Cleaning up a sludged engine, slowly.

[Titan]

[
Your UOA is showing the oil to be good but your engine is telling you that your OCI is too long or the lifters wouldn't develop a clogging issue in the first place and require cleaning. Your engine is talking...are you listening? [/quote]

Nah...much more likely a random piece of trash/carbon that plugged an oilway. Not so much that ARX had any trouble removing it. Actually, who knows? It may have come out on it's own even if I didn't use ARX! I had a Mazda Miata hydraulic lifter suddenly start ticking, then stop just as suddenly a week later...same type of thing could have gone on in my Gramp Marquis.

As long as this car is getting 26-28 mpg on the highway at posted speed limits, runs very smoothly, the oil stays golden colored the entire OCI, and the used oil analysis come back so good, I'm confident the engine will last longer than the rest of the car.

If someone did have these same symptoms, I'd still recommend ARX for the extra cleaning it does compared to "synthetic" oil.

 

[PT1]

Well I have to agree ARX is a better cleaner. But if you can't watch the regimen then PP would be better than nothing. I had some deposits in the valve cover of my wifes 04 lexus. Gone after 30k with PP.

 

[JohnBrowning]

Just put Auto-Rx in it and let it go until you see it again for it's next oil change. I would put something like Delo 15W40 or Rotella 10W30 since both are excellent conventional oils. Add the Auto-Rx and lit it go. Then next time you see it change the filter and put some fresh dino of your choice in for the rinse wich in this case would be for 3000 miles instead of 1200. No big deal! Even if it sludged up the filter so bad that it went into bypass this is still far less harmful then it continueing to have all that sludge in it! Even in bypass the car will get flenty of oil to it's crital parts.

After the rinse I would a decent synthetic in it that they can not hope to sludge!

 

[JohnBrowning]

Oh their is an alternative that would work slowly Nutrea 131! It is a schaffers product and it was once compared to Auto-Rx in many discussions. You only add like 4 onces at a time to the oil but you do it every oil change. In a vechile like that you would be well to flush it first with a 5 minute oil flush allowed to run for 30 minutes at 1200RPMS. If you did that ever time you changed the oil it would after about 4 or 5 of those make a huch impact on the cleanliness of the engine.

One last idea you could easily add a quart of MMO/Marvels Myster Oil in place of 1 quart of oil at oil change. It will not burn off and itis super mild. I had MMO in my powersteering sytem for like 12 years with no problems once. I have also done 5000-1000 mile flush's with MMO on vechiles that have recently over heated. Own of the A&P mechanics from flight school always added 1 quart to his Ford Tempo's oil change and his F150 I6. He had just under 400,000 on that Tempo and it ran like a top and did not burn any oil. The body was rotting away but the engine was in good shape. His F150 also ran like a top. A lot of old timmer's put a bottle of MMO in the fuel of their AirPlanes to help conbat lead fouling.

 

[kd5byb]

Originally Posted By: rshaw125
Have you serviced the PCV system?? Change valve and clean hoses?


This was a great suggestion! Pulled off the PCV hose and valve. The valve was almost totally blocked it was so full of crud. That really might explain the sludge. I flushed out the hose with carb cleaner and its as clean as it will ever be. Put in a new Purolator PCV and a new air filter for good measure. (also did the same for the wife's Lancer - PCV on it was spotless even with 76k on it! Most of that's on M1.)

I'm getting closer to Auto-RX'ing it. Turns out she's driving only about 5k a year. I thought she was doing at least three times that! Now changing filter halfway thru is a lot easier! When I changed oil in it the other day, it was probably a 1.5k OCI.

She's got a sticker now so we'll both remember when it needs it next...

thanks,
b

 

[kd5byb]

Originally Posted By: kd5byb
I'm getting closer to Auto-RX'ing it.


Okay, y'all talked me into Auto-RX. Just ordered two bottles for it and will follow the "heavy sludge" instructions...

We'll see how it does. After seeing that PCV system, it's got to be seriously ugly in there.

thanks,
ben

 

[Titan]

remember to change the filter half-way through the first Clean phase...

 

[kd5byb]

Originally Posted By: Titan
remember to change the filter half-way through the first Clean phase...


