Fram once again

[RF Overlord]

Originally Posted By: demarpaint
I used Fram filters for a long time, never had a problem. Having said that, after joining this site I learned that Fram filters weren't as good as I thought, and stopped using them. While I won't go out and bash them, I won't buy, or defend them either.
I could not have said it better myself.

 

[webfors]

After seeing one with 20k+ on it, in relatively decent shape, I don't think they are a terrible filter. I certainly won't use the ecores anymore. I have two PF53's if someone wants them for free!!

 

[daman]

Originally Posted By: Autobahn88
Originally Posted By: daman
Originally Posted By: Autobahn88
What about the other post with the pic of the Fram with 20k miles on it. It held up quite well. Again, I am not defending or bashing Fram but the only way to know if a filter is good or not is to collect data on filtering capability, flow and real use, not just speculation and prejudice.

The thing is,is why would you want to take the chance???, we all know what they look like inside that their terribly constructed and weak compared to others so like i said why take the chance,your engine deserves better no??


But are they that bad?? The pic in the other post clearly show that the Fram filter held up quite well for such a long drain. I am sure that for normal drains that any filter will do a good job.

IMO yes!!!,, just look at the construction vs another filter say WIX,ND,P1 etc,etc and make your own judgment. You want to use them go ahead that's your right.

 

[Gary Allan]

Originally Posted By: Autobahn88
Originally Posted By: daman
Originally Posted By: Autobahn88
What about the other post with the pic of the Fram with 20k miles on it. It held up quite well. Again, I am not defending or bashing Fram but the only way to know if a filter is good or not is to collect data on filtering capability, flow and real use, not just speculation and prejudice.

The thing is,is why would you want to take the chance???, we all know what they look like inside that their terribly constructed and weak compared to others so like i said why take the chance,your engine deserves better no??


But are they that bad?? The pic in the other post clearly show that the Fram filter held up quite well for such a long drain. I am sure that for normal drains that any filter will do a good job.

"That bad" ?? "Are they really sticking it in THAT FAR?? I mean, are you really all that "uncomfortable" with it?"

It's price. If the standard orange can were $1.99 to compete with its (arguably) contemporaries in terms of what went into it, I doubt you would hear a peep. People would just say that they prefer other filters over Fram. As it stands, people tend to add a little punitive sauce to the rhetoric since they find Fram rather lame for charging more for a bottom line filter ..and relying almost 100% on brand ignorality (ignorance bolstered by some concept of brand loyalty) ..while taking the consumer to the cleaners in terms of value.

While they don't deserve a bad reputation for what they are, the brand tends to get spit on for what is perceived as low life conduct and (assumed) demeanor toward the consumer.

 

[daman]

IMO....



even @ $1.99 they would be faaaar from worth it,why? the construction vs others,any day of the week i would pay more for a better constructed filter no questions asked.

 

[Vizzy]

Originally Posted By: steve20
Fram bashing because: Ye with little auto knowledge can bash Fram after reading about 15 posts. Then the sheeple say
"Fram is bad" Makes 'em believe they actually know something about what is under their hood
bunch of mo's if you ask me



Steve


Results from EXPERIENCE using the Fram oil filters trumps your unhappiness with the collective experience.

 

[Gary Allan]

Eh? You guys in Canada aren't in the same position we are. You're paying the right price for a Fram. It's the cheapest thing available and the next step up is a fortune.

Again, if it were $1.99 here, I really don't think anyone would be whining/bashing/beatching/whatever. If the next (alleged) better filter were $5.00 and Fram were 1.99 ..there would be legions of people who would step up and say "I don't care. It works good enough for me and my needs" and pocket the $3 or buy another quart of oil.

..but given that the view is somewhat inverted here ..where one can NOT buy a Fram and buy another quart of oil AND get a filter that indeed cost more to make (at a substantial discount to the aforementioned orange can) .....

..you can see where the criticism comes from..

 

[webfors]

Good points Gary. We get hosed up here on filter prices. Fram's are generally cheaper than anything else, especially the rebadged Frams such as previous generation of Motomaster filters.

 

[severach]

I wouldn't pay $1.99 for a Fram. I consider any filter less than $5 the same price because it costs more to go to the store to buy it than the product costs. So long as defects are coming off the line because Fram can't be troubled to do the blow test on each filter produced I will steer clear.

The reason Fram and the holey eCore from a nearby thread can be so bad and the engines that use them still work is that engines don't need filtration at all. Before 1950 when oil was much worse than it is now oil wasn't full flow filtered. I've run oil for 30,000 miles before and other than being black from the carbon some the filters contained nothing of note. The only time there is something important is when the engine is about to go.

GM could use empty filter cans and the engines would last to the first oil change. So few engines need a filter that a few holes here and there won't make any difference in warranty claims.

I think inferior filters, oil, and fuel are great. People run their cars down with superficial problems. I buy them for cheap and bring them back to top shape for next to nothing. If people used good products then they wouldn't have perfectly good cars to sell to me.

