Changing Brands of Oil in my V.W. Tiguan

[Jimmy_Russells]

Haven't we been down this road so many times...?

I am not a thickie but even I understand oil is ~100 times thicker when cold than when at operating temperature. So it seems to me running oil that is roughly 50% more viscous at operating temperature is not a big deal.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

How is Motul too thin?

I was getting engine clatter - rod bearing "like" rap when warmed. Very Loud.
I've already covered this multiple times in other posts. And the new sump of MOTUL burned off at a high rate where I was able to top off - out of desperation - with a 1/2 litre of Mobil 0W40 FS after a week of running. Then everything settle into place and it ran well with that fill until I traded it a year later.
Just my observation.

 

[edyvw]

I was getting engine clatter - rod bearing "like" rap when warmed. Very Loud.
I've already covered this multiple times in other posts. And the new sump of MOTUL burned off at a high rate where I was able to top off - out of desperation - with a 1/2 litre of Mobil 0W40 FS after a week of running. Then everything settle into place and it ran well with that fill until I traded it a year later.
Just my observation.

So now thick oil was fine?
Sorry, but general agreement about Motul oils, unless you picked up some counterfeit, is that they lower oil consumption. Obviously your engine had issues from get go, and a lot of them.
Mobil1 0W40 is known as "loud" oil, but not bcs. it is thin for sure.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Haven't we been down this road so many times...?

I am not a thickie but even I understand oil is ~100 times thicker when cold than when at operating temperature. So it seems to me running oil that is roughly 50% more viscous at operating temperature is not a big deal.

Why do you think there is a viscosity recommendation On the 710 cap? Just for fun and giggles?
You are only warming up for a few minutes, and the piston-to-wall clearance and valve lash is large at that time and actually benefits from a more viscous oil.

Modern engines have synergistic systems that are carefully balanced to the recommended viscosity. especially the VVTi system that allow large timing variation. over 20 degress - and this is viscosity/pressure dependent.

 

[kschachn]

So now thick oil was fine?
Sorry, but general agreement about Motul oils, unless you picked up some counterfeit, is that they lower oil consumption. Obviously your engine had issues from get go, and a lot of them.
Mobil1 0W40 is known as "loud" oil, but not bcs. it is thin for sure.

You should hear the 2.0 Budack then.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Absolutely okay in the sense it will in no way damage the engine as long as that winter rating is appropriate for your anticipated starting conditions.

VTEC engine yes , IDK about their VVT engines.

 

[edyvw]

You should hear the 2.0 Budack then.

I heard it. Generally EA888 in Tiguan's (old too) are loud engines. I had same engine in CC and it is remarkable the noise difference between Tiguan and CC.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

So now thick oil was fine?
Sorry, but general agreement about Motul oils, unless you picked up some counterfeit, is that they lower oil consumption. Obviously your engine had issues from get go, and a lot of them.
Mobil1 0W40 is known as "loud" oil, but not bcs. it is thin for sure.

You are not paying attention.
The "RIGHT" viscosity.
I'm done with your trolling and back and forth.
I engaged for the benefit of others who may have been reading, but this issue is beaten to death.

The engine was fine. Oil viscosity makes a difference on modern engines, especially those with hydraulic systems

 

[edyvw]

You are not paying attention.
The "RIGHT" viscosity.
I'm done with your trolling and back and forth.
I engaged for the benefit of other who may have been reading but this issue is beaten to death.

The engine was fine. Oil viscosity makes a difference on modern engines, especially those with hydraulic systems

Sure. Until you bought "engine with hydraulic system" world did not know what that is.

 

[KCJeep]

I heard it. Generally EA888 in Tiguan's (old too) are loud engines. I had same engine in CC and it is remarkable the noise difference between Tiguan and CC.

Our Tiguan is pretty loud too, runs great though. My elderly father has a 17 Tiggy I don't think his 17 is as noisy as our 12.

 

[OVERKILL]

The engine was fine. Oil viscosity makes a difference on modern engines, especially those with hydraulic systems

The biggest impact on viscosity is temperature. If engines were extremely sensitive to viscosity they'd self-destruct in Winnipeg. Since they don't, one can reasonably infer that they aren't. Chasing ghosts is an extremely popular pastime on here and some of the ghost stories are on-par with the works of Stephen King.

 

[Jimmy_Russells]

Why do you think there is a viscosity recommendation On the 710 cap? Just for fun and giggles?
You are only warming up for a few minutes, and the piston-to-wall clearance and valve lash is large at that time and actually benefits from a more viscous oil.

Modern engines have synergistic systems that are carefully balanced to the recommended viscosity. especially the VVTi system that allow large timing variation. over 20 degress - and this is viscosity/pressure dependent.

lol🤦‍♂️

 

[edyvw]

The biggest impact on viscosity is temperature. If engines were extremely sensitive to viscosity they'd self-destruct in Winnipeg. Since they don't, one can reasonably infer that they aren't. Chasing ghosts is an extremely popular pastime on here and some of the ghost stories are on-par with the works of Stephen King.

Seems his engine did not like thick oils, but also thin oils too (approved by the way). Maybe position of the moon and stars did not align well too.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

The biggest impact on viscosity is temperature. If engines were extremely sensitive to viscosity they'd self-destruct in Winnipeg. Since they don't, one can reasonably infer that they aren't. Chasing ghosts is an extremely popular pastime on here and some of the ghost stories are on-par with the works of Stephen King.

Warmup and running oil temps are two different things, and many an engines systems are in warmup phase not functional phase when cold.

What happend, happened.

