Gas prices in 1 year

[Win]

Grampi,

You seem to think selling motor fuels is a lucrative venture.

Open up your own gas station and see for yourself. Around here, it's such a great business that everyone else is getting out of it, and the few that stay tie the venture to some other profit enterprise that can pay the bills for the gas pumps. I only see this trend continuing.

I make about 3 cents per gallon on motor fuel I sell at retail, based strictly on the cost of goods sold. Everything else pays the bills for selling gas. The infrastructure costs are very high. It takes massive volumes of retail fuel sales to even come close to making retail motor fuels sales a viable stand alone business.

Predicting the price of retail motor fuels one year from now is an impossible exercise. It could be a buck fifty or five bucks. Toss a coin.

 

[The_Jeff]

Originally Posted By: Tornado Red


It is called a road use tax, and if it is raised then I want it to go 100% toward roads and highways. New roads, wider roads, repairs to bridges, etc. There are more than enough necessary highway projects to justify higher fuel taxes. But I don't want any of the fuel tax I pay to go for mass transit. IMO mass transit should make a profit without subsidies, and certainly not a subsidy from me.


Mass transit means less cars in my way and more oil in the ground for my kids. I'm okay slipping them a few nickels once a week.

The Onion

 

[Tornado Red]

Originally Posted By: eljefino
Originally Posted By: Tornado Red


It is called a road use tax, and if it is raised then I want it to go 100% toward roads and highways. New roads, wider roads, repairs to bridges, etc. There are more than enough necessary highway projects to justify higher fuel taxes. But I don't want any of the fuel tax I pay to go for mass transit. IMO mass transit should make a profit without subsidies, and certainly not a subsidy from me.


Mass transit means less cars in my way and more oil in the ground for my kids. I'm okay slipping them a few nickels once a week.


Then who is going to pay for fixing the roads, if my taxes are going to mass transit?

 

[Kestas]

Originally Posted By: Tornado Red
IMO mass transit should make a profit without subsidies, and certainly not a subsidy from me.

It's been pointed out to me that none of the mass transit systems in the US make a profit, or even hold their own. They are all subsidized by taxpayers. I guess you could call it "sharing the wealth" so the less fortunate can get around.

It'a also been pointed out to me that, energywise, the average mass transit system burns more fuel per passenger-mile than if every passenger used their own vehicle.

 

[Autobahn88]

Originally Posted By: Kestas
It's been pointed out to me that none of the mass transit systems in the US make a profit, or even hold their own. They are all subsidized by taxpayers. I guess you could call it "sharing the wealth" so the less fortunate can get around.

It'a also been pointed out to me that, energywise, the average mass transit system burns more fuel per passenger-mile than if every passenger used their own vehicle.

Ha. You have been badly misinformed. Even common sense can see that the things that have been pointed out to you are false.

 

[mechanicx]

Originally Posted By: Autobahn88
Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: rshunter
Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I think just about everything is overpriced in the US.

It is, until you start comparing it to the rest of the world.


You're kidding, right? There are few places in the world where the cost of living is as high as it is here...


Sorry, but I have travelled all over Europe and the U.S is alot cheaper in just about everything. Try paying $5 for a can of coke or $18 for a big mac combo at McDonalds. And yes, we in Canada have always payed more for many goods. So consider yourself lucky. Try paying our taxes before you start [censored] about gas prices.


I don't doubt that US made products are more expensive else where. What I'm talking about is how almost everything sold in the US is now made in China and being sold for about what the formerly US made stuff of better quality was. Meanwhile despite US workrs being near highest productivity with the least vacation time unemployment is high, wages, benefits and job security is dropping. Plus we have bubbles, real estate and rent etc. Is imported China products higher everywhere else?

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: Win
Grampi,

You seem to think selling motor fuels is a lucrative venture.

Open up your own gas station and see for yourself. Around here, it's such a great business that everyone else is getting out of it, and the few that stay tie the venture to some other profit enterprise that can pay the bills for the gas pumps. I only see this trend continuing.

I make about 3 cents per gallon on motor fuel I sell at retail, based strictly on the cost of goods sold. Everything else pays the bills for selling gas. The infrastructure costs are very high. It takes massive volumes of retail fuel sales to even come close to making retail motor fuels sales a viable stand alone business.

Predicting the price of retail motor fuels one year from now is an impossible exercise. It could be a buck fifty or five bucks. Toss a coin.


Gas station owners have never been the big money makers in the gas/oil business, it's always been the big oil companies and refineries.

 

[Tornado Red]

If refineries were big money makers, why aren't there lots of new ones under construction?

In fact, I'd like to own a refinery. Can you loan me $5 billion? Better make it $7 or $8 billion, I'd hate to run out of funds before it is finished.

 

[opus1]

Originally Posted By: Tornado Red
If refineries were big money makers, why aren't there lots of new ones under construction?

In fact, I'd like to own a refinery. Can you loan me $5 billion? Better make it $7 or $8 billion, I'd hate to run out of funds before it is finished.
NIMBY's mostly.....and environmental regs.

There was a big uproar in the Chicago area when the BP refinery in Whiting, Indiana, wanted a permit to increase some pollutant discharges into Lake Michigan. I don't remember all the particulars, but in a nutshell, the new level was still well below current EPA regs, but people heard "increase in pollution levels" and quashed the permit.

What chance would a brand new refinery have?

 

[rshunter]

Originally Posted By: Autobahn88
Originally Posted By: Kestas
It's been pointed out to me that none of the mass transit systems in the US make a profit, or even hold their own. They are all subsidized by taxpayers. I guess you could call it "sharing the wealth" so the less fortunate can get around.

