GDI Engines

[vo_marz]

Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Weird, feels like every subforum has a GDI thread?





I'm with others here, when the issues stop popping up on forums like this I will buy the new design.


X 2

no one wants to be a guniea pig for a new unproven design imho

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: vo_marz
Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
Originally Posted By: friendly_jacek
Weird, feels like every subforum has a GDI thread?





I'm with others here, when the issues stop popping up on forums like this I will buy the new design.


X 2

no one wants to be a guniea pig for a new unproven design imho


I've mentioned it before, I don't want to be a guinea pig for DI either. The problem is like it or not we are going to be owners of a DI engine at some point in time. Hopefully these threads will be ancient history, and we'll be waiting on the guinea pigs testing the next new technology.

 

[badtlc]

call me a guinea pig. it is great so far and no signs of fuel dilution.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: badtlc
call me a guinea pig. it is great so far and no signs of fuel dilution.


Glad to hear it, report back at 100K miles, 150K miles, 200K miles and let us know how it works out for you, and what you did to maintain it.

 

[ChrisD46]

For what it's worth , Hyundai seems to have a good handle on DI designs and does not have the concerns that VW and Audi have experienced ...Supposedly - Hyundai spent $$$ on their DI engine designs ...search the web .

 

[Jeffs2006EvoIX]

Its interesting to see that in the link the "Italian Tune Up" was used with success. On the GTI forums there are many enthusiasts that track the cars, and what not and still have the gunked up valves. In this day and age it is silly to see this kind of build up. Time will tell, they dont say how often to do the "Tune Up" I may do it once a week and see what happens. I can put my car in 4th and take my commute on the freeway, not sure if it will be 20-30 minutes though, more like 10-15 min, I dont live that far from work. Hope it will still help. Maybe next road trip I take I will just leave it in 4th for a half hour. Those trips though unfortunately are far and few between.

All I do for now is keep a decent Top Gear Fuel in it, and change the oil every 5K miles with an VW approved all. Try the "Italian Tune Up" every so often, and then play it by ear. Its all I can do.


Jeff

 

[antiqueshell]

It would be cool for someone to buy a cheap borescope and periodically get video of the valves to see how the buildup progresses or not with that Italian Tune Up regime.

 

[badtlc]

Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
It would be cool for someone to buy a cheap borescope and periodically get video of the valves to see how the buildup progresses or not with that Italian Tune Up regime.


We already have before and after pics for one run of 3500+ RPMs for 25min. That one run happened after 30k+ miles of build up had already taken place. It got rid of almost all of it in one run. More runs more often would surely do even better.

I have put my friend with a 2012 GTI on a 6k interval for the italian tuneup as preventative maintenance. I'm doing it about the same for my skyactiv. I doubt we'll have the ability to ever see the intake valves in our engines, but I will try and find a local garage or somebody that might be able to help us get images every now and then.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: badtlc

We already have before and after pics for one run of 3500+ RPMs for 25min. That one run happened after 30k+ miles of build up had already taken place. It got rid of almost all of it in one run. More runs more often would surely do even better.



Audi, BMW, and VW are run sometimes for hours on the Autobahn at engine speeds in excess of 3500 rpm and they have DI carbon buildup issues. So I'd say the jury is still out on that. Just google it to see. A hybrid system like Toyota and Subaru uses is probably better for keeping intake valves clean.

 

[badtlc]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: badtlc

We already have before and after pics for one run of 3500+ RPMs for 25min. That one run happened after 30k+ miles of build up had already taken place. It got rid of almost all of it in one run. More runs more often would surely do even better.



Audi, BMW, and VW are run sometimes for hours on the Autobahn at engine speeds in excess of 3500 rpm and they have DI carbon buildup issues. So I'd say the jury is still out on that. Just google it to see. A hybrid system like Toyota and Subaru uses is probably better for keeping intake valves clean.


No. It is not out. Look at the evidence. It has been shown. I don't get why you want to ignore it.

Are there build-up issues if you don't take a little extra time to care for the car? YES! Does the build-up happen under normal operation? YES! Can this build up be controlled with minimal effort and no repair costs? YES! Will there be newer versions down the road that require less effort to control deposits? YES!

As for your autobahn comment, that is absolutely worthless. You don't know what every intake valve looks like. You don't know how long they are on the autobahn. What you DO know is that running the engines hot for 25+min does indeed clean the intake valves.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: badtlc

We already have before and after pics for one run of 3500+ RPMs for 25min. That one run happened after 30k+ miles of build up had already taken place. It got rid of almost all of it in one run. More runs more often would surely do even better.



Audi, BMW, and VW are run sometimes for hours on the Autobahn at engine speeds in excess of 3500 rpm and they have DI carbon buildup issues. So I'd say the jury is still out on that. Just google it to see. A hybrid system like Toyota and Subaru uses is probably better for keeping intake valves clean.


No. It is not out. Look at the evidence. It has been shown. I don't get why you want to ignore it.

Are there build-up issues if you don't take a little extra time to care for the car? YES! Does the build-up happen under normal operation? YES! Can this build up be controlled with minimal effort and no repair costs? YES! Will there be newer versions down the road that require less effort to control deposits? YES!

As for your autobahn comment, that is absolutely worthless. You don't know what every intake valve looks like. You don't know how long they are on the autobahn. What you DO know is that running the engines hot for 25+min does indeed clean the intake valves.


I have seen VW/Audi GDI engines with plenty of build up needing walnut shell blasting that were ran on the autobahn 5,000+ RPM on a regular basis.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: badtlc

We already have before and after pics for one run of 3500+ RPMs for 25min. That one run happened after 30k+ miles of build up had already taken place. It got rid of almost all of it in one run. More runs more often would surely do even better.



