programmed for very slow movement. The first and second Prius present a challenge of gently pressing down on the accelerator to find the spot where the car begins to move and immediately jamming on the brake with the other foot in a small fraction of a second.
What are you talking about? I've driven Priuses and I've found them to be fantastic at creeping along at low speeds - I've actually considered that to be their strongest selling point, because they don't burn fuel to do it.
Maybe you could say that the Insight couldn't do it, because.. yeah, my MT insight won't move from a stop (with the engine on autostop) unless I start the motor and engage the clutch.
Not low speeds, extremely low speeds. Traffic situations where you have to move a maybe 3 or 4 inches slowly over 30 seconds so that the guy in the next lane doesn't cut you off. The first and second generation Prius just plain can't do it. Waiting in line for 15 minutes to get past a traffic light can turn into an hour+ ordeal in these cars.
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
My friend has a Prius and his around town mileage is about what a VW TDI gets, within a couple. High 30's, into the low 40's.
Oh and what they don't tell you is that to get that Lithium battery in the car is an extremely environmentally damaging process. Your better off burning gas or diesel. The extra 10-15 mpg's comes at a very high cost.
Geez, THAT'S ALL?! Liz's Festiva managed that...with a carb and no overdrive. A 5-speed Civic HX will top 35 in town. Liz's Metro easily beats it...her WORST tank was more than 45MPG.
My friend has a Prius and his around town mileage is about what a VW TDI gets, within a couple. High 30's, into the low 40's.
Oh and what they don't tell you is that to get that Lithium battery in the car is an extremely environmentally damaging process. Your better off burning gas or diesel. The extra 10-15 mpg's comes at a very high cost.
Geez, THAT'S ALL?! Liz's Festiva managed that...with a carb and no overdrive. A 5-speed Civic HX will top 35 in town. Liz's Metro easily beats it...her WORST tank was more than 45MPG.
That's an unfair comparison.
Festiva, Metro.... these are glamourless cars that do what most people need for a very long time and at minimal cost. They're good at efficiency, but efficiency alone doesn't sell. Who would buy a thing like that? It would be like buying food that's nutritious and doesn't taste like a candy bar.
Festiva, Metro.... these are glamourless cars that do what most people need for a very long time and at minimal cost. They're good at efficiency, but efficiency alone doesn't sell. Who would buy a thing like that? It would be like buying food that's nutritious and doesn't taste like a candy bar.
Bah I rather just drive a 335D or an E320 Bluetec, enjoy mid to low 30's which quite frankly at $3-$4 a gallon is good enough; while driving a powerful luxury car. Unless you drive a ton of miles a year it hardly makes a difference. At 10k miles a year its a couple hundred bucks maybe.
Hybrids are not cheap either, so cross shopping one with a 335D isn't to far off.
Oh and if you do a lot of highway driving I bet the BMW does better mileage at 85mph than a Prius can.
Hybrids are not cheap either, so cross shopping one with a 335D isn't to far off.
Oh and if you do a lot of highway driving I bet the BMW does better mileage at 85mph than a Prius can.
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Originally Posted By: yonyon
Not low speeds, extremely low speeds. Traffic situations where you have to move a maybe 3 or 4 inches slowly over 30 seconds so that the guy in the next lane doesn't cut you off. The first and second generation Prius just plain can't do it. Waiting in line for 15 minutes to get past a traffic light can turn into an hour+ ordeal in these cars.
Are you talking about the line going into the Holland Tunnel from Jersey City?
Not low speeds, extremely low speeds. Traffic situations where you have to move a maybe 3 or 4 inches slowly over 30 seconds so that the guy in the next lane doesn't cut you off. The first and second generation Prius just plain can't do it. Waiting in line for 15 minutes to get past a traffic light can turn into an hour+ ordeal in these cars.
Are you talking about the line going into the Holland Tunnel from Jersey City?
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
The thing about hybrids is that ONLY Toyota has a high loyalty rate (actuall it the Prius) and ONLY Toyota has had their system long enough to be considered reliable, but the media, hybrid and EV proponents hail all hybrids and EVs as proven based on Toyota's system.
Looks like a lot of people bought into this hype and got burned.
If I was buying a hybrid, it would be a Toyota, nothing else.
+1 I agree 100%
The thing about hybrids is that ONLY Toyota has a high loyalty rate (actuall it the Prius) and ONLY Toyota has had their system long enough to be considered reliable, but the media, hybrid and EV proponents hail all hybrids and EVs as proven based on Toyota's system.
Looks like a lot of people bought into this hype and got burned.
