Hint at What Caused the Financial Meltdown

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Originally Posted By: Tempest
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lying about the income of those who wish to buy subsidized goods

Please define.


It has been documented in article after article the fraud which took place by bankers and their loan examiners through either altering income records directly, or explicitly encouraging the loan applicants to inflate their incomes. This was widespread for several years leading up to the meltdown, and everyone in the industry at least knew about it, assuming they weren't the ones actually being pressured to lie. The loan examiners that wouldn't falsify the applications were blacklisted.
 
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It seems like some of those who ended up with the bacon are your heralded upper tier nobility.

Again, I would love to name the real names, but there is too much P in the answer for the Mods.
The names are NOT in the public sector.



Hmmm..well all those exec's in the failed financials sure seemed to walk away with bumper crops from the harvest, pal.

Aren't they your icons of commerce?


Now since you need to know where truly rich people get their money ..it's simple. They inherit it and get it handed to them from their counter parts of The League of Distinguished Gentlemen. We've been here before pal. You just like to take us on a trip away for the issue/direction of the thread.

You sit on a board of directors ..and your pals approve your compensation package. You are a major block owner on boards that they reside on ..and you put your proxy in to approve their outlandish compensation package.

See how easy it is to construct a power core of handwashing and back scratching? It's simple enough for a buffoon like myself. Surely someone of your caliber has no trouble seeing it.

Now the sweat and toil millionaire? They don't need tax breaks ..they legally embezzle more "utility" out of their company for most of their income needs. When I was netting $65k after subcontracts 1980-81 (that's a WHOLE LOT in Lorne Greene Alpo 2008 dollars, pal) ..I got forgiven for my state tax due to too low an income ..and all of it 100% legal.

You've got a society. You have a nation. You've got to make participation pay for everyone in terms of a net gain to the society/nation. If it's not, then you're assured to have ever increasing numbers of losers. Luckily, in some views, we happen to have an ample supply of losers that are totally helpless to get out of the box that's been constructed for them. In this case, the recipients just happen to fit the demand for losers.

Again, make them all Einsteins .....they would still be losers ..just smarter losers.
 
No one's explained to me how to use all these tricky loopholes. When's the next one of these League of Distinguished Gentlemen meetings?
frown.gif
 
Originally Posted By: TooManyWheels
Originally Posted By: Tempest
Quote:
lying about the income of those who wish to buy subsidized goods

Please define.


It has been documented in article after article the fraud which took place by bankers and their loan examiners through either altering income records directly, or explicitly encouraging the loan applicants to inflate their incomes. This was widespread for several years leading up to the meltdown, and everyone in the industry at least knew about it, assuming they weren't the ones actually being pressured to lie. The loan examiners that wouldn't falsify the applications were blacklisted.

You might want to look into the methods and threats (including the justice department) used by Big G against banks that did not conform with standing policy to give homes away to those that could not afford it.
Also the histories of those in charge of Fanny and Freddy.

In any event, if the Government did not aggressively go after sub prime loans and have the instruments to do it (Fanny and Freddie), this would not have happened as banks would have no interest in writing bad loans.
What was the percentage of loans that had fraudulent income statements?
 
Originally Posted By: BrianWC
No one's explained to me how to use all these tricky loopholes. When's the next one of these League of Distinguished Gentlemen meetings?
frown.gif



You're not invited. You have to either be born into it or marry into it. It's sorta like royalty used to do ..where blood lines gave you station, but it's more like mergers and acquisitions and alignment of mutual interests.

Not much removed from Jethro and Nell getting 40 head and 100 acres of the southern meadow when they got married. You just get commoners to provide the dowry and continued tribute.
 
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When's the next one of these League of Distinguished Gentlemen meetings?

Here is the address:

E Capitol St NE & 1st St NE
Washington, DC 20001
 
Originally Posted By: Tempest

What was the percentage of loans that had fraudulent income statements?


You have a $700 billion and counting financial problem, with perhaps $200 million of actual mortgages involved. You can assume those were 100% falsified if you wish, but that still leaves $500 million-plus that were derivatives. Derivatives are the cause of the problem, not the sub-prime lending.
 
Originally Posted By: Tempest
Quote:
Now since you need to know where truly rich people get their money ..it's simple. They inherit it and get it handed to them from their counter parts of The League of Distinguished Gentlemen.

Patently false:
http://mjperry.blogspot.com/2008/04/inheritance-is-not-main-driver-of.html


Misleading at best. It's totally in line with my League of Distinguished Gentlemen example. They merely construct their own power core around money. Those alliances are formed by association of like station. Sure you get "more" in numbers. Don't the Amish have to find new land so that Amos can have his own farm?? You can't reach into your own stash ..especially when you don't have to.

There's a whole advanced "support group" for them. How hard is this to figure out? Now if the problem is admitting it ..then I can see the issue here ..but the fundamental premise is pretty hard to be "unaware" of if you're truly savvy. Again, an idiot like me can see it plain as day
55.gif
 
What do you think the derivatives were based on? Huge amounts of package bad mortagages that were sold as AAA because there was very little required reporting requirements at Fanny and Freddie.

