Drove a Tesla yesterday.

[97prizm]

The Model Y has been a huge success story. For the last few years it has been #1 or close selling car in the world and it ain't exactly an inexpensive Corolla... Even though it's due for the Juniper refresh, it is this year too. Owners love 'em.

I guess they should fire all those engineers?

Yep. Now it comes out that the way they install the light bar they promised a year ago on the Cybertruck is to the windshield with 3M adhesive. Apparently nobody at Tesla bothered to see how a real lightbar is usually installed.
Cybertruck light bar installed to windshield
When I see this, you don't think your Tesla hasn't had major shortcuts when designed?

 

[AZjeff]

The Model Y has been a huge success story.

JK, you never address the specific topic, which was in this case 3 or 4 different latches in the first year. True or false? That has nothing to do with a huge success story. 97prism does have a point, how hard can it be to make a latch? If Tesla replaces a failed latch with a new improved V2,V3,or V4 latch under warranty then there's nothing to see but if true 4 versions to get a latch right, really?

There's also a saying in poor manufacturing: not enough time to do it right but always time to do it over. I've dealt with that mindset.

 

[JeffKeryk]

JK, you never address the specific topic, which was in this case 3 or 4 different latches in the first year. True or false? That has nothing to do with a huge success story. 97prism does have a point, how hard can it be to make a latch? If Tesla replaces a failed latch with a new improved V2,V3,or V4 latch under warranty then there's nothing to see but if true 4 versions to get a latch right, really?

There's also a saying in poor manufacturing: not enough time to do it right but always time to do it over. I've dealt with that mindset.

My point was, if there were engineering problems, why is the vehicle so popular? Especially as it is an expensive choice. Vehicles with lotsa engineering issues tend to get a lousy reputation and are poor sellers.
In my experience, results count. Every vehicle has recalls, fixes, etc. The bigger question is severity.

So, I do not know if "3 or 4" is true or false. Let's say it is. In itself, that does not make the engineering bad. Perhaps they were sourced from different vendors. Perhaps there were incremental improvements. Perhaps there were incremental cost savings.

My understanding is some hood latches, sourced in China, could fail to trigger the unlatched notification. An OTA firmware fix was issued and no accidents or injuries have been reported.

Again, this is my understanding. I hope this helps.

 

[Vercingetorix]

Everybody around here knows Tesla doesn’t carry inventory.

 

[fdcg27]

Now Jeff, you know very well that sales success does not indicate good engineering, particularly since almost all of these buyers are new to Tesla products.
The history of automobile sales shows many examples of poorly engineered products that sold in significant numbers, at least for a while.
I can give many examples if you want.

 

[ecotourist]

Everybody around here knows Tesla doesn’t carry inventory.

View attachment 242878

When I bought my Model 3 (summer '21) I had to wait for 2 months for delivery. That was considered good at the time. At that particular outlet in Vancouver on pick up day there must have been 20 Model 3s on the lot. By early afternoon most were gone. We spent a lot of time checking ours over before taking delivery (no problems found). It seems there had been a big delivery and those cars were in the process of "goin out the door". All but 2 were the standard colour which was white at that time. That particular outlet had no service component.

Some of the cars in your photo may be trade-ins, some staff vehicles, some demonstrators, and some waiting for parts or service. I understand that during the warranty if your Tesla is disabled and waiting for parts, you're provided with a loaner. So there may be a loaner vehicle or two.

Maybe Tesla has finally caught up with demand - which isn't a terrible thing.

 

[Fair enough]

My point was, if there were engineering problems, why is the vehicle so popular? Especially as it is an expensive choice. Vehicles with lotsa engineering issues tend to get a lousy reputation and are poor sellers.
In my experience, results count. Every vehicle has recalls, fixes, etc. The bigger question is severity.

So, I do not know if "3 or 4" is true or false. Let's say it is. In itself, that does not make the engineering bad. Perhaps they were sourced from different vendors. Perhaps there were incremental improvements. Perhaps there were incremental cost savings.

My understanding is some hood latches, sourced in China, could fail to trigger the unlatched notification. An OTA firmware fix was issued and no accidents or injuries have been reported.

Again, this is my understanding. I hope this helps.