It'a also been pointed out to me that, energywise, the average mass transit system burns more fuel per passenger-mile than if every passenger used their own vehicle.

Ha. You have been badly misinformed. Even common sense can see that the things that have been pointed out to you are false.

I think you'd better do a little research before you start calling someone else misinformed. Take a look at something called "farebox recovery", for a start.

I'll even make it easy for you. Here is a PDF, by a pro-transit group, giving the farebox recovery rates for the 24 largest metro areas in the United States. So you understand the significance of them, here is a description of farebox recovery ratios.

I'm sure Kestas looks forward to your interpretation...

 

[Autobahn88]

Originally Posted By: rshunter
Originally Posted By: Autobahn88
Originally Posted By: Kestas
It's been pointed out to me that none of the mass transit systems in the US make a profit, or even hold their own. They are all subsidized by taxpayers. I guess you could call it "sharing the wealth" so the less fortunate can get around.

It'a also been pointed out to me that, energywise, the average mass transit system burns more fuel per passenger-mile than if every passenger used their own vehicle.

Ha. You have been badly misinformed. Even common sense can see that the things that have been pointed out to you are false.

I think you'd better do a little research before you start calling someone else misinformed. Take a look at something called "farebox recovery", for a start.

I'll even make it easy for you. Here is a PDF, by a pro-transit group, giving the farebox recovery rates for the 24 largest metro areas in the United States. So you understand the significance of them, here is a description of farebox recovery ratios.

I'm sure Kestas looks forward to your interpretation...


Well what do you know, I learned something today. Still don't agree with a bus using more gas per mile than 50 cars.

 

[mechanicx]

The problem is that in most city in the US the buses drive around their routes basically empty. I'm sure there is an occupancy/fee level that makes it more cost effective but it's not there in most US cities' bus transits.

 

[javacontour]

Probably depends on ridership. An empty bus burns more fuel per passenger mile than a car with one occupant.

All the miles a bus travels has to be figured, not just the miles where they have passengers.


Ever notice that the Mass Transit folks have a motor pool of "company" cars to get out to various sites. You would think if it were so good, the managers could take the same mass transit to locations where their management skills were needed.

I.E. if you had a problem at a MetroLink station in St. Louis, why would Metro need to send someone in a car? Couldn't the manager responding take the MetroLink him/herself?

They don't, they take a "company" car to the site.

 

[rshunter]

Originally Posted By: Autobahn88
Well what do you know, I learned something today. Still don't agree with a bus using more gas per mile than 50 cars.

You're right, they don't when the bus has 50 passengers on it. The problem is that the buses are rarely filled anywhere near their capacity, beyond the peak morning and afternoon commuter hours. A lot of the time they're lucky if they have just a few passengers on them, unless it is a major connector route. It's those periods that quickly dissipate any peak travel-time benefits.

 

[mechanicx]

I saw a sign on a public bus that read "Fully loaded this bus replaces 50 cars". I thought to myself wouldn't it be funny if I had a bumper sticker that said "fully loaded this car replaces 5 buses" lol.

 

[rshunter]

Originally Posted By: javacontour
Ever notice that the Mass Transit folks have a motor pool of "company" cars to get out to various sites. You would think if it were so good, the managers could take the same mass transit to locations where their management skills were needed.

I.E. if you had a problem at a MetroLink station in St. Louis, why would Metro need to send someone in a car? Couldn't the manager responding take the MetroLink him/herself?

They don't, they take a "company" car to the site.

What, and associate with the unwashed masses? ROFL!

Around here, they use the cars to take bus drivers out to various locations for shift changes. The funny thing is that there is a bus route that runs right by the HQ, arriving downtown in a matter of minutes. All routes run through a one-square-block area and are time released to keep them on schedule. Why don't they come on duty according to their route departure time and ride a bus downtown to meet their unit?

 

[rshunter]

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
I saw a sign on a public bus that read "Fully loaded this bus replaces 50 cars". I thought to myself wouldn't it be funny if I had a bumper sticker that said "fully loaded this car replaces 5 buses" lol.

AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!!!! ROFL-COPTER!!!

Oh, GAWD! The pain, please make it stop....

 

[The_Jeff]

But what if I take the (profitable) subway because I can connect with an empty bus? If they take that empty bus away it makes my journey impossible, so I skip the subway as well. Or what if the last scheduled train home from Fenway park is scheduled for midnight but a game goes into extra innings? I need to trust there's public transit availability and reliability. As we saw NYC transit busses running during "snowpocalypse" they do try pretty hard.

What if your gas got more expensive because the service station owner had to pay the clerk above minimum wage so they could afford a car to get to work because the bus route was lost?

 

[grampi]

Originally Posted By: eljefino
What if your gas got more expensive because the service station owner had to pay the clerk above minimum wage so they could afford a car to get to work because the bus route was lost?


How about if the extra wages for the clerk came out of the billions in profits the oil companies rake in every year?

 

[mechanicx]

Originally Posted By: grampi
Originally Posted By: eljefino
What if your gas got more expensive because the service station owner had to pay the clerk above minimum wage so they could afford a car to get to work because the bus route was lost?


How about if the extra wages for the clerk came out of the billions in profits the oil companies rake in every year?


What, billionaires give up a few dollars so someone else who helps make those billions possible can sqeak out a living? Never, that's impossible lol. Really though unless the gas station was a company store the oil company has little to do with what a the gas station owner pays the clerks.