If I was buying a hybrid, it would be a Toyota, nothing else.
+1 I agree 100%
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
Bah I rather just drive a 335D or an E320 Bluetec, enjoy mid to low 30's which quite frankly at $3-$4 a gallon is good enough; while driving a powerful luxury car. Unless you drive a ton of miles a year it hardly makes a difference. At 10k miles a year its a couple hundred bucks maybe.
Hybrids are not cheap either, so cross shopping one with a 335D isn't to far off.
Oh and if you do a lot of highway driving I bet the BMW does better mileage at 85mph than a Prius can.
I wouldn't own a modern diesel if you GAVE it to me! Way too much potential for catastrophic failures and huge repair bills! Does the new 335d use the Bosch CP4 series injection pump? (Like new VW, Ford, and Duramax diesels?) If so...it is a ticking bomb, a hand grenade with the pin pulled, a $10,000+ (that's not a typo) repair waiting to happen.
Bah I rather just drive a 335D or an E320 Bluetec, enjoy mid to low 30's which quite frankly at $3-$4 a gallon is good enough; while driving a powerful luxury car. Unless you drive a ton of miles a year it hardly makes a difference. At 10k miles a year its a couple hundred bucks maybe.
Hybrids are not cheap either, so cross shopping one with a 335D isn't to far off.
Oh and if you do a lot of highway driving I bet the BMW does better mileage at 85mph than a Prius can.
I wouldn't own a modern diesel if you GAVE it to me! Way too much potential for catastrophic failures and huge repair bills! Does the new 335d use the Bosch CP4 series injection pump? (Like new VW, Ford, and Duramax diesels?) If so...it is a ticking bomb, a hand grenade with the pin pulled, a $10,000+ (that's not a typo) repair waiting to happen.
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Originally Posted By: Doog
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
The thing about hybrids is that ONLY Toyota has a high loyalty rate (actuall it the Prius) and ONLY Toyota has had their system long enough to be considered reliable, but the media, hybrid and EV proponents hail all hybrids and EVs as proven based on Toyota's system.
Looks like a lot of people bought into this hype and got burned.
If I was buying a hybrid, it would be a Toyota, nothing else.
+1 I agree 100%
Comically enough, Audi has been making Hybrids for a lot longer than Toyota.
Quote:
In 1989, Audi produced its first iteration of the Audi Duo (the Audi C3 100 Avant Duo) experimental vehicle, a plug-in parallel hybrid based on the Audi 100 Avant quattro. This car had a 9.4 kilowatts (12.8 PS; 12.6 bhp) Siemens electric motor which drove the rear roadwheels. A trunk-mounted nickel-cadmium battery supplied energy to the motor that drove the rear wheels. The vehicle's front roadwheels were powered by a 2.3 litre five-cylinder petrol engine with an output of 100 kilowatts (136 PS; 134 bhp). The intent was to produce a vehicle which could operate on the engine in the country, and electric mode in the city. Mode of operation could be selected by the driver. Just ten vehicles are believed to have been made; one drawback was that due to the extra weight of the electric drive, the vehicles were less efficient when running on their engines alone than standard Audi 100s with the same engine.
Two years later, Audi, unveiled the second duo generation, the Audi 100 Duo - likewise based on the Audi 100 Avant quattro. Once again, this featured an electric motor, a 21.3 kilowatts (29.0 PS; 28.6 bhp) three-phase machine, driving the rear roadwheels. This time, however, the rear wheels were additionally powered via the Torsen centre differential from the main engine compartment, which housed a 2.0 litre four-cylinder engine.
Volvo came out with one in 1992.
And of course the Honda Insight was only two years behind the Prius, coming out in 1999.
The third iteration of the Audi Duo (the Duo III) came out in 1997, but sales were horrific (they sold like six according the Wiki) and it was subsequently discontinued.
So it isn't that Toyota is the only one to have their system long enough. With Honda a whopping two years behind them, that hardly puts Toyota at an advantage from an age perspective. IMHO, it is the car and its well marketed "green" image that has put Toyota in the position they are in with the Prius.
Originally Posted By: KrisZ
The thing about hybrids is that ONLY Toyota has a high loyalty rate (actuall it the Prius) and ONLY Toyota has had their system long enough to be considered reliable, but the media, hybrid and EV proponents hail all hybrids and EVs as proven based on Toyota's system.
Looks like a lot of people bought into this hype and got burned.
If I was buying a hybrid, it would be a Toyota, nothing else.
+1 I agree 100%
Comically enough, Audi has been making Hybrids for a lot longer than Toyota.