Are you a Tesla sales person? Do they even have them, I don’t know. I know I will never, ever, own one. I am allowed to say it.

 

[Torrid]

Are you a Tesla sales person? Do they even have them, I don’t know. I know I will never, ever, own one. I am allowed to say it.

Fast forward to buying their first Tesla in 10 years. The biggest convictions are the ones that fall first.

I wouldn't be caught dead in an EV 10 years ago.

 

[Ws6]

1 YO Model Y, dual motor, extended range. Went to a retirement party BBQ for my former boss, was talking with a former coworker who retired some time ago and he said guess what he has a Tesla. Told him I've never even sat in one, he said come on then. He had me get in driver side, then explained the screens and about the regenerative braking then said put on your seat belt lets go for a ride. Had to do a 3 point turn to get going in the right direction, he said don't worry it won't let you hit anything. Really? Got going up the street and played with the pedal to get a feel for the 1 pedal driving deal. Interesting. Got onto the highway and he said get on it, I gave it some pedal and it took off and he said no, floor it, so I did. Now I know what everyone talks about. Let off around 60 and it was still pulling HARD. Took 7 miles off the range in a couple of seconds. Best automotive parlor trick ever. Can't imagine what Ludicrous mode feels like. There probably aren't many $49k (-$7500) cars much less SUVs that can launch like that if that's your thing.

So drove it a couple of miles down the road then back. He said hit it again but there was no need. I asked him about the car, did he like it, did he have range anxiety, has it had any problems...he likes it pretty well overall but after a year still some things he doesn't like. The glass roof is just too hot here in Arizona so he got a sunshade and still too hot so got some of that silver insulating sheet that's used on water heaters put between the glass roof and sunshade and that fixed that. Some things in the operating sequences in the different screens he doesn't like. He just had it to Tesla in Phx and had a faulty computer replaced and now the screens are different so he has to get used to how to operate some things again. He took a trip to California and the range dropped so fast in the heat while running the AC and seat coolers he almost ran out of battery and had to detour through a sketch part of a town to get to the closest charger with 2% remaining charge. You start a trip and it shows you your stops at chargers but recalculates as it goes. So he does worry about range. That was learning curve mistake. Also on return from a California trip he pulled off to charge and it wouldn't take a charge at all. It was hot but other Teslas were charging so he had to call Tesla and it was rollbacked to a service center where they couldn't duplicate the problem, it charged up. This required an overnight stay in a motel for 4 people. Something about the battery cooler wasn't set correctly or something so it was too hot to charge. He really likes the safety features (nanny stuff), says as he gets older he needs all the help he can get. He had to ask another Tesla owner at a charger once how to adjust the mirrors, he couldn't find the right screen. Still had to hunt for it to show me. Maybe you just say Hey Tesla adjust mirrors?

I looked it over and didn't see any fit/finish problems that people talk about. The interior is kinda plain. After a less than 10 minute drive I can't say I love it or hate it. I think we could get along with one fine but an EV doesn't fit our needs right now. There's probably a point where you'd just age out of being able to understand how to use it unless you're a computer geek. Glad I drove it but didn't move the needle for me either way.

Lol, and you drove a slow EV. The fast ones will bend your perception.

 

[srfdude]

According to Experian Automotive sales in CA of the Model y and model 3 together were nearly 4 times the next manufacturer, Toy Rav4.
I'm sure thats about right, you can't turn around in CA without seeing a Tesla.

 

[JeffKeryk]

Are you a Tesla sales person? Do they even have them, I don’t know. I know I will never, ever, own one. I am allowed to say it.

Look at my car list. Salesman? People often ask me about the car. The 1st thing I ask them is, "How ya gonna charge?" I am sure I disappoint many perspective EV customers. But if one fits your use case, they are amazing.

Question for you: If you dislike them so much, why do you spend time in an EV forum?

 

[AZjeff]

But if one fits your use case, they are amazing.

What was your use case again?

