My 2009 Mazda6(6 cyl) has about 70,000 miles on it. I have always used the factory recommended 5w20 conventional oil, but now am considering switching to a full synthetic oil. Should I stay with the 5w20 or is there any benefit to using a 0w20. I live in Michigan and winter weather is on its way. Also, any particular brand? My local HONDA dealer seems to have the best price: Honda Ultimate Full Synthetic 5w20 or 0w20 for about $40, I supply the Purolator filter.
CONVENTIONAL OR SYNTHETIC
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5w-20 is fine.
As for synthetic oil brand, just use a reputable oil such as Quaker State, Castrol, Pennzoil, Mobil, etc... and all will be good.
As for synthetic oil brand, just use a reputable oil such as Quaker State, Castrol, Pennzoil, Mobil, etc... and all will be good.
Ow20 is cheaper at walmart, M1 AFE 0w20 is $25/ 5qt jug
if you go 5w20 , Pennzoil Platinum is one of the thinnest 5w20 that I know of, for better winter performance. Also $25/ 5qt jug at your nearest walmart. Filters , anything made by wix ( carquest , napa brand ) , purolator pure one , bosch premium of running an extended. If running 5k or less, Purolator Classic will work just fine.
if you go 5w20 , Pennzoil Platinum is one of the thinnest 5w20 that I know of, for better winter performance. Also $25/ 5qt jug at your nearest walmart. Filters , anything made by wix ( carquest , napa brand ) , purolator pure one , bosch premium of running an extended. If running 5k or less, Purolator Classic will work just fine.
For $30 you can get 5 qts of M1 AFE and a M1 filter from Pep Boys with their online coupon. A combo that is tough to beat IMO.
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Quaker State 0w-20 at WalMart for $20.57 would be my choice if the M1 deal is not available in your area.
0w20 AFE year around 10k OCI.
On a newer car I just don't see the cost benefit to going conventional anymore.
Less sludge, easier cold starts, better fuel economy, less amps drawn from the battery even makes your battery last longer.
The list of benefits, even small, really add up. If you can get Pennzoil Platinum for 24$ a jug there really is no point in sticking conventional oils in the crankcase.
Less sludge, easier cold starts, better fuel economy, less amps drawn from the battery even makes your battery last longer.
The list of benefits, even small, really add up. If you can get Pennzoil Platinum for 24$ a jug there really is no point in sticking conventional oils in the crankcase.
What engine is the 6 cylinder?
Is it a 2.5?
Just wondering as the Mazda 6 is basically the Ford Mondeo in a dress in the UK and Ford has specced semi synth as a minimum for years (Ford Formula F) but normally recommends Castrol full synthetic.
If you can get Full Synth Mobil 1 for $25 and Quaker State for just over $20 there really is no reason to use inferior products.
Those oils would be $ 60/70 in the UK.
Unless you are getting conventional for half that cost there is no economic advantage is using an inferior product.
Especially when you consider decent synthetic oils last twice as long and use half the number of filters over a set period of time.
Obviously this bit only applies if you are using the synthetic to double your normal conventional interval.
But if you normally do 3k I would stretch to 6k and if I normally did 5k I would stretch to 10k.
Though you might feel more comfortable with UOA.
As I have mentioned before Synthetic oil is very common these day in the UK and saving dosh normally means going for semi synth, never conventional.
This might explain why very few vehicles come under the title of sludgers.
Which seems fairly common in the US.
The last sludger we had in the UK was Saabs with turbo petrol engines, which was cured by dropping semi synth for full. Though I am sure the OCI was reduced by Saab specialists, but I think Saab themselves just stuck with the full synth option and standard interval.
The VAG 1.8 T engine for example doesn't seem to have much of a reputation as being a sludger in the UK.
And it is fitted to several VAG cars.
One caveat with that observation is that diesels are more popular in the UK and diesels probably made up more sales for VAG till the introduction of the new generation of small petrol turbo engines.
The current fad in the UK is engine downsizing.
There is a Passat with a 1.4 turbo engine for example.
And a new Focus with a 1.0 turbo engine.