Quote:
In 1989, Audi produced its first iteration of the Audi Duo (the Audi C3 100 Avant Duo) experimental vehicle, a plug-in parallel hybrid based on the Audi 100 Avant quattro. This car had a 9.4 kilowatts (12.8 PS; 12.6 bhp) Siemens electric motor which drove the rear roadwheels. A trunk-mounted nickel-cadmium battery supplied energy to the motor that drove the rear wheels. The vehicle's front roadwheels were powered by a 2.3 litre five-cylinder petrol engine with an output of 100 kilowatts (136 PS; 134 bhp). The intent was to produce a vehicle which could operate on the engine in the country, and electric mode in the city. Mode of operation could be selected by the driver. Just ten vehicles are believed to have been made; one drawback was that due to the extra weight of the electric drive, the vehicles were less efficient when running on their engines alone than standard Audi 100s with the same engine.
Two years later, Audi, unveiled the second duo generation, the Audi 100 Duo - likewise based on the Audi 100 Avant quattro. Once again, this featured an electric motor, a 21.3 kilowatts (29.0 PS; 28.6 bhp) three-phase machine, driving the rear roadwheels. This time, however, the rear wheels were additionally powered via the Torsen centre differential from the main engine compartment, which housed a 2.0 litre four-cylinder engine.
Volvo came out with one in 1992.
And of course the Honda Insight was only two years behind the Prius, coming out in 1999.
The third iteration of the Audi Duo (the Duo III) came out in 1997, but sales were horrific (they sold like six according the Wiki) and it was subsequently discontinued.
So it isn't that Toyota is the only one to have their system long enough. With Honda a whopping two years behind them, that hardly puts Toyota at an advantage from an age perspective. IMHO, it is the car and its well marketed "green" image that has put Toyota in the position they are in with the Prius.
Originally Posted By: hattaresguy
My friend has a Prius and his around town mileage is about what a VW TDI gets, within a couple. High 30's, into the low 40's.
Oh and what they don't tell you is that to get that Lithium battery in the car is an extremely environmentally damaging process. Your better off burning gas or diesel. The extra 10-15 mpg's comes at a very high cost.
First, you friend doesn't know how to drive. I drive my prius almost only in city and get 50-60 MPG (depending on ambient temps).
Second, regular Prius uses NiMH and not lithium.
Like I said before, your posts bring little to the discussion.
If lithium is so damaging, then I take you use no cell phone or laptop, right?
My friend has a Prius and his around town mileage is about what a VW TDI gets, within a couple. High 30's, into the low 40's.
Oh and what they don't tell you is that to get that Lithium battery in the car is an extremely environmentally damaging process. Your better off burning gas or diesel. The extra 10-15 mpg's comes at a very high cost.
First, you friend doesn't know how to drive. I drive my prius almost only in city and get 50-60 MPG (depending on ambient temps).
Second, regular Prius uses NiMH and not lithium.
Like I said before, your posts bring little to the discussion.
If lithium is so damaging, then I take you use no cell phone or laptop, right?
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
So it isn't that Toyota is the only one to have their system long enough. With Honda a whopping two years behind them, that hardly puts Toyota at an advantage from an age perspective. IMHO, it is the car and its well marketed "green" image that has put Toyota in the position they are in with the Prius.
While I agree that Toyota may not be significantly further ahead in terms of pure age, they are far ahead of anyone else in terms of units sold and reliability - which are the most important aspects to consider.
So it isn't that Toyota is the only one to have their system long enough. With Honda a whopping two years behind them, that hardly puts Toyota at an advantage from an age perspective. IMHO, it is the car and its well marketed "green" image that has put Toyota in the position they are in with the Prius.
While I agree that Toyota may not be significantly further ahead in terms of pure age, they are far ahead of anyone else in terms of units sold and reliability - which are the most important aspects to consider.
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Originally Posted By: The Critic
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
So it isn't that Toyota is the only one to have their system long enough. With Honda a whopping two years behind them, that hardly puts Toyota at an advantage from an age perspective. IMHO, it is the car and its well marketed "green" image that has put Toyota in the position they are in with the Prius.
While I agree that Toyota may not be significantly further ahead in terms of pure age, they are far ahead of anyone else in terms of units sold and reliability - which are the most important aspects to consider.
Units sold, certainly. But Ford's system for example is VERY similar and likely nary identical in durability. Prius sales are not due to the unit's reliability, but more the image that the car projects I fear. Certainly there are those wooed by its mileage (yourself perhaps) but it can not be ignored that the Prius is the quintessential poster child for the "Green" vehicle movement and there are those that feel that driving one means that they are single handedly saving the planet.
