FRAM Proving Grounds
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Hmmmm...interesting website from Fram. I'll stick with OEM filters for now though.
I have never had a filter burst but have seen a lot of failed gaskets.The test is irrelevant because the gasket will always fail before the can .
Where is the paper end cap test?
Where is the adbv test?
Where is the media longevity test?
Oh yeah , just put out a video on stuff you can pass like the bypass. The media can't take cold start pressures so it instantly goes into bypass.
I wonder if all filters do this?
So every cold start we push unfiltered oil after it has been diluted from cooling down. Nice....
Where is the paper end cap test?
Where is the adbv test?
Where is the media longevity test?
Oh yeah , just put out a video on stuff you can pass like the bypass. The media can't take cold start pressures so it instantly goes into bypass.
I wonder if all filters do this?
So every cold start we push unfiltered oil after it has been diluted from cooling down. Nice....
Originally Posted By: Billy007
Customers want steel end caps. They may be proving that they make a good filter, but they are not listening to their customer base.
Most people who buy oil filters don't know or care what brand it is. I'll bet the metal end caps is one of the last things on their mind. Next time you're in Wal Mart look at how a random person grabs a Fram before an Motocraft, ST, AC Delco. If the demand for metal end caps is enough to hurt their sale, I can see them changing it. If you want metal end caps buy a Fram Xtended Guard.
Customers want steel end caps. They may be proving that they make a good filter, but they are not listening to their customer base.
Most people who buy oil filters don't know or care what brand it is. I'll bet the metal end caps is one of the last things on their mind. Next time you're in Wal Mart look at how a random person grabs a Fram before an Motocraft, ST, AC Delco. If the demand for metal end caps is enough to hurt their sale, I can see them changing it. If you want metal end caps buy a Fram Xtended Guard.
Patman
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Originally Posted By: Silver02ex
Most people who buy oil filters don't know or care what brand it is. I'll bet the metal end caps is one of the last things on their mind. Next time you're in Wal Mart look at how a random person grabs a Fram before an Motocraft, ST, AC Delco. If the demand for metal end caps is enough to hurt their sale, I can see them changing it. If you want metal end caps buy a Fram Xtended Guard.
I agree, I bet if you took a poll of everyone who buys a Fram oil filter, only 5% of them would even know that they use cardboard endcaps on their lower end filters. I'd also be willing to bet that the nationwide sales of Fram filters is probably almost as much as all the other oil filter makers combined! So from a profit standpoint, they have no reason to switch from cardboard endcaps.
Most people who buy oil filters don't know or care what brand it is. I'll bet the metal end caps is one of the last things on their mind. Next time you're in Wal Mart look at how a random person grabs a Fram before an Motocraft, ST, AC Delco. If the demand for metal end caps is enough to hurt their sale, I can see them changing it. If you want metal end caps buy a Fram Xtended Guard.
I agree, I bet if you took a poll of everyone who buys a Fram oil filter, only 5% of them would even know that they use cardboard endcaps on their lower end filters. I'd also be willing to bet that the nationwide sales of Fram filters is probably almost as much as all the other oil filter makers combined! So from a profit standpoint, they have no reason to switch from cardboard endcaps.
Personally I think Fram filters (even the OCD) are fine. I do understand that some want a more premium filter. I think the arguments about material, surface area, bypass, etc are valid. I do not think the paper end-cap argument is valid. There are very good filters with paper or no end-caps and some bad filters with metal end-caps.
Sometimes I think we may all be nuts. In fact, I am pretty confident that for normal use, we could all use dino oil and fram filters with 7500-10,000 oil changes and never have any engine issues.
Sometimes I think we may all be nuts. In fact, I am pretty confident that for normal use, we could all use dino oil and fram filters with 7500-10,000 oil changes and never have any engine issues.
Originally Posted By: Patman
So from a profit standpoint, they have no reason to switch from cardboard endcaps.
I think this is what people on this site fail to look at, we can all agree that Fram Extra Guard is not as good as other ones such as Purolator. If you own a big part of Fram and you can make a product for with cheaper material that still works and can get away with charging a premium price, why would you change it? We can sit here and say how bad it is but, from a business point of view they are smart for making a product with cheap cost and can get away with charging a premium price.
So from a profit standpoint, they have no reason to switch from cardboard endcaps.
I think this is what people on this site fail to look at, we can all agree that Fram Extra Guard is not as good as other ones such as Purolator. If you own a big part of Fram and you can make a product for with cheaper material that still works and can get away with charging a premium price, why would you change it? We can sit here and say how bad it is but, from a business point of view they are smart for making a product with cheap cost and can get away with charging a premium price.