Is it a 2.5?
Just wondering as the Mazda 6 is basically the Ford Mondeo in a dress in the UK and Ford has specced semi synth as a minimum for years (Ford Formula F) but normally recommends Castrol full synthetic.
If you can get Full Synth Mobil 1 for $25 and Quaker State for just over $20 there really is no reason to use inferior products.
Those oils would be $ 60/70 in the UK.
Unless you are getting conventional for half that cost there is no economic advantage is using an inferior product.
Especially when you consider decent synthetic oils last twice as long and use half the number of filters over a set period of time.
Obviously this bit only applies if you are using the synthetic to double your normal conventional interval.
But if you normally do 3k I would stretch to 6k and if I normally did 5k I would stretch to 10k.
Though you might feel more comfortable with UOA.
As I have mentioned before Synthetic oil is very common these day in the UK and saving dosh normally means going for semi synth, never conventional.
This might explain why very few vehicles come under the title of sludgers.
Which seems fairly common in the US.
The last sludger we had in the UK was Saabs with turbo petrol engines, which was cured by dropping semi synth for full. Though I am sure the OCI was reduced by Saab specialists, but I think Saab themselves just stuck with the full synth option and standard interval.
The VAG 1.8 T engine for example doesn't seem to have much of a reputation as being a sludger in the UK.
And it is fitted to several VAG cars.
One caveat with that observation is that diesels are more popular in the UK and diesels probably made up more sales for VAG till the introduction of the new generation of small petrol turbo engines.
The current fad in the UK is engine downsizing.
There is a Passat with a 1.4 turbo engine for example.
And a new Focus with a 1.0 turbo engine.
Quote:
f you can get Full Synth Mobil 1 for $25 and Quaker State for just over $20 there really is no reason to use inferior products.
Thats true. They almost throw the stuff at you as your leaving the store its so cheap and thats for a 5qt jug at that.
No point in even messing with dino or long OCI IMO at these fire sale prices.
5K full synthetic out she goes, done and dusted. Don't sweat the nickel and dime stuff.
f you can get Full Synth Mobil 1 for $25 and Quaker State for just over $20 there really is no reason to use inferior products.
Thats true. They almost throw the stuff at you as your leaving the store its so cheap and thats for a 5qt jug at that.
No point in even messing with dino or long OCI IMO at these fire sale prices.
5K full synthetic out she goes, done and dusted. Don't sweat the nickel and dime stuff.
I suspect there will come a time when Group III IS the "conventional" oil. That is if the enviroweenies don't ban the internal combustion engine first. They DO love to BAN things.
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Originally Posted By: Falken
Less sludge, easier cold starts, better fuel economy, less amps drawn from the battery even makes your battery last longer.
??? Will syn promote hair growth too?
The average car is not going to see any perceptable difference between a syn and conventional 5W20 unless they do extended drains or short trip in VERY cold weather.
Less sludge, easier cold starts, better fuel economy, less amps drawn from the battery even makes your battery last longer.
??? Will syn promote hair growth too?
The average car is not going to see any perceptable difference between a syn and conventional 5W20 unless they do extended drains or short trip in VERY cold weather.
Originally Posted By: tig1
Originally Posted By: daman
0w20 AFE year around 10k OCI.
+1. This is what I am doing in my Duratechs with excellant results.
This is an example of taking full advantage of a nice syn. Unfortunately, only a handful here do.
Originally Posted By: daman
0w20 AFE year around 10k OCI.
+1. This is what I am doing in my Duratechs with excellant results.
This is an example of taking full advantage of a nice syn. Unfortunately, only a handful here do.
Originally Posted By: Zaedock
Originally Posted By: Falken
Less sludge, easier cold starts, better fuel economy, less amps drawn from the battery even makes your battery last longer.
??? Will syn promote hair growth too?
The average car is not going to see any perceptable difference between a syn and conventional 5W20 unless they do extended drains or short trip in VERY cold weather.
I suppose the fact that sludge is almost unheard of in a well maintained engine in the UK and Western Europe doesn't sway your opinion?
Changing conventional at 3k because that is what has always been done is not a reason to continue to do it.
