Ethanol Adulteration

[sarity945]

I was speaking with a friend who lives in a different country. He told me a strange thing about ethanol adulteration. I guess in their country some high profile ethanol producers have successfully lobbied for an increase in the ethanol ratio in gas. Guy is worried this kind of gas is going to negatively affect his favorite toys (motorcycles, cars-particularly older cars)

This is the first time i am hearing of ethanol adulteration. Is he right? How bad is it?

I asked him if they have US products like fuel additives being sold in his country. My idea was maybe they will help neutralize some of the effects. He said yes but he doesn't know which ones to use.. Any suggestions on additives which will work? Thanks folks.

P.S. I wasn't sure where to post this. Hopefully i am posting it in the right sub-forum. If not then may our kind moderator do the necessary correction. Thanks.

 

[Rand]

IMO: First he should test the fuel to confirm the Ethanol %
PS not sure adulteration is the correct word for this as at this time its a normal component of gasoline.. at least at my location.

You take a unconfirmed story from random somewhere with no background info then ask a generic question.. not sure how much
on target or helpful answers are possible.

 

[jhellwig]

In my opinion Ethanol isn't the problem but it magnifies the other problems that already existed.

One example of this is carbs on Honda engines. Everyone blames ethanol for the issues but there are numerous cases where there are the same issues without ethanol.

 

[Pablo]

Water is ALWAYS the problem Ethanol is hygroscopic.

I kinda see this thread, but adulteration means different things.

 

[sarity945]

I used the word adulteration because he used it. That's how he presented the situation to me. According to him their govt has successfully pursued higher emissions standards by holding manufacturers accountable but at the same time they are allowing too much ethanol to be used.

Perhaps we can ask, what % of ethanol is considered too much?

Would you recommend any fuel additives to balance things out? If yes, what are they?

 

[dubber09]

Is it by any chance Brasil of all places? Don't they have cars running on pure ethanol for ages now?

Diff countries have diff standards and fuel choices. I just came back from Thailand last night, their gas stations offer even LNG, Toyota taxi I used on way to airport ran on LNG. You should have seen the size of gas stations prices signs showing like 15 choices. It was interesting to see that about or more than half of vehicles were Toyota, tons of Isuzu and good looking ones, many Mitsubishi, a few Hondas and Mazdas.

 

[kschachn]

Ethanol adulteration would be using a different compound other than EtOH. Such as methanol.

 

[Pablo]

Ethanol adulteration would be using a different compound other than EtOH. Such as methanol.

Exactly

Adulteration is illegal or illicit or otherwise hidden adding an unwanted or even dangerous harmful ingredient

Not the same as purposeful blending

There are some storage additives that can help. But what exact problem are we trying to solve?

 

[sarity945]

Is it by any chance Brasil of all places? Don't they have cars running on pure ethanol for ages now?

Diff countries have diff standards and fuel choices. I just came back from Thailand last night, their gas stations offer even LNG, Toyota taxi I used on way to airport ran on LNG. You should have seen the size of gas stations prices signs showing like 15 choices. It was interesting to see that about or more than half of vehicles were Toyota, tons of Isuzu and good looking ones, many Mitsubishi, a few Hondas and Mazdas.

Pure Ethanol?? From what i am being told that would drastically reduce the longevity of the vehicles!

No it isn't Brazil.

 

[sarity945]

Exactly

Adulteration is illegal or illicit or otherwise hidden adding an unwanted or even dangerous harmful ingredient

I think he is using the word adulteration based on the fact that their existing administration is giving these ethanol contracts in a hush hush way and the other fact is people aren't being given the option to purchase a more 'purer' form of gas. From what i understand this has been very secretive and only recently came to be known.

 

[sarity945]

Ethanol adulteration would be using a different compound other than EtOH. Such as methanol.

Ethanol isn't being adulterated. It is the gas itself which is being adulterated with allegedly by adding higher amounts of ethanol. Profiteering seems to be the motive.

 

[sarity945]

But what exact problem are we trying to solve?

Apparently his concern is the effects of too much ethanol on the vehicles which according to him will not only reduce the gas mileage but also adversely affect the machines and their longevity.

 

[Pablo]

Apparently his concern is the effects of too much ethanol on the vehicles which according to him will not only reduce the gas mileage but also adversely affect the machines and their longevity.

I addressed that above

Water is the problem.

Don’t use ethanol gas in older power equipment period. Plastics may not be compatible

Any newer equipment should be compatible. BUT AND AGAIN the enemy is water. With time there will be water in blend. Brass and mild steel will corrode, the gas will sour

You can add anything to remedy this situation

You can add fuel stabilizers. But these really don’t make the ethanol less hygroscopic. They may add some lubricity and despite some labeling these don’t “dry” the fuel.