Thanks for going to the trouble of deciphering my post and taking the time to give me such a comprehensive answer.
how to figure out best 2 cycle oil
- Thread starter Jasper8146
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Thanks. So, if I'm understanding correctly, in your experience your equipment generally runs a little perkier on the Amsoil at 80:1 than it does on other oils at the manufacturer's stated ratio (50:1 or 40:1 or whatever), and you're getting excellent durability at the same time?
That's good to hear that you've used Amsoil at 50:1 in a variety of applications with good results.
Originally Posted By: Jasper8146
Thanks. So, if I'm understanding correctly, in your experience your equipment generally runs a little perkier on the Amsoil at 80:1 than it does on other oils at the manufacturer's stated ratio (50:1 or 40:1 or whatever), and you're getting excellent durability at the same time?
Definitely perkier operation and easier starts.
As for durability, only time will tell (this was my first season on Saber Pro). But given the large number of commercial users that have used the product for years in tougher service than anything I can dish up, I'm not too worried.
Thanks. So, if I'm understanding correctly, in your experience your equipment generally runs a little perkier on the Amsoil at 80:1 than it does on other oils at the manufacturer's stated ratio (50:1 or 40:1 or whatever), and you're getting excellent durability at the same time?
Definitely perkier operation and easier starts.
As for durability, only time will tell (this was my first season on Saber Pro). But given the large number of commercial users that have used the product for years in tougher service than anything I can dish up, I'm not too worried.
I use Saber at 40:1 in everything and it's beautiful. No smoke, easy starts, no worries. Sparkplugs look great, teardowns look great. It's some high dollar stuff, but when you consider how little of it you use even to mix a "strong" mix like 40:1, it's really nothing much.
A good oil will note it's specs either on the bottle or on the manufacturer's website, in the product datasheet.
I have hoarded a stash of M1 2T (the stuff johnny talks about above) and I'm saving it for when I finally get my Lawn Boy. That stuff is the gold standard of two cycle oil.
A good oil will note it's specs either on the bottle or on the manufacturer's website, in the product datasheet.
I have hoarded a stash of M1 2T (the stuff johnny talks about above) and I'm saving it for when I finally get my Lawn Boy. That stuff is the gold standard of two cycle oil.
Originally Posted By: greenaccord02
I have hoarded a stash of M1 2T (the stuff johnny talks about above) and I'm saving it for when I finally get my Lawn Boy. That stuff is the gold standard of two cycle oil.
Is it really a lawnboy unless you are puffing blue smoke? It seems UnAmerican to not use 32:1 outboard oil. You keep the bugs down while you cut grass!
Good luck GA!
I have hoarded a stash of M1 2T (the stuff johnny talks about above) and I'm saving it for when I finally get my Lawn Boy. That stuff is the gold standard of two cycle oil.
Is it really a lawnboy unless you are puffing blue smoke? It seems UnAmerican to not use 32:1 outboard oil. You keep the bugs down while you cut grass!
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Originally Posted By: BBDartCA
Early 70's Dirt Bike Magazine did a shoort out. Klotz Supertechniplate won. Still available today as are most the oils in this test report. Maxima 927 would be a good second chice.
A few report too much carbon buildup in a saw with SuperTechniplate. (and most of those were modified saws) but others still swear by it.
Much less carbon with Maxima 927, although a mate is switching to K2.
I believe that in the GP bike world Castrol XR77, (and A747 before it) Elf XTX976 and HTX909, Motul 8002T and possibly Silkolene Pro 2 tended to dominate.
The Europeans do know how to blend a good race oil.
I'm a believer in the syn oils in a saw, a saw runs harder and hotter than a whipper snipper and the syn oils burn cleanly and protect well.
A saw doesn't really need the syn/castor mixes (unless it's a race saw) as they just don't see the revs that most racing two strokes see (and I'm not talking about unloaded 'tuning' revs, actual revs in the cut are usually around the 10,000RPM mark for most saws)
As said, ratios have been done to death on here, but FWIW I would never mix any fuel and oil at 100:1, stick to what the manufacturer recommends, but it has been proven time and again that more oil in the mix = more power and longer life.
Early 70's Dirt Bike Magazine did a shoort out. Klotz Supertechniplate won. Still available today as are most the oils in this test report. Maxima 927 would be a good second chice.
A few report too much carbon buildup in a saw with SuperTechniplate. (and most of those were modified saws) but others still swear by it.
Much less carbon with Maxima 927, although a mate is switching to K2.
I believe that in the GP bike world Castrol XR77, (and A747 before it) Elf XTX976 and HTX909, Motul 8002T and possibly Silkolene Pro 2 tended to dominate.
The Europeans do know how to blend a good race oil.
I'm a believer in the syn oils in a saw, a saw runs harder and hotter than a whipper snipper and the syn oils burn cleanly and protect well.
A saw doesn't really need the syn/castor mixes (unless it's a race saw) as they just don't see the revs that most racing two strokes see (and I'm not talking about unloaded 'tuning' revs, actual revs in the cut are usually around the 10,000RPM mark for most saws)
As said, ratios have been done to death on here, but FWIW I would never mix any fuel and oil at 100:1, stick to what the manufacturer recommends, but it has been proven time and again that more oil in the mix = more power and longer life.
I undestand this is an older post, but would like to touch on the mix ratios in in case some people don't fully understand what is happening when you add more oil...ie, 32:1 over 50:1.