 

[Brons2]

With regards to the comments about how fast the cars go, our Mach-E is a Premium AWD trim and I can't imagine anyone really needing to go faster than this. Magazine reviewers have tested this trim at times between 4.8 and 5.1 seconds 0-60. You can pull out into pretty much any gap in traffic confidently, that's really the only use case for this accelerating this quickly in normal everyday driving. I actually turned down the drive mode to "Whisper" in an attempt to make a little more efficient as we inadvertently had it in "Unbridled" mode since new. The car is actually more enjoyable to drive in Whisper mode because it's not trying to leap away at the slightest provocation of the go pedal or brake pedal. And it's still plenty fast to blow away from traffic with minimal to zero effort.

If you get a 2024 GT, it is 3.7 0-60, and if you pay for the software upgrade to the "GTPE" aka GT Performance Edition, that declines to 3.3 seconds 0-60. But why? You need slicks to take full advantage of it, I'm sure. I'm sure the GT comes with grippier rubber than our Premium AWD, but still, I can't imagine that it would do 3.3 to 60 without the conditions being nearly ideal for traction with the stock rubber. Any bumps, loose gravel, etc and you're breaking the tires loose for sure.

I'm already at the edge of traction with the Michelin all-seasons on our Premium AWD, a hard launch will break the tires loose briefly. I'd probably be fine giving up a second 0-60 as, 5.8 to 6.1 would still be fast. The torque in an EV hits different, it doesn't need to be as all out fast as a gas car to perform passing manuvers and so forth.

The point that @JHZR2 makes is real, what happens when there are a lot of these out there and people are doing risky maneuvers on a regular basis. Our crash rates have already been going up. I don't have any really good answers in this area, other than, people need to take driving more seriously.

 

[JeffKeryk]

What was your use case again?

CA expensive gas, $4.50 and up for rag. I have solar panels so EV fuel cost is virtually nothing.
If I'm traveling to San Diego, or wherever, I prefer to fly.
I have numerous vehicles.
I like cars that are fun to drive.

 

[JeffKeryk]

The point that @JHZR2 makes is real, what happens when there are a lot of these out there and people are doing risky maneuvers on a regular basis. Our crash rates have already been going up. I don't have any really good answers in this area, other than, people need to take driving more seriously.

No one needs a Tesla M3P, Plaid, BMW, Porsche, Corvette, Ferrari, McLaren, you name it.
But the Bi-Turbo MBZ across the street is pretty darn cool... The better part of $200K maybe?

Most of the risky maneuvers I see, and there are a lot of them around here, are not from high performance cars. Not sure I have ever seen a Tesla driving dangerously. Altimas? Sure, they are the bad boys of the month. And Subie WRX...

 

[97prizm]

My point was, if there were engineering problems, why is the vehicle so popular? Especially as it is an expensive choice. Vehicles with lotsa engineering issues tend to get a lousy reputation and are poor sellers.
In my experience, results count. Every vehicle has recalls, fixes, etc. The bigger question is severity.

So, I do not know if "3 or 4" is true or false. Let's say it is. In itself, that does not make the engineering bad. Perhaps they were sourced from different vendors. Perhaps there were incremental improvements. Perhaps there were incremental cost savings.

My understanding is some hood latches, sourced in China, could fail to trigger the unlatched notification. An OTA firmware fix was issued and no accidents or injuries have been reported.

Again, this is my understanding. I hope this helps.

It's a success because Tesla customers will put up with flaws that Lada wouldn't introduce. It's because of the name, the stigma ( the smugness). So many times I've heard "But it's a Tesla. " which doesn't make it automatically better. In the late 90s early 2000's JNCO Jeans (yes that was the spelling) were $50 dollars per pair to $10-12 per pair for wranglers etc. Were they 5 times better? Nope but all the cool rich kids had them because JNCO. Oh I'll link how poorly Consumer Reports were treated when picking up their new Cybertruck. This isn't an isolated incident either.
According to Consumer reports "
In fact, it arrived showing an error code for steering alignment that the Delivery Center insisted wouldn’t impact performance. Regenerative braking, which you aren’t supposed to be able to turn off, randomly stopped working on one trip. The windshield wiper occasionally starts wiping even when it’s not raining."
Oh they were also handed their keys and told to find their New Cybertruck in the parking lot which was not charged and dirty, this a very common occurrence.

 

[AZjeff]

@97prism, give it a rest bud. This is a thread about Tesla driving impressions, not another bash fest.

