GM to use Tesla Supercharger Network?

Smart move by both GM and Ford. The cost to them to adopt Tesla's standard is negligible and the selling point for them, even while acknowledging Tesla is huge.

I have been saying for a long time that part of Elon's Plan For World Domination is for all EV manufacturers to adopt his standards and eventually buy or license batteries and software like FSD and the programming that controls the critical operation of an EV from Tesla.

This is what happens when automakers besides Tesla wait a decade or more before getting serious about manufacturing and selling EV's. And recent news reports about recalls of Ford EV's and poor sales figures for the Mach E continue to reinforce my opinion that they will struggle to fund EV development. GM ? We'll see. But at least Mary Barra seems to have some foresight.
 
DwightFrye said:
Smart move by both GM and Ford. The cost to them to adopt Tesla's standard is negligible and the selling point for them, even while acknowledging Tesla is huge.

I have been saying for a long time that part of Elon's Plan For World Domination is for all EV manufacturers to adopt his standards and eventually buy or license batteries and software like FSD and the programming that controls the critical operation of an EV from Tesla.

This is what happens when automakers besides Tesla wait a decade or more before getting serious about manufacturing and selling EV's. And recent news reports about recalls of Ford EV's and poor sales figures for the Mach E continue to reinforce my opinion that they will struggle to fund EV development. GM ? We'll see. But at least Mary Barra seems to have some foresight.
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Smart or desperate? Smart for Tesla, GM and Ford, more like desperate.

Cost? I doubt Musk let them use his network for free... Tesla ain't a charity.
 
A group of us having been calling out this ace in the hole for years while many have downplayed it or tried to pretend it simply doesn't exist repeating the fantasy that the "big boys" are going to somehow close a 12 year multi billion dollar infrastructure and technology gap, or that third parties are going to someohow make it all work.
 
Other charging stations won’t disappear, they’ll just add NACS cables. Like ABB just announced.

The reliability probably won’t go up massively with non-Tesla vehicles at Supercharger stations for a while.

Lots of problems with Hyundai/Kia cars at Supercharger stations using the Magic Dock already. Tesla and Hyundai are working together now to try to get it fixed.


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97prizm said:
It's unfortunate though. While yes Tesla has a large charging network 800v three phase is what everyone should be pushing for. Porsche and others are going this route.
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Why push for a standard that's both harder to implement and hasn't delivered on its promises?
E365 said:
Other charging stations won’t disappear, they’ll just add NACS cables. Like ABB just announced.

The reliability probably won’t go up massively with non-Tesla vehicles at Supercharger stations for a while.

Lots of problems with Hyundai/Kia cars at Supercharger stations using the Magic Dock already. Tesla and Hyundai are working together now to try to get it fixed.


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And just like that there is now a real standard the American brands are united in.

This instantaneously made both Ford and GM Ev's a LOT more desirable overnight.

This changed the EV landscape overnight.

Telsa car owners may be remiss, but this was a 4 aces hand by Tesla HQ and rewrote the rules overnight.

 
UncleDave said:
Why push for a standard that's both harder to implement and hasn't delivered on its promises?


And just like that there is now a real standard the American brands are united in.

This instantaneously made both Ford and GM Ev's a LOT more desirable overnight.

This changed the EV landscape overnight.

Telsa car owners may be remiss, but this was a 4 aces hand by Tesla HQ and rewrote the rules overnight.

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Engineers have already showed why an 800v three-phase charging architecture is superior to Teslas 400v systems. 800v is still new. Carburetors were the dominant fuel delivery as fuel injection and then direct injection. Your attitude more or less says "why develop a better system ". Fuel injection then direct injection have allowed for manufacturers to offer higher performance vehicles with substantially lower emissions. Tesla has the most charging stations but it doesn't mean that you can't continue to innovate.
 
97prizm said:
Engineers have already showed why an 800v three-phase charging architecture is superior to Teslas 400v systems. 800v is still new. Carburetors were the dominant fuel delivery as fuel injection and then direct injection. Your attitude more or less says "why develop a better system ". Fuel injection then direct injection have allowed for manufacturers to offer higher performance vehicles with substantially lower emissions. Tesla has the most charging stations but it doesn't mean that you can't continue to innovate.
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Real world data and testing shows that it is not superior in automotive applications and in fact posts slower overall trip times than the 400 volt cars.

My attitude is I believe in continual development but a practical standard exists today that is a good balance of cost performance and implementability and has been proven over a decade.

Engineers have shown where 800V COULD be superior, but is it, and under what conditions?

800V becomes a downside in home charging application where expensive stop up circuitry and charger cost become prohibitive.
We can talk eth tacan as another example where an early decision to spend less on an onboard charger caused big problem later.
 
Patent free doesn't mean you can use it for free if they are the only one with the components. However having more choices is always good.

I've worked with "industrial standard" before and it seems like standards are always behind because nobody wants one guy to have all the patents and then suddenly want to charge an arm and a leg for it, or drove every other companies out of business so you have no choice but to use them in the next 20 years.

Tesla, being the only company to get near unlimited capital, is smart to do its own thing and build something much faster than a standard. This way they can just update it fast and around their cars, instead of a compromise among ALL cars. This is the way to go in the low interest rate era, this is also how Apple use their own standard to get ahead of industrial standard.
 
E365 said:
Hummer / Silverado / Sierra EV drivers probably still going to have to rely on EA/EVGo/Chargepoint for a while I’d assume to get maximum charging speeds. At least until actual V4 Superchargers are common. V3 can’t do the 800v / 350kw charging that Ultium trucks can handle.
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Was just listening to the latest InsideEVs podcast. Sounds like there may be an internal configuration change that would allow V3 super chargers to do 800v. I wonder if they’ll start doing that to prep for Cybertruck anyway, before V4s are commonplace.
 
loneryder said:
I don't know how fast the Ford and GM EV's will sell, but can Tesla build them faster than that?
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My understanding is, Tesla adds Superchargers based on demand. Demand is based on sales, of course, and where registrations are. Generally right off freeways because that's where they are needed. The vast majority of owners charge at home. Those who think they can live on Supercharging often regret their purchase. That's the #1 reason for going back to ICE.

Also, in comparison to the 4M Teslas on the road, the other brand EVs are kinda small. But yeah, Tesla needs to keep up. There are areas with tons of Superchargers but many more areas are lacking.

Supercharger Map.
Tesla knows what they are doing.
 
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E365 said:
Was just listening to the latest InsideEVs podcast. Sounds like there may be an internal configuration change that would allow V3 super chargers to do 800v. I wonder if they’ll start doing that to prep for Cybertruck anyway, before V4s are commonplace.
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Yes, and V4's are even easier to juice up.

The port and connector is good for up to 1 MW.

800's should be built to accommodate truck and larger battery vehicles, but they should be deigned as pull throughs so you dont have to disconnect a trailer.
 
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