Audi, BMW, and VW are run sometimes for hours on the Autobahn at engine speeds in excess of 3500 rpm and they have DI carbon buildup issues. So I'd say the jury is still out on that. Just google it to see. A hybrid system like Toyota and Subaru uses is probably better for keeping intake valves clean.


No. It is not out. Look at the evidence. It has been shown. I don't get why you want to ignore it.

Are there build-up issues if you don't take a little extra time to care for the car? YES! Does the build-up happen under normal operation? YES! Can this build up be controlled with minimal effort and no repair costs? YES! Will there be newer versions down the road that require less effort to control deposits? YES!

As for your autobahn comment, that is absolutely worthless. You don't know what every intake valve looks like. You don't know how long they are on the autobahn. What you DO know is that running the engines hot for 25+min does indeed clean the intake valves.


If there weren't any problems associated with DI then why do these threads keep popping up?

The Autobahn comment worthless, maybe to you. My point is they run them harder there, a perfect environment for an Italian Tune Up, yet they still have problems. So IMO the ITU is still hit or miss, so is DI. But it's getting there.

 

[badtlc]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint

If there weren't any problems associated with DI then why do these threads keep popping up?

The Autobahn comment worthless, maybe to you. My point is they run them harder there, a perfect environment for an Italian Tune Up, yet they still have problems. So IMO the ITU is still hit or miss, so is DI. But it's getting there.


I don't think you read a word of what I said. Nobody said there were no problems or issues. I fully acknowledged there are "issues" people have. But that is still a relative term. I would only consider something a problem if it required repairs. Something needing me to go rev up the engine for 20+min is a minor annoyance at best. You might call that a problem. I'm not sure I would. I would just consider it when someone asks me about a DI car and I know they can't even remember to change their oil on time.

 

[badtlc]

Originally Posted By: Trav

I have seen VW/Audi GDI engines with plenty of build up needing walnut shell blasting that were ran on the autobahn 5,000+ RPM on a regular basis.


That is nice that you took the time to ride with them and verified all that first hand. Most mechanics wouldn't do that.

You should provide some before and after pics. It would be very interesting see how little impact it had.

 

[Trav]

I didn't have to ride with them.
They were German Police cars. The Autobahn cars were not much cleaner than the city ones. Nuff said i think.

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Trav
Originally Posted By: badtlc
Originally Posted By: demarpaint
Originally Posted By: badtlc

We already have before and after pics for one run of 3500+ RPMs for 25min. That one run happened after 30k+ miles of build up had already taken place. It got rid of almost all of it in one run. More runs more often would surely do even better.



Audi, BMW, and VW are run sometimes for hours on the Autobahn at engine speeds in excess of 3500 rpm and they have DI carbon buildup issues. So I'd say the jury is still out on that. Just google it to see. A hybrid system like Toyota and Subaru uses is probably better for keeping intake valves clean.


No. It is not out. Look at the evidence. It has been shown. I don't get why you want to ignore it.

Are there build-up issues if you don't take a little extra time to care for the car? YES! Does the build-up happen under normal operation? YES! Can this build up be controlled with minimal effort and no repair costs? YES! Will there be newer versions down the road that require less effort to control deposits? YES!

As for your autobahn comment, that is absolutely worthless. You don't know what every intake valve looks like. You don't know how long they are on the autobahn. What you DO know is that running the engines hot for 25+min does indeed clean the intake valves.


I have seen VW/Audi GDI engines with plenty of build up needing walnut shell blasting that were ran on the autobahn 5,000+ RPM on a regular basis.


I read about that, about how much does that run and how often are they doing it?

 

[itguy08]

Originally Posted By: sayjac
With the exception of the BG test of a Ford Ecoboost, I've yet to see comprehensive definitive evidence. Because of BG's vested interest, I have to take their results with a grain of salt.


BG's test was flawed for one simple fact - their early build SHO had a known issue with the knock sensor wires chaffing. It affected the early 2010 Ecoboost engine and caused exactly the poor power, performance, etc that they experienced as the engine was sensing knock when there was none. "Miraculously" their cleaning "fixed" it. They also never posted dyno runs to verify before/after and/or their performance claims, just a few handpicked entries. And if you watch their dyno video you'll see they tested an AWD car with the front wheels only, the driveshaft disconnected and the system in an error state (amber stability light on). A very poor "test", IMHO. A trip to the dealer would have fixed it too as it was under warranty. But that wouldn't sell their snake oil....

How do I know this? I've got an early build SHO and had the bum wires. And it's well documented over at shoforum.com.

And BTW: 61k on the Ecoboost with 0 engine issues other than that knock sensor. I'm not worrying about it.

 

[SteveSRT8]

Agreed. BG is in business to move products so expect them to skew the results to fit the agenda.

We have nearly 80k miles on the last Ebooster in our extended family. The other two have been replaced. All have been relatively reliable.

But 61k miles is just getting broken in to me. Check back at 150k or 200k miles and let me know. I'm sure you'll trade before that but I still have yet to see a very high mile example and would love to.

 

[ChrisD46]

What's the recent word on Hyundai / Kia GDI ?? ...I heard they spent a very large amount on GDI research and have a better GDI design than Audi or VW . Hyundai has had models out now for a couple of years - hard to find much input on search sites . Secondly , all I would know to do with a GDI engine is use the lowest NOAK rated oil I could find easily (Quaker State Ultimate Durability), change oil every 4K ~ 5K miles and use a top tier gas . If I still have to do extra things for an engine after that (i.e. Techron will not help clean a GDI engine) ...then a GDI engine is not for me !

 

[gogozy]

I can't buy car with GDI because it does not help me to reduce my fuel system cleanser stash.
seriously, I would only buy such design if i lease the car for now.