When you use more oil, the fuel mixture becomes more lean...keep this in mind. You may need to richen the carb slightly to offset this.
Don't take your 32:1 motor and go to 80:1 and go by throttle response etc to judge the comparison.
This is how I understand this, by all means, correct me if i'm wrong....I enjoy learning also.
When you use more oil, the fuel mixture becomes more lean...keep this in mind. You may need to richen the carb slightly to offset this.
Don't take your 32:1 motor and go to 80:1 and go by throttle response etc to judge the comparison.
This is how I understand this, by all means, correct me if i'm wrong....I enjoy learning also.
Does it not replace the fuel per volume with oil creating a lean condition?
Not saying it will cause damage due to improper lubrication, just possibly a loss of power if the carb is not adjusted.
I don't know for sure if this is true..trying to confirm thi s myself. I only use 50:1 so it's not an issue for me.
Not saying it will cause damage due to improper lubrication, just possibly a loss of power if the carb is not adjusted.
I don't know for sure if this is true..trying to confirm thi s myself. I only use 50:1 so it's not an issue for me.
oh the more oil you put in the gas the lesser the rpms, more smoke, can even clog muffler thus making rpms way low, but ive always looked at it this way....the more oil in the gas, the richer the mixture. On a side note all my 2cycles are 50:1, except a cheap blower i have that is 40:1, yet i still put 50:1 in it and it does fine
Originally Posted By: kcfx4
but ive always looked at it this way....the more oil in the gas, the richer the mixture.
I believe it's just the opposite, richer in oil content but leaner in relation to fuel/air.
When you have a 50:1 mix and it's on the cusp of running too lean, by changing to 40 or 32:1 you are going to possibly damage the motor from running too lean with no change in carb settings.
but ive always looked at it this way....the more oil in the gas, the richer the mixture.
I believe it's just the opposite, richer in oil content but leaner in relation to fuel/air.
When you have a 50:1 mix and it's on the cusp of running too lean, by changing to 40 or 32:1 you are going to possibly damage the motor from running too lean with no change in carb settings.
i6pwr is correct.
The higher the oil:fuel ratio, the lower the fuel:air ratio thus creating a lean condition.
However, the amount of oil required to create a lean condition severe enough to cause engine damage due to lean fuel to air ratio will likely cause poor engine performance and excessive smoke before anything serious happens.
From what I've read, the magic number for maximum power and engine durability is 32:1. I run most of my air cooled stuff around 32 to 40:1 even in machines that call for 50:1. Machines run great and I have yet to see a noticeable change in performance either way.
I definitely do not believe in ridiculous ratios of 80:1 or 100:1 for air cooled engines regardless of what the oil company promises. Remember, that little bit of oil is all the engine has to keep all of it's components lubricated.
The higher the oil:fuel ratio, the lower the fuel:air ratio thus creating a lean condition.
However, the amount of oil required to create a lean condition severe enough to cause engine damage due to lean fuel to air ratio will likely cause poor engine performance and excessive smoke before anything serious happens.
From what I've read, the magic number for maximum power and engine durability is 32:1. I run most of my air cooled stuff around 32 to 40:1 even in machines that call for 50:1. Machines run great and I have yet to see a noticeable change in performance either way.
I definitely do not believe in ridiculous ratios of 80:1 or 100:1 for air cooled engines regardless of what the oil company promises. Remember, that little bit of oil is all the engine has to keep all of it's components lubricated.
Originally Posted By: kcfx4
you running 32:1 in a modern echo? you still have the spark arrestor aka piece of screen on the muffler?
Yes to all of the above.
I run one mix for pretty much everything. My Echo trimmer, Echo Shred N' Vac, Echo CS 346 chain saw and Echo two cycle lawn mower all use it. My Jonsereds saws get it, my Toro Power shovel gets it, my Shindaiwa powered water pump, Techumseh two stroke ice auger, Stihl brush cutter, Lawn Boy mower all run on 32:1 and like it. Had to remove the screen on the Stihl brush cutter but it's 27 years old. Everything air cooled gets 32:1.
you running 32:1 in a modern echo? you still have the spark arrestor aka piece of screen on the muffler?
Yes to all of the above.
I run one mix for pretty much everything. My Echo trimmer, Echo Shred N' Vac, Echo CS 346 chain saw and Echo two cycle lawn mower all use it. My Jonsereds saws get it, my Toro Power shovel gets it, my Shindaiwa powered water pump, Techumseh two stroke ice auger, Stihl brush cutter, Lawn Boy mower all run on 32:1 and like it. Had to remove the screen on the Stihl brush cutter but it's 27 years old. Everything air cooled gets 32:1.
Originally Posted By: kcfx4
all my stuff gets 50:1, when i worked @ dealer, i saw ALOT of echos come back, simple reason, clogged screen on muffler, im suprised it hasnt been an issue
Good oil and max rpms likely contribute to clean exhaust gases.
Most people don't understand that two cycle OPE engines should be run wide open. That's where they're at their best.
all my stuff gets 50:1, when i worked @ dealer, i saw ALOT of echos come back, simple reason, clogged screen on muffler, im suprised it hasnt been an issue
Good oil and max rpms likely contribute to clean exhaust gases.
Most people don't understand that two cycle OPE engines should be run wide open. That's where they're at their best.
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