good replacement media for Fram F4/C4 filter?

[toolboy62]

Hi,

subject says all... I have an old 55 Stude in which I've put a '63 engine with a full flow filter... just bought a CM full flow for it but was thinking of adding a bypass as well... rather than going with Amsoil or Frantz I was thinking it would look better to use a stock style oil filter that would have come on the original '55 which was a Fram F4 (uses C4 cartridge.) However all of the cartridges I've seen for these housings look like the same media used in modern full flow filters. Does anyone sell a good low micron cartridge for this old housing?

thanks

Nate

 

[Gary Allan]

Well, you're going for the look here. You should be able to adapt the canister to work with a tp roll. The cartridges appear to be 5" in height and 4" in diameter. I the standard roll is 4.5"X4.5" ..so the side port may be above the top of the tp roll when inserted into the canister. I think the 4.5" diameter won't be a problem requiring unraveling of the roll. All you would need to do (if this is the case) is get an insert to fit into the center tube of the tp roll while fitting the center bolt through it. Not a "on the shelf" item, but I don't think it would require too much tinkering to make it up.

 

[toolboy62]

I am somewhat going for the look, but also the F4 fits right on (if I backdate to the '55 oil filler stack it has the mounts for it) and I can get one for free or darn near to it from someone parting out an older car. As opposed to $200 for a Frantz... Stude owners are notoriously chea^H^H^H^Hfrugal and I tend to fit that stereotype Also I remember seeing in the factory parts catalog that at least at one time a depth type media cartridge was available right from your local Stude dealer, of course they haven't been used since 1956... (went to Wix 51050 type spin on in 1957)

I did go to the Wix web site and look up the filter medias for both the C4 equivalent and the 51050 and they are both cellulose, and have a "nominal" rating of 10 microns... probably good enough for normal service if using alone, but I don't see the point if I'm already running a CM on the full flow adapter.

I suppose a Frantz would also provide a vintage, if aftermarket look, but like I said, that's a lot more money...

nate

 

[Gary Allan]

Well, just use the OEM looking canister and adapt it to TP. Shouldn't be too hard. Then you get the best of both worlds ..on the cheap.

 

[toolboy62]

I might...

one more thought, do any of the new bypass spin ons use a 5/8-18 thread and 2.834/2.462 base gasket? (equivalent form factor to the old Wix 51050) in that case I could just use a 57-up factory bypass filter mount with a modern bypass element (Amsoil EaBP?)

nate

 

[Gary Allan]

All the EaBP use 1-16 thread. The new one, the EaBP-120 uses a 1 1/2-(I think) 16 thread. So they're out. There are bypass spin-on filters in that thread, but they appear to be of the 10um nominal rating. If you were writing off the OEM style canister, I'd consider a BP80-A (BP80A-EA)with an EaBP-90 filter. You're into somewhere around $55 plus your connections ..

These are the Donaldson versions of the 51050/51051/51704. I unsure how accurate the nominal ratings are. By that I mean that they may be subjected to the same single pass protocol that full flow filters are. Given the lower "in use" flow rate ..this may be better or worse

Item Number Item Description Attribute Description Attribute Value


P550050

SPIN-ON LUBE FILTER

A - OD (Inches) 3.81
B - Thread Size (Inches) 5/8 - 18 UNF-2B
C - Length (Inches) 5.22
D - Gasket OD (Inches) 2.82
E - Gasket ID (Inches) 2.42
Product Type Description LUBE SPIN-ON BYPASS
Primary Application CAT, AMC, MF, ALLIS 74512207


P550154

LUBE SPIN-ON

A - OD (Inches) 3.73
B - Thread Size (Inches) 5/8" - 18
C - Length (Inches) 4.31
D - Gasket OD (Inches) 2.83
E - Gasket ID (Inches) 2.46
Product Type Description LUBE SPIN-ON BYPASS
Primary Application IHC 538836R1






P553404

SPIN-ON LUBE FILTER

A - OD (Inches) 3.81
B - Thread Size (Inches) 5/8" - 18
C - Length (Inches) 7.91
D - Gasket OD (Inches) 2.82
E - Gasket ID (Inches) 2.42
Product Type Description LUBE SPIN-ON BYPASS
Primary Application CARRIER TRANSICOLD 30.00304.00

 

[toolboy62]

Thanks Gary... you don't happen to know the gasket size of the EaBP do you? 5/8" to 1" is a *large* enough difference that a simple bushing could suffice.

Actually after looking, the Amsoil mount looks similar enough to the old factory mount that if the bushing idea didn't work, that it still wouldn't look horribly out of place. (the factory one bolts "upside down" to the oil filler stack with a short pressure hose off the driver's side head, and a short return hose into a boss in the stack.)

nate

 

[Gary Allan]

The EaBP gaskets fall into the 2.8/2.4 commonality of most spin-on filters. You should have no problem if you find a bushing of that thread internal and external. There is no off the shelf bushing available in my searches in distant BITOG history. A 1-16 die was a rare item ..and tube stock of the right ID/OD was not common either.

Now a guy on ebay tmvtaylor (iirc ..maybe tvmtaylor) sells a 3/4-16 to 5/8-18 bushing ..and also sells a 3/4-16 (internal) and 1-16 external adapter or go over a standard Permacool (or other) threaded insert.

 

[toolboy62]

I missed that... you are correct, 1-16 is not a UNC or UNF thread. I was fixating on the 5/8-18 which is in fact UNF and didn't look at the 1-16 (UNF would be 1-12.) I'll have to poke around and see if I can find that bushing. No big deal as I ASSume that the CM full flow will provide "adequate" protection, I was just kind of thinking out loud to see if there was any easy way I could put together an "ultimate filtration" system out of stuff that I had on the shelf. Thanks again for the help (I wish Amsoil had the size specs on their web site so I didn't have to ask dumb questions, but then again, how many people likely have old bypass filter bases sitting in their junk box?)

nate

 

[Gary Allan]

Here's the EaO filter spec's (I think you can download this)

https://www.amsoil.com/lit/g3000/2008/sections/AMSOILEaProductNumericalListing.pdf

The EaBp filters, with the exception of the new EaBp-120, conform to the Cummins full flow w/ the 1-16 thread.

Currently the vast majority of spin-on filters use a 2.8/2.4 gasket ..hydraulics even ..

 

[morris]

moe in wichita ks is a c3 shorter? if it is you might be able to make a spacer to make up the difference. what think?