Not when newer oils, even semi synth contribute to reduced co2 emissions and increase fuel economy.
This seems to be the big difference between US an EU strategy on issues of co2 and economy.
US has gone down the think route and EU has gone down the thin to an extent then moved to synthetic for the rest.
There will be a time when the two opinions start to merge together.
Which I think is right about now.
0w20 and 5w20 have been in some Honda owners manuals for a while, mates CR-V is a 2007 and it is mentioned there as approved, though I believe dealer has used 5w30 or 0w30 as we checked a couple of weeks ago and they didn't stock any -w20 oils in the stores.
But now Ford has introduced -w20 full synth oils for its new Ecoboost engine used in the Focus, they have downsized from standard 1.6 to a turbocharged 1.0 with no loss in performance or drivability. Actually it is a little bit faster. But more importantly it is more Economical.
This is in part due to the small capacity of the engine, using full synth only and using a thin oil.
Would using conventional to the same interval as synth have detrimental effects?
Personally I think it will lead to sludge and rapid engine wear.
Caterhams research has shown that indeed -w20 oils can be used to good effect, but he also has an oil pressure gauge to keep an eye on things.
Using your normal viscosity in full synth requires no such interventions.
Anybody that really believes conventional oils are as good as semi synth, synth blend or full synth is the modern equivalent of those that could not be convinced the earth was round.
I get Mobil 1 0w40 for £30 for 5 litres and think I have a bargain!
Folks in the US can get it for less. Probably not far off half that price.
Take advantage of that is my opinion.
Unless conventional is half the price again there is no economic point in running it.
How many people think that the reports of cars needing Kreen or whatever other engine flush is well thought of at the time is due to synthetic oil use?
Products that clear out dirty engines are much less common in the UK, yes you can get them but it is usually to fix owner neglect, with some owners running oil for several years then selling the car on.
Originally Posted By: Falken
Less sludge, easier cold starts, better fuel economy, less amps drawn from the battery even makes your battery last longer.
??? Will syn promote hair growth too?
The average car is not going to see any perceptable difference between a syn and conventional 5W20 unless they do extended drains or short trip in VERY cold weather.
I suppose the fact that sludge is almost unheard of in a well maintained engine in the UK and Western Europe doesn't sway your opinion?
Changing conventional at 3k because that is what has always been done is not a reason to continue to do it.
Not when newer oils, even semi synth contribute to reduced co2 emissions and increase fuel economy.
This seems to be the big difference between US an EU strategy on issues of co2 and economy.
US has gone down the think route and EU has gone down the thin to an extent then moved to synthetic for the rest.
There will be a time when the two opinions start to merge together.
Which I think is right about now.
0w20 and 5w20 have been in some Honda owners manuals for a while, mates CR-V is a 2007 and it is mentioned there as approved, though I believe dealer has used 5w30 or 0w30 as we checked a couple of weeks ago and they didn't stock any -w20 oils in the stores.
But now Ford has introduced -w20 full synth oils for its new Ecoboost engine used in the Focus, they have downsized from standard 1.6 to a turbocharged 1.0 with no loss in performance or drivability. Actually it is a little bit faster. But more importantly it is more Economical.
This is in part due to the small capacity of the engine, using full synth only and using a thin oil.
Would using conventional to the same interval as synth have detrimental effects?
Personally I think it will lead to sludge and rapid engine wear.
Caterhams research has shown that indeed -w20 oils can be used to good effect, but he also has an oil pressure gauge to keep an eye on things.
Using your normal viscosity in full synth requires no such interventions.
Anybody that really believes conventional oils are as good as semi synth, synth blend or full synth is the modern equivalent of those that could not be convinced the earth was round.
I get Mobil 1 0w40 for £30 for 5 litres and think I have a bargain!
Folks in the US can get it for less. Probably not far off half that price.
Take advantage of that is my opinion.
Unless conventional is half the price again there is no economic point in running it.
How many people think that the reports of cars needing Kreen or whatever other engine flush is well thought of at the time is due to synthetic oil use?