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Actually the majority of knowledgable posters here understand quite well Fram's business model. That's why the biggest point made about the orange can is, with better constructed filters out there for less money, no need to buy an orange can or any fiber endcap construction for more money.
As Fram sales prove though, for the masses, the general public, ignorance is bliss. The link is the current saturation advertising on TV, what Fram does best. And as far as the orange can and tough guard goes, not building a quality filter.
The catch phrase for Fram used to be, you can pay me now or pay me later. Clever. As most here realize it should be, you can pay less for more, or go with an orange can and pay more for less.
There's a difference between not lauding Fram's business practices, and not recognizing them. Don't confuse one with the other.
As Fram sales prove though, for the masses, the general public, ignorance is bliss. The link is the current saturation advertising on TV, what Fram does best. And as far as the orange can and tough guard goes, not building a quality filter.
The catch phrase for Fram used to be, you can pay me now or pay me later. Clever. As most here realize it should be, you can pay less for more, or go with an orange can and pay more for less.
There's a difference between not lauding Fram's business practices, and not recognizing them. Don't confuse one with the other.
Originally Posted By: sayjac
Actually the majority of knowledgable posters here understand quite well Fram's business model. That's why the biggest point made about the orange can is, with better constructed filters out there for less money, no need to buy an orange can or any fiber endcap construction for more money.
You are looking at it as a consumer's point of view. Yes, you can get a better filter for cheaper. I said, if you look at it as an owner or share holder point of view. You would not think of it that way. Why change your product when you can get away with charging a premium price for a cheap construction.
Actually the majority of knowledgable posters here understand quite well Fram's business model. That's why the biggest point made about the orange can is, with better constructed filters out there for less money, no need to buy an orange can or any fiber endcap construction for more money.
You are looking at it as a consumer's point of view. Yes, you can get a better filter for cheaper. I said, if you look at it as an owner or share holder point of view. You would not think of it that way. Why change your product when you can get away with charging a premium price for a cheap construction.
Ahhh~! I saw this a while ago when the site was getting build. They are done with results.
I don't always use Fram, and I don't think they're the "best".
I also don't care if they have cardboard end caps. I've cut open a fair number of them over the years and found the endcaps securely glued. In fact, I found an old one that had been partially soaked in water for a few weeks, and the endcaps were still stuck firmly to the media.
As far as getting a better filter for less money, are you sure? The only filters I see locally for less money are things like store brands, STP, or Supertech. For about the same money, I can get a Purolator, or some of the more common Motorcraft filters. Given the choice, I'll take the Motorcraft. However, if one of the auto parts stores has an "oil change special" with an oil that I like, and it comes with a Fram filter, I'm cool with that. I'd still prefer a Fram to an ecore.
I also don't care if they have cardboard end caps. I've cut open a fair number of them over the years and found the endcaps securely glued. In fact, I found an old one that had been partially soaked in water for a few weeks, and the endcaps were still stuck firmly to the media.
As far as getting a better filter for less money, are you sure? The only filters I see locally for less money are things like store brands, STP, or Supertech. For about the same money, I can get a Purolator, or some of the more common Motorcraft filters. Given the choice, I'll take the Motorcraft. However, if one of the auto parts stores has an "oil change special" with an oil that I like, and it comes with a Fram filter, I'm cool with that. I'd still prefer a Fram to an ecore.
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As far as getting a better filter for less money, are you sure?
I'm sure I can. I can get Purolator Classics everyday at Kmart with no rebate for less than a Wally sold orange can. Now with $1.50 rebate, much less. Better rated efficiency and no engineered media endcaps, metal. P1's bought from Amazon with over $25 order (free shipping) and current $3.00 rebate, much better filter for less. And for those with Advance Auto access, 4 Bosch D+ can now be had with rebate for < $14 and AAP codes. For me it's not difficult to beat an orange can or Tough Guard everyday Wally price.
As far as getting a better filter for less money, are you sure?
I'm sure I can. I can get Purolator Classics everyday at Kmart with no rebate for less than a Wally sold orange can. Now with $1.50 rebate, much less. Better rated efficiency and no engineered media endcaps, metal. P1's bought from Amazon with over $25 order (free shipping) and current $3.00 rebate, much better filter for less. And for those with Advance Auto access, 4 Bosch D+ can now be had with rebate for < $14 and AAP codes. For me it's not difficult to beat an orange can or Tough Guard everyday Wally price.
I know many here do not like Fram but there is no evidence they are an inferior product to other economy filters. Metal end caps are not the requirement for a quality filter. Personally I think the basic Fram is just as good as the Purolator Classic.
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