Former head of Fanny said something along the lines that these are some of the safest investments out there...right before he was forced out miss repressenting the proper value of the holding and VERY poor accounting practices.
He and his other friends there got their $100 million in bonuses for doing a great job and "excellent leadership" before exiting of course.
 
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Misleading at best.

crackmeup2.gif
How about this then:
http://books.google.com/books?id=5dAtJf1...num=2&ct=result
and just found this little tid bit:
http://www.ncpa.org/pub/st/st289/st289g.html
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Don't the Amish have to find new land so that Amos can have his own farm??

So you are saying that the wealthy are all actually in a huge, totally secret, socialist collective that recruit "favorable" people to join them?
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There's a whole advanced "support group" for them.

There is that huge secret group again...
Let me guess....the Mason's?
 
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Nothing secret about it. It's as simple as looking no further than The Hill School right across the street from me. They're mostly children of wealthy people being groomed for future placement.

What's so mysterious about that??
 
Well, but really. How are the mega rich any different than anyone else in that they run in circles of people like themselves? Are they supposed to dress in sackcloth and ashes?
 
Originally Posted By: Tempest
What do you think the derivatives were based on? Huge amounts of package bad mortagages that were sold as AAA because there was very little required reporting requirements at Fanny and Freddie.

Former head of Fanny said something along the lines that these are some of the safest investments out there...right before he was forced out miss repressenting the proper value of the holding and VERY poor accounting practices.
He and his other friends there got their $100 million in bonuses for doing a great job and "excellent leadership" before exiting of course.


I agree completely. The problem was bad documentation and fraudulant activity all the way around, but not the fact that the mortgages themselves were subsidized.
 
Originally Posted By: BrianWC
Well, but really. How are the mega rich any different than anyone else in that they run in circles of people like themselves? Are they supposed to dress in sackcloth and ashes?


The point is that there is an elitest mentality that is deliberately perpetuated, designed to maintain/perpetuate the existing power structure and class distinctions. Philosophical questions about alternate power structures which might better serve society are not part of the equation.
 
Originally Posted By: BrianWC
Well, but really. How are the mega rich any different than anyone else in that they run in circles of people like themselves? Are they supposed to dress in sackcloth and ashes?


People often think that I "hate" wealth. Nothing could be further from the truth. I hope that anyone makes as much as they can. Really.

It's another thing to rig your own game and have others suffer from it. Lack of socially ethical behavior is JUST as much of a character defect if you're a millionaire or a group of millionaires. It's just as antisocial and just as morally corrupt/bankrupt.



You're in a fishbowl, pal.

Let me see if I can get a glimmer of realization here. Do you like the way our society is evolving/devolving? Who is the most influential in forming the absolute basement on where our society shall reside in terms of resources? Do you see a spire forming and continuing to climb while the rest of your surroundings crumble and decay?

Who ultimately called those shots? The beneficiaries of the evolutions/devolutions.
 
Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Lack of socially ethical behavior is JUST as much of a character defect if you're a millionaire or a group of millionaires. It's just as antisocial and just as morally corrupt/bankrupt.


Noblesse oblige. Then there is greed.
 
Originally Posted By: Gary Allan
Nothing secret about it. It's as simple as looking no further than The Hill School right across the street from me. They're mostly children of wealthy people being groomed for future placement.

What's so mysterious about that??

I send my son to a private school at great cost to me. It is one of the best in the valley. I make ~40K a year. Am I one of those rich "grooming the next generation?
Sending your children to public education is no doubt a better option...
 
Originally Posted By: TooManyWheels
Originally Posted By: Tempest
What do you think the derivatives were based on? Huge amounts of package bad mortagages that were sold as AAA because there was very little required reporting requirements at Fanny and Freddie.

Former head of Fanny said something along the lines that these are some of the safest investments out there...right before he was forced out miss repressenting the proper value of the holding and VERY poor accounting practices.
He and his other friends there got their $100 million in bonuses for doing a great job and "excellent leadership" before exiting of course.


I agree completely. The problem was bad documentation and fraudulant activity all the way around, but not the fact that the mortgages themselves were subsidized.

Oh but it is!
The subsides (sub prime mortgages) brought in new buyers to the market. This has an inflationary effect...known as the housing boom or bubble. Once the defaults started, the bubble burst which lowered housing values dramatically.
Giving loans to people that could not afford it and the resulting property devaluation due to high amounts of defaults is what has devalued all of these bank's holdings (and those derivatives based on them) and made them broke.
Add in the Mark to Market accounting and you have the mess that we have now.

All because Big G wanted to buy votes.
 
Originally Posted By: TooManyWheels
Originally Posted By: BrianWC
Well, but really. How are the mega rich any different than anyone else in that they run in circles of people like themselves? Are they supposed to dress in sackcloth and ashes?


The point is that there is an elitest mentality that is deliberately perpetuated, designed to maintain/perpetuate the existing power structure and class distinctions. Philosophical questions about alternate power structures which might better serve society are not part of the equation.

I suggest that you read the links that I have provided in this thread.
 
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