Products that clear out dirty engines are much less common in the UK, yes you can get them but it is usually to fix owner neglect, with some owners running oil for several years then selling the car on.
If you do go to Pep Boys for the M1 for$29.99, check the closeout table first. I found Castrol Edge 0w20 for $2.70/quart.
If you dont hall, using conventional is just fine.
the benefit of synthetic is that cold starts are easier on engine , and also much longer OCIs. Also overtime your engine's wear is much lower.
If the Honda dealer's deal is good , go with that as long as it matches your viscosity rating ( xW-XX ).
Synthetic doesnt hurt anything but your wallet! I would recommend it all day long , as long as its not double or tripple the price of conventional.
use 0w-XX for winter forsure , if its synthetic it cant cause harm unless your car asks for over 10 for winter.
the benefit of synthetic is that cold starts are easier on engine , and also much longer OCIs. Also overtime your engine's wear is much lower.
If the Honda dealer's deal is good , go with that as long as it matches your viscosity rating ( xW-XX ).
Synthetic doesnt hurt anything but your wallet! I would recommend it all day long , as long as its not double or tripple the price of conventional.
use 0w-XX for winter forsure , if its synthetic it cant cause harm unless your car asks for over 10 for winter.
Given the price differential between conventional and synthetic (especially with Wally World 5 Qt jug price on synthetic), it's hard to see the downside to using synthetic.
You're telling me stuff
I already know
regarding synth and conventional.
Unfortunately, no one uses synthetic
to it's fullest advantage, which is longer drains
and better (extreme) cold flow.
Seriously, though, syn is not going to save your battery or offer less wear in 95% of the vehicles on the road. I also don't understand why you're going on the 3K change rant, because frankly, no one changes their oil here every 3,000 miles. On the contrary, while the 3K change is pushed by the quick lubes, most Americans push their vehicles and millions upon millions of them are running fine on conventional.
I have disassembled and rebuilt MANY engines, ranging from Japanese 4 poppers to American V8's and most have been fine inside. Some that had sludge issues had other problems, like coolant contamination from compromised gaskets. I have an engine I'm building for my kid's Jeep - a stroker 4.0L. It had 189,000 miles on it, all with conventional, and was clean inside.
I follow the OLM in my wife's car using discount conventional, and she uses her remote start and short trips like you read about. The inside is like brand new. No sludge - why? Because I maintain it. There is no advantage to using a syn oil in her application unless I find a deal on it. Then I would exceed the OLM to get the most for my money.
Don't get me wrong, I am not anti-synthetic at all. In fact, I use it in some applications. I am however, anti-pipedream when it comes to people with no ICE experience telling everyone that conventional is the devil and will sludge your engine. That's simply untrue.
Originally Posted By: bigjl
I suppose the fact that sludge is almost unheard of in a well maintained engine in the UK and Western Europe doesn't sway your opinion?
This is silly. Sludge is almost unheard of in ANY well maintained engine using conventional OR syn, anywhere.
Some of the posts I have seen on this site insinuate that syn is so far advanced compared to conventional, but given the knowledge I have gained from this site, I would say the opposite. Conventional and add pack technology have come a long way and are not dinosaurs compared to syn (pun intended). IMO, there is only a fine line beyween a 5W20 conventional and 5W20 Syn. Take any two jugs from Walmart and show me a difference in wear & tear for the average guy's use. You won't find it.
I already know
regarding synth and conventional.
Unfortunately, no one uses synthetic
to it's fullest advantage, which is longer drains
and better (extreme) cold flow.
Seriously, though, syn is not going to save your battery or offer less wear in 95% of the vehicles on the road. I also don't understand why you're going on the 3K change rant, because frankly, no one changes their oil here every 3,000 miles. On the contrary, while the 3K change is pushed by the quick lubes, most Americans push their vehicles and millions upon millions of them are running fine on conventional.
I have disassembled and rebuilt MANY engines, ranging from Japanese 4 poppers to American V8's and most have been fine inside. Some that had sludge issues had other problems, like coolant contamination from compromised gaskets. I have an engine I'm building for my kid's Jeep - a stroker 4.0L. It had 189,000 miles on it, all with conventional, and was clean inside.
