Differing cleaning abilities for different basestocks?

[Big O Dave]

Do Group II conventional HDEOs, like Delo 400 15w40, clean better than Group III ("synthetic") HDEOs, like Rotella T 5W-40?

And, do PAO's clean better than either of the above?

Or does it not matter at all what the basestock is, as far as cleaning goes?

 

[wileyE]

My guess if one "cleaned" better than the other, the other would have additive to make up the difference. They have to pass the same required detergency test for their rating. If one exceeds the test more than the other I wouldn't think it would be by much.

 

[JHZR2]

I recall reading that delvac 1300s had some group I blended in with its II/II+ basestock for 'cleaning abilities'.

JMH

 

[JohnBrowning]

GIII and PAO's have practicly ZERO natural solvency! SO you are not going to clean a darn thing with either one. Esters are about as good as it gets for cleaning!Natural esters work best as we see with Auto-Rx. Synthetic ester will clean too but not as well as natural esters. Group II has more natural solvceny then a GIII or PAO but you do not usualy get a good additive package with most GII basestocks.

 

[doitmyself]

quote:

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Group II has more natural solvceny then a GIII or PAO but you do not usualy get a good additive package with most GII basestocks.

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John, please elaborate. Are you saying that oils like Delo 15W40 do not have a good additive package?

Thanks

 

[oilyriser]

A mix of mineral 20w50 with maybe 10% biodiesel added to thin it out would probably make a great sludge buster!

 

[Steve S]

The solvency in gpI oils has nothing to do with cleaning, dissolving /holding in suspension the additives is what solvency is about.If oils cleaned why is there sludge? Diester and polyolester clean.Pao doesn't clean.

 

[Big O Dave]

Steve, so basically you're saying that only an ester-based basestock has native cleaning abilities?

Isn't Redline one of those? Who else makes such motor oils?

Thanks!

 

[Steve S]

quote:

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Originally posted by Big O Dave:
Steve, so basically you're saying that only an ester-based basestock has native cleaning abilities?

Isn't Redline one of those? Who else makes such motor oils?

Thanks!

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other than Redline I would be guessing Neo maybe some Amsoil ,Motul?

 

[Big O Dave]

Thanks, Steve!

 

[MolaKule]

Group I, II oils have more additive solvency than do GroupIII and PAO. The GroupI and II oils also better lubricity than does GroupIII.

In terms of natural cleaning action, GroupV oils such as di-esters and polyol esters have better cleaning abilites. The best cleaners are complex synthesized esters and natural esters such as contained in ARX.

One thing to remember is that ALL oil groups still have to have dispersants and detergents to keep engine sludge from building.

So one has to be careful about whether he is speaking of detergency/dispercancy or natural cleaning action.

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/ultimatebb.php?ubb=get_topic;f=21;t=000021

http://theoildrop.server101.com/cgi/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic;f=4;t=000056

 

[Big O Dave]

quote:

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Originally posted by MolaKule:
Group I, II oils have more additive solvency than do GroupIII and PAO. The GroupI and II oils also better lubricity than does GroupIII.

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MolaKule, what does this mean? Are you saying that I and II lubricate better than III? If so, then why use III?

 

[bruce381]

"Group I, II oils have more additive solvency than do GroupIII and PAO. The Group I and II oils also better lubricity than does GroupIII."

Thats a stretch PAQ, PIB and GRP III all have good wear data and respond to additives very well between all of them any difference in "lubrication" value is minor, the higher HTHS and oxidation life far outway any perceived
loss of lubrication.

I supose if you include the old high sulfur Group 1 stocks maybe you could say that they have a higher natural lubricating value BUT NO motor oil or high quality lube is just base oil and any difference is more than improved with AW or anti scuff additives.
Bruce