 

[widman]

Originally Posted By: webfors
Good points Gary. We get hosed up here on filter prices. Fram's are generally cheaper than anything else, especially the rebadged Frams such as previous generation of Motomaster filters.


Is this why most of the Frams here are labeled "not intended for sale in the US"? And have Canadian and Mexican importers listed?

Doesn't apply in this case, but in most of the Frams I see.

Which is a better buy: That Fram for $4.75 or a Donaldson for $5.00? (plus 19.05% taxes in both cases)

 

[mechanicx]

I still don't like Fram extended guard orange filters, I like Purolators and think they are the best for the price. But I'm starting to think maybe the Fram Tough Guard isn't such a bad filter for the price.

Someone who gets their oil at Walmart and doesn't want to make another trip for an oil filter would be doing OK to get a Tough Gaurd for $5.49. It has a more efficience synthetic based media, silicone ADBV, and most importantly a steel center tube. I'm not sure about the bypass quality but if you have a GM it's a non issue.

 

[labman]

I think the Ecores are getting a bad rap, but many of ST's are still conventional and a dollar less than a classic. AC's and STP's run about the same a Purolator. May as well buy from an American company.

 

[mechanicx]

Most of my vehicles use the PF47 and are all ecore. I don't trust ecores anymore. I resolved to just go with Purolator. Yeah, I liked it better when Purolator was American owned but I also liked it better when ACDelcos were not ecore. I'd just be using AcDelco in that case.

I never thought I'd say it but if I were going to buy an American filter I'd probably go with the Fram tough guard over an ecore and maybe even the orange can. Since the PF47 doesn't have a bypass the cheap Fram bypass is not an issue.

The real problem with Frams is they are overpriced. The tough gard is really not worth as much as a Purolator classic. If they'd get rid of the cardboard end caps and the cheap bypass then the Fram tough gard would be a great filter for $5.49

 

[Big_Ed]

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Most of my vehicles use the PF47 and are all ecore. I don't trust ecores anymore. I resolved to just go with Purolator. Yeah, I liked it better when Purolator was American owned but I also liked it better when ACDelcos were not ecore. I'd just be using AcDelco in that case.

I never thought I'd say it but if I were going to buy an American filter I'd probably go with the Fram tough guard over an ecore and maybe even the orange can. Since the PF47 doesn't have a bypass the cheap Fram bypass is not an issue.

The real problem with Frams is they are overpriced. The tough gard is really not worth as much as a Purolator classic. If they'd get rid of the cardboard end caps and the cheap bypass then the Fram tough gard would be a great filter for $5.49



Give Wix or NAPA Gold (made by Wix) a try. Most are made in America, and are very good filters. Very comparable to the old-style AC Delcos.

 

[daman]

Originally Posted By: mechanicx
Most of my vehicles use the PF47 and are all ecore. I don't trust ecores anymore. I resolved to just go with Purolator. Yeah, I liked it better when Purolator was American owned but I also liked it better when ACDelcos were not ecore. I'd just be using AcDelco in that case.

I never thought I'd say it but if I were going to buy an American filter I'd probably go with the Fram tough guard over an ecore and maybe even the orange can. Since the PF47 doesn't have a bypass the cheap Fram bypass is not an issue.

The real problem with Frams is they are overpriced. The tough gard is really not worth as much as a Purolator classic. If they'd get rid of the cardboard end caps and the cheap bypass then the Fram tough gard would be a great filter for $5.49

If you have the room go with a PF52,same filter just a little longer,grab a WIX or NG,P1,excellent excellent filters!, and stay away from them escares!!!!

 

[mechanicx]

Yeah the PF52 will fit. I have some P1 Pf52s. I have already concluded the Purolator filters are a better value than Wix but Purolator or not American owned anymore of course.

 

[daman]

I know

 

[ahoier]

Can the Extended Guard or Tough Guard filters be used with Conventional oil (say, Pennzoil 5w30 or Quaker State 5w30)? I'm looking for something "better" than the "regular" FRAMs (PH9688). I know on the packaging and on the fram site they have a little comparison chart by the filters, and there are "check marks" for "

I know I started another topic sorta on the same line as this, but this topic fits too I think.

The FRAM site has check marks on "For Synthetic Blend Oil" (for the Tough Guard) and "For Fully Synthetic Oil" (for the Extended Guard) both are checked. Curious if that means Synthetic _must_ be used...or if they are just noting that the filter is "compatible" with syn/blend oil...

http://fram.com/oil-filters/xtended-guard.php has the chart I'm referring to.

 

[webfors]

No, you can use any oil with any of the filters. It's marketing. What they are saying is if you're going to run a premium filter, chances are you're going to extend your oci.

 

[daman]

yep marketing,pick a filter and go with it,but like said IF going extended drains may want to think about a higher end filter.