Those are the people who don't care if the vehicle is the epitome of reliability or not. They have an image to project!
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
So it isn't that Toyota is the only one to have their system long enough. With Honda a whopping two years behind them, that hardly puts Toyota at an advantage from an age perspective. IMHO, it is the car and its well marketed "green" image that has put Toyota in the position they are in with the Prius.
While I agree that Toyota may not be significantly further ahead in terms of pure age, they are far ahead of anyone else in terms of units sold and reliability - which are the most important aspects to consider.
Units sold, certainly. But Ford's system for example is VERY similar and likely nary identical in durability. Prius sales are not due to the unit's reliability, but more the image that the car projects I fear. Certainly there are those wooed by its mileage (yourself perhaps) but it can not be ignored that the Prius is the quintessential poster child for the "Green" vehicle movement and there are those that feel that driving one means that they are single handedly saving the planet.
Those are the people who don't care if the vehicle is the epitome of reliability or not. They have an image to project!
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Units sold, certainly. But Ford's system for example is VERY similar and likely nary identical in durability. Prius sales are not due to the unit's reliability, but more the image that the car projects I fear. Certainly there are those wooed by its mileage (yourself perhaps) but it can not be ignored that the Prius is the quintessential poster child for the "Green" vehicle movement and there are those that feel that driving one means that they are single handedly saving the planet.
Those are the people who don't care if the vehicle is the epitome of reliability or not. They have an image to project!
Whatever the purchase reason may be, Toyota's system has the number of units sold to back up its durability. Because of the large # of units on the road, it is the better one to own for the ease of parts availability, familiarity with technicians, etc. There's little reason to opt for a Ford hybrid at this point with the hope that it will grow to the scale of Toyota's hybrid population in the near future.
Units sold, certainly. But Ford's system for example is VERY similar and likely nary identical in durability. Prius sales are not due to the unit's reliability, but more the image that the car projects I fear. Certainly there are those wooed by its mileage (yourself perhaps) but it can not be ignored that the Prius is the quintessential poster child for the "Green" vehicle movement and there are those that feel that driving one means that they are single handedly saving the planet.
Those are the people who don't care if the vehicle is the epitome of reliability or not. They have an image to project!
Whatever the purchase reason may be, Toyota's system has the number of units sold to back up its durability. Because of the large # of units on the road, it is the better one to own for the ease of parts availability, familiarity with technicians, etc. There's little reason to opt for a Ford hybrid at this point with the hope that it will grow to the scale of Toyota's hybrid population in the near future.
Originally Posted By: L_Sludger
Originally Posted By: yonyon
Not low speeds, extremely low speeds. Traffic situations where you have to move a maybe 3 or 4 inches slowly over 30 seconds so that the guy in the next lane doesn't cut you off. The first and second generation Prius just plain can't do it. Waiting in line for 15 minutes to get past a traffic light can turn into an hour+ ordeal in these cars.
Are you talking about the line going into the Holland Tunnel from Jersey City?
Not specifically, no. I've never been through the Holland Tunnel during the day, but it wouldn't surprise me to find it gets like that. There are many spots that can't handle the traffic in the morning.
Originally Posted By: yonyon
Not low speeds, extremely low speeds. Traffic situations where you have to move a maybe 3 or 4 inches slowly over 30 seconds so that the guy in the next lane doesn't cut you off. The first and second generation Prius just plain can't do it. Waiting in line for 15 minutes to get past a traffic light can turn into an hour+ ordeal in these cars.
Are you talking about the line going into the Holland Tunnel from Jersey City?
Not specifically, no. I've never been through the Holland Tunnel during the day, but it wouldn't surprise me to find it gets like that. There are many spots that can't handle the traffic in the morning.
Originally Posted By: OVERK1LL
Those are the people who don't care if the vehicle is the epitome of reliability or not. They have an image to project!
Absolutely right. Just look at other hybrid models that Toyota offers, they simply don't sell. That is why Toyota is making the Prius into another car brand. They realized that majority of hybrid car buyers buy them for the green image they projects. A hybrid Camry, that looks identical to a regular one, does not scream "I care about Earth".
I don't care about the green fad, but I do care about reliability. That is why I said that I would consider buying a hybrid from Toyota, which doesn't mean that it would automatically be a Prius. Other hybrid systems, such as Ford may be as reliable, but we simply don’t have enough volume to confirm this.