 

[RhondaHonda]

With regards to the comments about how fast the cars go, our Mach-E is a Premium AWD trim and I can't imagine anyone really needing to go faster than this. Magazine reviewers have tested this trim at times between 4.8 and 5.1 seconds 0-60. You can pull out into pretty much any gap in traffic confidently, that's really the only use case for this accelerating this quickly in normal everyday driving. I actually turned down the drive mode to "Whisper" in an attempt to make a little more efficient as we inadvertently had it in "Unbridled" mode since new. The car is actually more enjoyable to drive in Whisper mode because it's not trying to leap away at the slightest provocation of the go pedal or brake pedal. And it's still plenty fast to blow away from traffic with minimal to zero effort.

If you get a 2024 GT, it is 3.7 0-60, and if you pay for the software upgrade to the "GTPE" aka GT Performance Edition, that declines to 3.3 seconds 0-60. But why? You need slicks to take full advantage of it, I'm sure. I'm sure the GT comes with grippier rubber than our Premium AWD, but still, I can't imagine that it would do 3.3 to 60 without the conditions being nearly ideal for traction with the stock rubber. Any bumps, loose gravel, etc and you're breaking the tires loose for sure.

I'm already at the edge of traction with the Michelin all-seasons on our Premium AWD, a hard launch will break the tires loose briefly. I'd probably be fine giving up a second 0-60 as, 5.8 to 6.1 would still be fast. The torque in an EV hits different, it doesn't need to be as all out fast as a gas car to perform passing manuvers and so forth.

The point that @JHZR2 makes is real, what happens when there are a lot of these out there and people are doing risky maneuvers on a regular basis. Our crash rates have already been going up. I don't have any really good answers in this area, other than, people need to take driving more seriously.

My car has all seasons and doesn’t spin the tires at all and is reportedly 0-60 in 3.5 seconds. I use the acceleration every day, mostly from a roll, and would be fine with more. I agree the torque and instant nature of EV acceleration is very impressive. It probably makes slower cars feel quite a bit faster due to the lack of downshift and rev. I’ve considered getting a Model S Plaid but am trying to keep a car for more than 2 years. Tempatation usually gets the best of me. A Taycan, EV6 or Plaid Tesla has my attention but I’m holding strong.

 

[Brons2]

My car has all seasons and doesn’t spin the tires at all and is reportedly 0-60 in 3.5 seconds. I use the acceleration every day, mostly from a roll, and would be fine with more. I agree the torque and instant nature of EV acceleration is very impressive. It probably makes slower cars feel quite a bit faster due to the lack of downshift and rev. I’ve considered getting a Model S Plaid but am trying to keep a car for more than 2 years. Tempatation usually gets the best of me. A Taycan, EV6 or Plaid Tesla has my attention but I’m holding strong.

The 19" tires on my Mach-E are pretty skinny, and they are Michelin EnergyX, I would probably get better traction with something else. The Tesla website states that the M3 Performance comes with Summer tires, did you switch them out for all seasons?

As for more fast, more costs more too. The M3P costs $16K more than the base model. Regarding our purchase, if the price was no different we almost certainly would have gotten the GT, but the GT costs $11K more than the Premium trim, and $15K more than the base Select trim. Spending $11K more to get to 60 in a little more than a second faster, doesn't seem like a great usage of money, and my wife would virtually certainly not have gone for it. lol. I don't feel it's really necessary either, in the real world where we all drive.

If you have the scratch to buy a Plaid, more power to you. If you ever wanted to take an EV on Hot Rod Drag Week, that would be the one to take. I hear people have put it on a weight reduction and gotten into the 8s with it. Sounds fun.

 

[JeffKeryk]

My car has all seasons and doesn’t spin the tires at all and is reportedly 0-60 in 3.5 seconds. I use the acceleration every day, mostly from a roll, and would be fine with more. I agree the torque and instant nature of EV acceleration is very impressive. It probably makes slower cars feel quite a bit faster due to the lack of downshift and rev. I’ve considered getting a Model S Plaid but am trying to keep a car for more than 2 years. Tempatation usually gets the best of me. A Taycan, EV6 or Plaid Tesla has my attention but I’m holding strong.

The torque is computer controlled. Can you imagine what all that twist came on all at once?