Here ye, Here ye, Pennzoil causes sludge!

[Blue99]

quote:

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I wonder why that would be?

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To answer your question, the frying pan experiment is just demonstrating that some additive in the oil, possibly a friction modifier, is reacting with heat and becoming dark.

SA grade oils, without additives, do produce sludge rather quickly in the Sequence VG sludge & varnish test.

If Pennzoil turns black in the frying pan & and an SA oil doesn't, this kinda explains why ILSAC & API don't base the certification on frying pan tests!

 

[mossad]

Hey, watch it, or you'll get a frying pan across your head!! LOL

I was just bringing that crap up because this kid at Advance told me about it. I just thought it was funny they did a test like that

 

[ToyotaNSaturn]

quote:

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Gee I don't know. Maybe to see which oil would go best with your ham and eggs.

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I wonder if shop teachers and auto school trainers use the same method to test which gasoline turns black the quickest?

 

[Gary in Sandy Eggo]

I would think that looking inside the oil filler hole and seeing "bright as new" metal parts is an indication of a clean engine. After 110K miles on Pennzoil 10w30 for 50K miles, then SAE-30 for the rest, all changed at 6-month intervals (6-7.5K miles), spring and fall, the guts that I can see through that hole are bright. Am I missing something here?

Regards, Gary in Sandy Eggo

 

[SKUNKY]

I use Pennzoil on my salads and I also get a lot of sludge ...

 

[Mystic]

I have said this before and I will say it again. Pennzoil is probably still the best selling motor oil in the United States. I think the reason why some mechanics notice sludge in engines where Pennzoil had been used is just because of the large numbers of cars and trucks that use Pennzoil. If some other brand of motor oil was as commonplace as Pennzoil they would be noticing sludge in the engines of vehicles using that brand of oil. The mechanics notice some sludge in a few cas and trucks, ask what oil was used (odds are good that Pennzoil was used just because of the fact that Pennzoil is so common) and soon word gets spread by the mechanics that people should not use Pennzoil because it causes sludge. The mechanics don't notice the cars and trucks where there is sludge where some other brand of oil is used that is much less commonplace.

In addition there may have been some problems with sludge formation in engines where Pennzoil was used long ago in the past. If so, that is history. If Pennzoil really was a bad motor oil it would be well known, since Pennzoil is so commonplace. Any major brand of oil is probably of reasonable quality unless there is just a case of a bad batch.

For sure some bad motor oil can still be found. Don't put SA or SB rated motor oil in a modern engine.And I think it is a good idea to stay aay from oil supplements that may cause problems except for a few that most here can agree seem to work, such as Auto-Rx or LC.

 

[mossad]

I was at Advance Auto and the sales rep told me when they were at automotive school, they had frying pans set out and place a drop of different brands of conventional oil in each, and the Pennzoil turned black the quickest.
I wonder why that would be?

 

[Johnny]

Gee I don't know. Maybe to see which oil would go best with your ham and eggs. GIVE ME A BREAK

 

[buster]

This thread is ridiculous and should be locked IMO.

 

[sprintman]

You nailed it!

 

[kingrob]

I hate to ressurect "The Thread That Wouldn't Die!", but I have to chime in on this.

Quaker State lost me in the seventies because their oil sludged up pretty badly. It wasn't engine design, it was the oil 'cause EVERYBODY'S ENGINE gunked up.

So I switched to Pennzoil in the early eighties and though I never experienced any problems before, For some reason the inside of my I6 Maxima engine was severely sludged after only a couple of years. I switched to Havoline and everything was OK afterwards.

So basically QS and Pennzoil both lost me forever, and yes I understand that the oil of then and now are two completely different monsters but it is true that Pennzoil at one time caused sludge buid up.

 

[Sandlot]

Having personally torn down three engines run solely on Pennzoil Conventional 5w30 I can testify to the fact that there was not only no top end sludge, the bottom end (main bearing and crank) looked nearly new at 161K ('99 2.3l), 307k ('88 1.5l), and 330k ('91 1.6l). All Honda 4 cyl engines.

I am not a Pennzoil advocate and no longer use it in my main vehicle. I am simply relating my experiences.

 

[JungleJim]

My '87 VW has been run exclusively on Pennzoil. It currently has 214,000 trouble-free miles. The first 86,000 on 5w30 when my father owned it, then on 15w40 since I've owned it (recommended weight by VW).

If it has sludge in it, then the engine sure loves it!

 

[sgtgeek]

Todays Pennzoil does not cause sludge in modern engines.

 

[BigAl]

When this thread hits 100 posts, we should tear it down and check for unusual deposits.

 

[BigOil]

"QS and Pennzoil both lost me forever" ... A testimony to the strenght of a BRAND (not a company) in the eyes of a consumer. I feel the same way about a certain automobile company (LOL)...

FWIW:
There are NO Pennzoil plants or Pennzoil-created formulations anymore, no Quaker State plants or Quaker-created formulations. It is all done by Shell Oil Products U.S. ("SOPUS" on back labels), part of the Royal Dutch Shell Group. It's really just Shell oil that was formulated and marketed consistent with what they view as the brand's heritage and positioning. Yeah, they have some old PQS employees around I'd bet, but Shell "drives the bus". Not that that is bad at all...heck it might even be better.

The SOPUS oils are likley fine products...as stated, now has virually zero to do with the past.

 

[beanoil]

Guess I'll keep the thread alive too. My friend at work will not use Valvoline because he found sludge under the valve cover of his Turbo Supra. No surprise there for me, I feel that a turbo'ed vehicle needs better than ValvoAC. OTOH, my Dad was a strict ValvoAC fan, and had like new rockers and valvetrain area in a '67 Fairlane with 80,000 miles on it way back when I was just learning about cars. Pop, (grandpa) was a Pennzoil fan, and had a well running 62 Dart with the push button slushbox to prove it. Obviously that caused some serious conversations between Pop and the "punk" Mom married. Guess I got an early start for oil from the gene pool! Point is, Pennzoil was certainly fine for some applications, just as Valvo, Royal Triton (the original purple oil!), or Havoiline (with Furfural!) was fine also. But even today, there are oils that can sludge under the right conditions and the names are not limited to Pennzoil. Maybe it is time to move on.....

 

[BigAl]

Shell had problems with their Fire and Ice motor oils a bunch of years back. Does this mean that Pennzoil and Quaker State are now made even worse by their association with SOPUS?

Oh no!

 

[John_E]

Hey BigAl, were the Shell F&I problems restricted to 10W-40? In the late 1970s, almost everyone's 10w40 conventional either sheared out of grade or sludged, to the extent that many automakers told their customers to avoid all 10W-40 motor oils.

 

[BigAl]

I don't remember the exact problem. I think happened was in 1979, when I was still in college. I do recall that at the time I was using it regularly and then stopped.