I’m not saying that even Toyota’s hybrids are proven for the long haul, far from it. With the average age of US car fleet approaching 10 or 11 years there is simply no comparison. Quite frankly I think that hybrids only make sense as a new or fairly new purchase and I think that they will be a nightmare to own for the second or third owner after 10 years. I see this as a deliberate move to make personal transportation unaffordable for majority of the public, but this is another topic altogether.
Those are the people who don't care if the vehicle is the epitome of reliability or not. They have an image to project!
Absolutely right. Just look at other hybrid models that Toyota offers, they simply don't sell. That is why Toyota is making the Prius into another car brand. They realized that majority of hybrid car buyers buy them for the green image they projects. A hybrid Camry, that looks identical to a regular one, does not scream "I care about Earth".
I don't care about the green fad, but I do care about reliability. That is why I said that I would consider buying a hybrid from Toyota, which doesn't mean that it would automatically be a Prius. Other hybrid systems, such as Ford may be as reliable, but we simply don’t have enough volume to confirm this.
I’m not saying that even Toyota’s hybrids are proven for the long haul, far from it. With the average age of US car fleet approaching 10 or 11 years there is simply no comparison. Quite frankly I think that hybrids only make sense as a new or fairly new purchase and I think that they will be a nightmare to own for the second or third owner after 10 years. I see this as a deliberate move to make personal transportation unaffordable for majority of the public, but this is another topic altogether.
a lot of speculation here about what other people are thinking.
I doubt that anyone here knows.
But I have met Prii owners who really do feel they are helping the earth, and that's perfectly fine by me. The free market always sorts this stuff out.
But just like KrisZ above I want to see these cars with 100k or more miles on them. Not just one or two anecdotal references, but a lot so we all can see how 'great' they are.
I doubt that anyone here knows.
But I have met Prii owners who really do feel they are helping the earth, and that's perfectly fine by me. The free market always sorts this stuff out.
But just like KrisZ above I want to see these cars with 100k or more miles on them. Not just one or two anecdotal references, but a lot so we all can see how 'great' they are.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
a lot of speculation here about what other people are thinking.
I doubt that anyone here knows.
But I have met Prii owners who really do feel they are helping the earth, and that's perfectly fine by me. The free market always sorts this stuff out.
But just like KrisZ above I want to see these cars with 100k or more miles on them. Not just one or two anecdotal references, but a lot so we all can see how 'great' they are.
These cars have been around since what, 1997? I'm sure there are thousands out there with well over 100k by now.
a lot of speculation here about what other people are thinking.
I doubt that anyone here knows.
But I have met Prii owners who really do feel they are helping the earth, and that's perfectly fine by me. The free market always sorts this stuff out.
But just like KrisZ above I want to see these cars with 100k or more miles on them. Not just one or two anecdotal references, but a lot so we all can see how 'great' they are.
These cars have been around since what, 1997? I'm sure there are thousands out there with well over 100k by now.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
But just like KrisZ above I want to see these cars with 100k or more miles on them. Not just one or two anecdotal references, but a lot so we all can see how 'great' they are.
You must be kidding, right? Taxi owners racked like 300,000 miles on them, mostly trouble free. Prius taxis are extremely common in Canada and becoming common in Europe. Prius is #1 selling car in Japan. I wonder why? Is this just the tree hugging crowd?
But just like KrisZ above I want to see these cars with 100k or more miles on them. Not just one or two anecdotal references, but a lot so we all can see how 'great' they are.
You must be kidding, right? Taxi owners racked like 300,000 miles on them, mostly trouble free. Prius taxis are extremely common in Canada and becoming common in Europe. Prius is #1 selling car in Japan. I wonder why? Is this just the tree hugging crowd?
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Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
But just like KrisZ above I want to see these cars with 100k or more miles on them. Not just one or two anecdotal references, but a lot so we all can see how 'great' they are.
You must be kidding, right? Taxi owners racked like 300,000 miles on them, mostly trouble free. Prius taxis are extremely common in Canada and becoming common in Europe. Prius is #1 selling car in Japan. I wonder why? Is this just the tree hugging crowd?
Gas is $1.91/L in Japan.
Originally Posted By: SteveSRT8
But just like KrisZ above I want to see these cars with 100k or more miles on them. Not just one or two anecdotal references, but a lot so we all can see how 'great' they are.
You must be kidding, right? Taxi owners racked like 300,000 miles on them, mostly trouble free. Prius taxis are extremely common in Canada and becoming common in Europe. Prius is #1 selling car in Japan. I wonder why? Is this just the tree hugging crowd?
Gas is $1.91/L in Japan.
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