Some may disagree on the mechanism, but the effect is easily notable and real.

Though a perceived "lowly" BS'er, I put many a PhD in their place at my startup due to my acute perception and significant expereince.

Be a Flat- Earther, deny reality at you own peril.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

Seems his engine did not like thick oils, but also thin oils too (approved by the way). Maybe position of the moon and stars did not align well too.

Viscosity tailoring is done by race teams to be competitive. Read about it on MOTUL site in the 300V oil section.

"Approved BTW" doesn't mean you are not being "guinea pigged" as VAG treads new waters

Engine oil: "Not so thin as to make destructive noises, and not too thick as to throwaway power and torque"
It's pretty simple.

Maybe some are too lazy to care, or are just careless, or have no ability to perceive.

And it is undeniable the VW is pushing the envelope to the MIN on the 508 000 spec.
Looking at the reported HTHS and KV100 of typical properties is telling:

RECOMENDATIONS Drain interval: according to manufacturers’ recommendations and to be adapted to your own use.
MOTUL SPECIFIC 508 00 509 00 0W-20 can be mixed with synthetic or mineral oils. Before use always refer to the owner manual of the vehicle. PROPERTIES Color Visual Green
Viscosity grade SAE J 300 0W-20
Density at 20°C (68°F) ASTM D1298 0.833
Viscosity at 40°C (104°F) ASTM D445 38.5 mm2/s
Viscosity at 100°C (212°F) ASTM D445 7.8 mm2/s
Viscosity HTHS at 150°C (302°F) ASTM D4741 2.5 mPa.s
Viscosity Index ASTM D2270 179
Pour point ASTM D97 -52°C / -62°F
Flash point ASTM D92 222°C / 432°F
Sulfated ash ASTM D874 0.79% weight
TBN ASTM D2896 8.3 mg KOH/g

 

[OVERKILL]

Warmup and running oil temps are two different things, and many an engines systems are in warmup phase not functional phase when cold.

What happend, happened.

Some may disagree on the mechanism, but the effect is easily notable and real.

Though a perceived "lowly" BS'er, I put many a PhD in their place at my startup due to my acute perception and significant expereince.

Be a Flat- Earther, deny reality at you own peril.

*deleted*

Don't label people.

 

[edyvw]

Viscosity tailoring is done by race teams to be competitive. Read about it on MOTUL site in the 300V oil section.

"Approved BTW" doesn't mean you are not being "guinea pigged" as VAG treads new waters

Engine oil: "Not so thin as to make destructive noises, and not too thick as to throwaway power and torque"
It's pretty simple.

Maybe some are too lazy to care, or are just careless, or have no ability to perceive.

And it is undeniable the VW is pushing the envelope to the MIN on the 508 000 spec.
Looking at the reported HTHS and KV100 of typical properties is telling:

RECOMENDATIONS Drain interval: according to manufacturers’ recommendations and to be adapted to your own use.
MOTUL SPECIFIC 508 00 509 00 0W-20 can be mixed with synthetic or mineral oils. Before use always refer to the owner manual of the vehicle. PROPERTIES Color Visual Green
Viscosity grade SAE J 300 0W-20
Density at 20°C (68°F) ASTM D1298 0.833
Viscosity at 40°C (104°F) ASTM D445 38.5 mm2/s
Viscosity at 100°C (212°F) ASTM D445 7.8 mm2/s
Viscosity HTHS at 150°C (302°F) ASTM D4741 2.5 mPa.s
Viscosity Index ASTM D2270 179
Pour point ASTM D97 -52°C / -62°F
Flash point ASTM D92 222°C / 432°F
Sulfated ash ASTM D874 0.79% weight
TBN ASTM D2896 8.3 mg KOH/g

I worked on testing of oil for VAG approval and no, you are not guinea pig.
I would go with dealership being able to get rid of lemon.

 

[ARCOgraphite]

I worked on testing of oil for VAG approval and no, you are not guinea pig.
I would go with dealership being able to get rid of lemon.

My lead product Engineer' son does this work a Honda - at least the engine testing. But they still have had major problems as the sequences don't appear to cover all aspect of real world use. So the customer base will be a guinea pigged, regardless.

Sequences should clearly catch shearing and engine noise - if they are listening and not just looking at wear and doing tear down measurements.
As to you second comment; I don't fully understand.
Some kind of Oil Change Conspiracy going on?
I have the VIN for the car if anybody with carfax acct. wants to see and post how its doing

 

[ARCOgraphite]

*deleted*

Don't label people.

With all the grief I get on here ...
Let us agree to having a civil argument, then.
I don't tend to throw insults but i seem to catch .... many.

 

[edyvw]

My lead product Engineer' son does this work a Honda - at least the engine testing. But they still have had major problems as the sequences don't appear to cover all aspect of real world use. So the customer base will be a guinea pigged, regardless.

I should clearly catch shearing and engine noise - if they are listening and not just looking at wear and doing tear down measurements.
I don't fully understand. Some kind of Oil Change Conspiracy?
I have the VIN for the car if anybody with carfax acct. wants to see and post how its doing

Honda is FAR behind VW when it comes to approvals. We had to do year worth of testing that included 3 VW (2 TDI, 1 GTI). Disassembling of engines, measuring everything etc. then sending oil for approval, which is cheap part.
i worked with Motul people. Company I worked for was selling base stocks to Motul, Castrol etc. Motul is one of the most transparent with approvals etc.
Your engine didn’t like heavy oil, light oils etc. It is engine, not oils. You got lemon that had issues that were less obvious with certain oils, and that is it.