Conversation with Valvoline tech support.

[stchman]

I emailed Valvoline and asked them about Dexron VI transmission fluid, here is what they had to say:

Quote:

Mr. XXXXXXX, thank you for contacting Valvoline for your automatic transmission fluid application.



For your 2013 Chevrolet Silverado application, we recommend the use of our Valvoline MaxLife Dex/Merc ATF product to meet the Dexron VI specifications recommended by your manufacturer. This product is 100% compatible for mixture or replacement in your vehicle and will not void any new car warranties. Valvoline produces a Dex VI for customers that do not prefer a multi-vehicle formulation. Valvoline Dexron VI will only meet Dexron VI. MaxLife ATF will exceed Dexron VI in order to cover more specifications.


It sounds like Valvoline is now recommending MaxLife ATF for all GM automatic transmissions that require Dexron VI. By Valvoline's words, their Dexron VI only MEETS while MaxLife ATF EXCEEDS the Dexron VI specification.

I gather that they would just like to have a full synthetic multi-vehicle ATF like Amsoil does.

 

[simple_gifts]

I guess valvoline makes a line of marginal products to satisfy certain customers.

 

[antiqueshell]

LOL.....

That is comical....

They care telling the consumer to use a NON-licensed (which means QC is not strictly enforced) version of their product line instead of the correct tightly controlled quality of the Dex VI since Valvoline doesn't offer Dex 6? LOL Seems risky if you ask me.

 

[Pablo]

Originally Posted By: antiqueshell
NON-licensed (which means QC is not strictly enforced)


That's not true at all. I'm not defending Valvoline or taking sides, but stay away from topics where you have no knowledge.

 

[Whitewolf]

Valvoline does have a licensed product but they also have others.

 

[stchman]

Originally Posted By: Whitewolf
Valvoline does have a licensed product but they also have others.


Valvoline is on the Dexron VI licensed list.

http://www.gmpowertrain.com/VehicleEngines/DEXRON-VI.aspx

Amsoil isn't on the list either.

I fond it funny that Valvoline is on the Dexron VI licensed list but not on the dexos licensed list.

 

[RF Overlord]

Originally Posted By: stchman
I fond it funny that Valvoline is on the Dexron VI licensed list but not on the dexos licensed list.
They are not on the Mercon V licensed list, either.

 

[Trav]

I don't understand this at all, it almost sound like they are deliberately marginalizing their licensed full synthetic Dex VI.
Any Dex VI licensed fluid has to be a very high quality fluid just to meet the spec.

I have used the Maxlife in many vehicles as i have Amsoil but if the vehicle is under any sort of warranty its getting a licensed product, period. End of story.
No way in hades am i getting in the middle of a warranty dispute with the manufacturer and a PO'd owner because i used an unlicensed product the a company claims meets or exceeds the spec but doesn't bother to license it.
The only loser in that situation would be me, the moron who did the job with the wrong stuff.

 

[Garak]

Out of curiosity, how readily available is the Valvoline Dexron-VI down south? Up here, Mobil Super is about the most readily available Dexron-VI. I see MaxLife ATF all over, but not their other products. And I think they are going a little overboard in their catch all list of applications.

Are there any applications they claim it won't work in, aside from CVTs and Type F, or is that already on their list?

 

[Trav]

I get Valvoline Dex VI, Redline SI-1, Lubeguard in qts, etc from Amazon. Its about $35 for a 6 qt case with free shipping.
Maxlife is good stuff but in a warranty case the manufacturers reps look for escape holes and if they find one no matter how small the buggers will jump right through it leaving you holding the bag.

At that point you are in the impossible position of proving to Ashland, Amsoil or other non licensed producers that their product actually caused the failure. Good luck with that.
I use Maxlife in out of warranty GM and some Dex spec Toyota units only, i don't buy the one size fits all thing either.
Amsoil in my experience performs much better in more units including Honda and Subaru but again only out of warranty unless i or a family member owns it.

 

[stchman]

Originally Posted By: Trav
I don't understand this at all, it almost sound like they are deliberately marginalizing their licensed full synthetic Dex VI.
Any Dex VI licensed fluid has to be a very high quality fluid just to meet the spec.

I have used the Maxlife in many vehicles as i have Amsoil but if the vehicle is under any sort of warranty its getting a licensed product, period. End of story.
No way in hades am i getting in the middle of a warranty dispute with the manufacturer and a PO'd owner because i used an unlicensed product the a company claims meets or exceeds the spec but doesn't bother to license it.
The only loser in that situation would be me, the moron who did the job with the wrong stuff.


After reading the owners manual, it seems that GM is far more concerned with dexos engine oil than Dexron VI transmission fluid.

Here are direct quotes from the a GM owners manual:

Engine Oil:
Quote:

Use only engine oil licensed to the dexos1 specfication, or equivalent, of the proper SAE viscosity grade. ACDelco dexos1 Synthetic Blend is recommended. See Engine Oil on page 10-6.


Transmission Fluid:
Quote:

DEXRON®-VI Automatic Transmission Fluid.


No mention of using licensed Dexron VI, just Dexron VI. Using a licensed lubricant has never stopped the Amsoil folks.

 

[Trav]

If its labeled Dex VI it has to be licensed just like engine oil that is labeled Dexos.
Notice they don't say Dex VI or whatever is cheapest on the shelf at your local Walmart.

In fact they are more strict on the transmission fluid, they don't say or equivalent.