I've made me a little mileage vs. what to do chart. Looks like a change in the middle of the clean cycle and then another one in the rinse cycle.

thanks!
-b

 

[Gary Allan]

If you can, cut it open. If you find it packed with goo, then consider another filter (cheap). If it's filled with visible "grit", then one more filter will probably do it. It depends on what the deposit formation is composed of. Soft pudding, or hard pulverized tar. One is easily liquefied ..the other is not. The soft stuff can literally plug a filter in a very short time. The hard stuff can be more stubborn.

 

[kd5byb]

Hey Gary,

I don't think I'll be able to resist cutting open the used filters! I was thinking of maybe adding in an extra filter change to both the clean and rinse cycles. I guess I'm paranoid.

Actually, I know I'm paranoid. Last night I was pricing timing belt replacement parts. The car has 104k and she bought it used, so we don't know if the belt was changed at 60k or not. I may see if I can get off one of the covers w/o major disassembly and take a look-see.

thanks,
ben

 

[Gary Allan]

I know what you mean about paranoia ..especially about timing belts. My son has a beater Neon, but it is his bread and butter commuter car (about 70 miles total a day). He got it beyond the recommended tb change out interval, but he doesn't know any of the service history. I warned him that he had better figure it out or just bite the bullet and get it done. Then again, reman heads aren't all that expensive

 

[widman]

The right thing is the AutoRx. I don't recomend the kerosene or quick flushes as you can easily clog up the holes and spin a bearing or other damage.
The next best thing is use a good CI-4 frequently. I once took a customer's pickup with heavy (real heavy - 1 inch plug of sludge on the drain plug)and put a CI-4 10w30 in it. Told him to come back when it was thick and we'd do it again. 5 days for the first change, I think the second cycle was 7 or maybe 10 days, etc. Eventually the sludge was gone and we could go for the 20W-50 it needed.

 

[PT1]

Go to walmart and get 4 or 5 supertech filters. Change the first one in 2-3 weeks. Then from that one decide your filter change regimen.

 

[kd5byb]

That's a good plan. I'll probably use NAPA/Wix filters - got a few on the shelf already and need to place another order with FleetFilter anyways. I think they are about $4 from FleetFilter and like $3 at Walmart?

I may also switch her car over to a diesel oil - probably Rotella T. I looked in the service manual - I've been feeding it 10w30 which is good from like -20 deg F to 95 deg F. 10W-40 or 15w40 is rated for temps from 10 or so up past 100 deg F. I was shocked to see how detailed Hyundai's oil temperature recomendations were. They covered temp ranges for just about every viscosity known to man.

thanks,
ben

 

[kd5byb]

Just put in Auto_RX...

 

[PT1]

Rotella t would be a good choice. IMO as well. Much cheaper than the PP and will do as well.

 

[FiremarshalRob]

Only Rotella T 10w30 in my local area is sold at Sam's club in a 55 gallon drum!

I'd like to give it a shot for a good cleaning in my beater.

 

[kd5byb]

Originally Posted By: FiremarshalRob
Only Rotella T 10w30 in my local area is sold at Sam's club in a 55 gallon drum!

Agreed. It's the only place I've found it so far...

 

[BrianWC]

You made a good choice not wasting your time with anything else and going straight to Auto-RX. It's the perfect balance between safe, slow cleaning and effectiveness. I tried practically everything else out there, and for my particular case nothing else came close.

This is especially true for the folks advocating high calcium/zddp routes and/or synthetic as standalone treatments. I never found either of these to really do anything. Has anyone else documented photographically before and after pics when trying to clean up with just synthetic or just HDEO? If so, please post them, as we need to add them to the BITOG vault of knowledge!

I can't say I have been 100% pleased with Auto-RX. Doesn't work near fast enough for me! But it certainly came closer than anything else by far!

Also, word of caution on the kero flush recommendation-I would think to do that right you'd need to do at least a couple of short interval changes after that to ensure the pickup screen for the oil pump doesn't clog. Maybe I'm just being overly cautious there, but....

Whatever you do, PLEASE take us some good, juicy before pics!!!