I follow the OLM in my wife's car using discount conventional, and she uses her remote start and short trips like you read about. The inside is like brand new. No sludge - why? Because I maintain it. There is no advantage to using a syn oil in her application unless I find a deal on it. Then I would exceed the OLM to get the most for my money.
Don't get me wrong, I am not anti-synthetic at all. In fact, I use it in some applications. I am however, anti-pipedream when it comes to people with no ICE experience telling everyone that conventional is the devil and will sludge your engine. That's simply untrue.
Originally Posted By: bigjl
I suppose the fact that sludge is almost unheard of in a well maintained engine in the UK and Western Europe doesn't sway your opinion?
This is silly. Sludge is almost unheard of in ANY well maintained engine using conventional OR syn, anywhere.
Some of the posts I have seen on this site insinuate that syn is so far advanced compared to conventional, but given the knowledge I have gained from this site, I would say the opposite. Conventional and add pack technology have come a long way and are not dinosaurs compared to syn (pun intended). IMO, there is only a fine line beyween a 5W20 conventional and 5W20 Syn. Take any two jugs from Walmart and show me a difference in wear & tear for the average guy's use. You won't find it.
Originally Posted By: docdavid
My 2009 Mazda6(6 cyl) has about 70,000 miles on it. I have always used the factory recommended 5w20 conventional oil, but now am considering switching to a full synthetic oil. Should I stay with the 5w20 or is there any benefit to using a 0w20. I live in Michigan and winter weather is on its way. Also, any particular brand? My local HONDA dealer seems to have the best price: Honda Ultimate Full Synthetic 5w20 or 0w20 for about $40, I supply the Purolator filter.
If 5W-20 is what was recommended for your car in the past, use 0W-20 full synthetic in every season now.
Both conventional 5W-20 and synthetic 5W-20 are pointless if you have a quality synthetic 0W-20 at a bargain price. $40 is a great deal for a synthetic-oil change. I expect Mazda to require 0W-20 for virtually all their new cars in the near future anyway, following Toyota and Honda, if they haven't already done so.
This is not to say that you can't use 5W-20 conventional (or synthetic) of course -- only to say that if you can get it for about the same or slightly higher price, synthetics offer many advantages (cleaner engine, more robust against extreme temperatures, possibly less wear, etc.) over conventionals and 0W-20 offers advantages over 5W-20 (better cold starts and cold-engine performance, better fuel economy, higher-quality base oil, higher-quality VIIs, etc.).
My 2009 Mazda6(6 cyl) has about 70,000 miles on it. I have always used the factory recommended 5w20 conventional oil, but now am considering switching to a full synthetic oil. Should I stay with the 5w20 or is there any benefit to using a 0w20. I live in Michigan and winter weather is on its way. Also, any particular brand? My local HONDA dealer seems to have the best price: Honda Ultimate Full Synthetic 5w20 or 0w20 for about $40, I supply the Purolator filter.
If 5W-20 is what was recommended for your car in the past, use 0W-20 full synthetic in every season now.
Both conventional 5W-20 and synthetic 5W-20 are pointless if you have a quality synthetic 0W-20 at a bargain price. $40 is a great deal for a synthetic-oil change. I expect Mazda to require 0W-20 for virtually all their new cars in the near future anyway, following Toyota and Honda, if they haven't already done so.
This is not to say that you can't use 5W-20 conventional (or synthetic) of course -- only to say that if you can get it for about the same or slightly higher price, synthetics offer many advantages (cleaner engine, more robust against extreme temperatures, possibly less wear, etc.) over conventionals and 0W-20 offers advantages over 5W-20 (better cold starts and cold-engine performance, better fuel economy, higher-quality base oil, higher-quality VIIs, etc.).
$20 for MC syn-blend 5w20 with a MC oil filter at local Ford dealer for my 05 Toyota Matrix. With coupon of course. Another Lincoln Mercury dealer has the same deal except with a tire rotation and uses the MC syn-blend. Plus I watch them the whole time giving them the evil monkey eye.
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