 

[stchman]

Originally Posted By: Trav
If its labeled Dex VI it has to be licensed just like engine oil that is labeled Dexos.
Notice they don't say Dex VI or whatever is cheapest on the shelf at your local Walmart.

In fact they are more strict on the transmission fluid, they don't say or equivalent.


In the owners manual where does it tell the owner that the Dex VI must be licensed.

As a matter of fact, Supertech Dexron VI is licensed, and it just so happens that it is the cheapest on the shelf at your local Walmart.

 

[Trav]

Originally Posted By: stchman
Originally Posted By: Trav
If its labeled Dex VI it has to be licensed just like engine oil that is labeled Dexos.
Notice they don't say Dex VI or whatever is cheapest on the shelf at your local Walmart.

In fact they are more strict on the transmission fluid, they don't say or equivalent.


In the owners manual where does it tell the owner that the Dex VI must be licensed.

As a matter of fact, Supertech Dexron VI is licensed, and it just so happens that it is the cheapest on the shelf at your local Walmart.


To have Dex VI on the label it must be licensed. Maxlife is not a licensed product and GM could refuse warranty based on that leaving you to deal with Ashland for the repair.

From Valvoline..

Quote:
Valvoline has conducted extensive in-house testing, independent lab testing, and field-testing to support MaxLife ATF performance in the broadest range of transmissions; however, it should be noted that MaxLife ATF is not a OEM licensed product. The respective vehicle manufacturers have neither evaluated nor endorsed MaxLife ATF in these applications. If an OEM licensed product is preferred we recommend Valvoline DEXRON® VI, Valvoline ATF+4® and Valvoline MERCON®V for the corresponding applications

 

[Sayjac]

As in the related post, my first choice here because of warranty considerations would be Dex VI. Again though I don't think ML would harm a thing. Out of warranty, use what you want including ML.

Guess I'm thinking on the remote chance that something should happen wouldn't want to test either GM or Ashland to make sure you're covered. Just me.

Fwiw. Valvoline Dex VI is a full synthetic, says so right on the label.

 

[stchman]

Originally Posted By: Trav


To have Dex VI on the label it must be licensed. Maxlife is not a licensed product and GM could refuse warranty based on that leaving you to deal with Ashland for the repair.

From Valvoline..


This has never stopped the Amsoil folks. They tell your Amsoil ATF is WAY BETTER.


Originally Posted By: sayjac

As in the related post, my first choice here because of warranty considerations would be Dex VI. Again though I don't think ML would harm a thing. Out of warranty, use what you want including ML.

Guess I'm thinking on the remote chance that something should happen wouldn't want to test either GM or Ashland to make sure you're covered. Just me.

Fwiw. Valvoline Dex VI is a full synthetic, says so right on the label.


Valvoline MaxLife is full synthetic as well, says it right on the label.

FWIW, Dexron VI spec is synthetic blend, so IMO both Valvoline fluids exceed the Dexron VI spec.

 

[Sayjac]

^^^^^I was simply pointing out that Valvoline Dex VI is a Full Synthetic since you concluded that the ML rec was because of syn difference to Dex VI. That being the case, that would exclude their Full Synthetic Dex VI which would seem odd imo.

Not arguing ML specs, syn or whatever, it's that Dex VI is specifically spec'd and licensed for this application, thus coverage under warranty can't be in dispute by GM.

All that said, it's your ride, you're comfortable with ML so it's ultimately your call.

 

[Trav]

No one is arguing the point that ML or Amsoil is as good as, better than or anything like that.
The point is, if you are not having the vehicle serviced by a dealer the burden of proof that you changed the fluid at the specified interval and used an approved fluid for a warranty issue is on you not them.

Using non spec products is a way out for them (a universal product is not spec) and leave you sucking wind.
That being said the chances of them actually checking the fluid maybe slim but they might ask for a receipt for the fluid or service performed, thats when they could get you.

Its your vehicle and your money do whatever you want.

 

[Garak]

Originally Posted By: stchman
No mention of using licensed Dexron VI, just Dexron VI.

There is no such thing as un "unlicensed Dexron-VI." It either is, or it isn't. If something says Dexron-VI on it and it isn't licensed, that's infringing upon a trademark.

Originally Posted By: stchman
FWIW, Dexron VI spec is synthetic blend, so IMO both Valvoline fluids exceed the Dexron VI spec.

Having a synthetic base stock automatically means that a fluid exceeds the Dexron-VI specification? What if it were a hypothetical Type F with a synthetic base?

To Amsoil's credit, they don't claim every application under the sun. They specifically recommend in the case of my G to use the dealer's fluid. Yet, Valvoline claims every specification you toss at MaxLife, including the ability to be used in the G.

As I asked already, what can't MaxLife ATF do?

 

[demarpaint]

Originally Posted By: Trav
No one is arguing the point that ML or Amsoil is as good as, better than or anything like that.
The point is, if you are not having the vehicle serviced by a dealer the burden of proof that you changed the fluid at the specified interval and used an approved fluid for a warranty issue is on you not them.

Using non spec products is a way out for them (a universal product is not spec) and leave you sucking wind.
That being said the chances of them actually checking the fluid maybe slim but they might ask for a receipt for the fluid or service performed, thats when they could get you.

Its your vehicle and your money do whatever you want.


Good point Trav, and the same logic applies to oil. Who needs the headache? While under warranty used approved fluids. Or if you have faith the company making the recommendation to use their oil or fluid will back you up, use it. If the car maker refuses to do the work under warranty because you didn't use an approved fluid and its as simple and fast to have the oil company pay for the work, let us know. I'm certain it isn't that simple.